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Old 08-14-2008, 02:37 PM   #1
alptekin
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Default ej25 in a 02wrx

what parts are really needed to drop a ej25 block in my wrx?
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Old 08-14-2008, 09:24 PM   #2
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Just the block? Not much... The stock evi will compensate for the displac.... Just search. There is a lot of info on the hybrid build....as far as the complete Sti swap...good luck on finding info ... I'm trying and can't find crap... Good luck either way!
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Old 08-14-2008, 09:56 PM   #3
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For a complete swap, you mostly need to merge the harnesses, drop in the engine, and do the supporting mods.
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Old 08-14-2008, 11:03 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by pheonix991 View Post
For a complete swap, you mostly need to merge the harnesses, drop in the engine, and do the supporting mods.
I'm going to say that you haven't ever done the swap and you have no idea what you're talking about. To do the entire swap to utilize AVCS you have to rewire the entire car, weld in the DBW clutch, switch gas tanks...the list goes on. F that! I myself have done one so I'll break it down simple like so that the spread of wrong information occurs now.

Fisrt off are you going to be doing a hybrid or a full longblock swap?
If you are doing a hybrid it will be a little more simple, and in no way am I saying the swap is hard.

Next this is the link for Element tunings swap guide. I think that it should be stickied, but it's not so oh well. This really is the entire swap, just make sure that you are familiar with your engine.
http://elementtuning.com/technical/ej25_install.htm

This is the breakdown real quick. I assume you will have more questions so just ask them as you go through the swap, if you choose to. What I'm going to say next is all based on you not wiring your car for AVCS, which is what I did. It's a huge pita and I rather get some EJ207 big port heads later anyways. Which I'll be able use the AVCS with using a JDM ecu. One thing that is a huge pita is the timing belt! Do it while the engine is out and make sure you have a friend or 2 to lend a helping hand or you'll be f'd for sure.

Your first step should be to disconnect all the wiring to the manifold, which is a pita so be ready. I say this assuming that you don't have the STi's TGV's and side feed fueling system. You can't use the USDM STi manifold without do some work to it which isn't worth it anyways. This is the time that you want to swap out your old injectors for larger ones. Also if you plan on doing fuel rails you might want to do them no as well. Just so that someone doesn't say it later, fuel rails won't help you make power. They just look nice. Look into the parallel fuel rail setups as well. Besides these things look into getting your TGV's deleted and ported.

Next bolt the completed wrx manifold to the block. Now because our stock EJ205 uses a different cam pickup than the newer EJ series you have to drill and tap the new block to use your old cam sensor. This is simple to do. The mounting boss is the same on both engines, only on the newer engines there is no cam sensor, you follow me? At this point everything is straight up. Yank the old motor and put in the new one. Tie up all the loose ends and get a tune.

If you are doing the hybrid you'll lose the benifit of better cams, but you won't have to do any tapping on the block.

Last edited by domestic_abuser; 08-14-2008 at 11:11 PM.
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Old 08-14-2008, 11:10 PM   #5
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Sorry, I forgot to mention that the supporting mods I was talking about are pretty much all in that guide. Did you really think I was going to outline step by step with like that guide? No, I was just stating the super basics of what you do. If you do it right, I'm sure you can rewire a supera to run on a ej257 if you really wanted to. All you have to do is merge the harness, drop in the engine, and do supporting mods(aka everything else involved). You are right, I have not done my research, but, I know a bit about the process. On top of that, I have no reason to do any research on the topic because I'm not going to put a sti engine in a wrx.
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Old 08-15-2008, 08:19 AM   #6
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So what if I wanted to use the Sti ecu? What all is involved in that?
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Old 08-15-2008, 08:22 PM   #7
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So what if I wanted to use the Sti ecu? What all is involved in that?
it's not that simple, our older cars have a 4 pin ecu and the newer models use a 5 pin to my knowledge. (it might be vice versa) you would need to rewire the entire car to use AVCS.
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Old 08-15-2008, 08:24 PM   #8
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whatever man, just admit you haven't done it and you have no clue what you're talking about. there is no harness merging of any sort, the swap is very straight up.


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Originally Posted by pheonix991 View Post
Sorry, I forgot to mention that the supporting mods I was talking about are pretty much all in that guide. Did you really think I was going to outline step by step with like that guide? No, I was just stating the super basics of what you do. If you do it right, I'm sure you can rewire a supera to run on a ej257 if you really wanted to. All you have to do is merge the harness, drop in the engine, and do supporting mods(aka everything else involved). You are right, I have not done my research, but, I know a bit about the process. On top of that, I have no reason to do any research on the topic because I'm not going to put a sti engine in a wrx.
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Old 08-16-2008, 01:16 AM   #9
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Ok well I have both complete harnesses , motor, pedal, 04 ecu, what else would I need? The motor is an 04....
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Old 08-16-2008, 12:52 PM   #10
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Really that should be it. The 04 is the closest to the bugeye so you shouldn't have any issues.
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Old 08-16-2008, 01:13 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by domestic_abuser View Post
whatever man, just admit you haven't done it and you have no clue what you're talking about. there is no harness merging of any sort, the swap is very straight up.
You could do a harness merge if you wanted to... Either that or just use the STI bulkhead harness and splice in the required sensors for the WRX.
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Old 08-16-2008, 02:58 PM   #12
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You could do a harness merge if you wanted to... Either that or just use the STI bulkhead harness and splice in the required sensors for the WRX.

That was referring to just the longblock swap. him quoting me posting up the the swap guide. Still why don't you explain to me how you would merge the harness to get AVCS to work when the U.S. bugeyes never had it to begin with? There would be no point to do it in the first place. Merging would be to much work, especially when you could just get a standalone ecu.

search for wrinkleboi

he did the entire swap into his bugeye just as I am saying how to do it. maybe you could pm him and let him know he should've merged the harness.
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Old 08-16-2008, 03:20 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by domestic_abuser View Post
That was referring to just the longblock swap. him quoting me posting up the the swap guide. Still why don't you explain to me how you would merge the harness to get AVCS to work when the U.S. bugeyes never had it to begin with? There would be no point to do it in the first place. Merging would be to much work, especially when you could just get a standalone ecu.
In drftwell's situation, he has everything he needs to do a complete swap, much like the GC guys have been doing for years. He merges the STI engine wiring to the rest of his bulkhead harness which will allow him to use DBW, the STI ECU (therefore being able to have working AVCS) and the STI motor without modification. Hell, my 99 RS didn't have working AVCS, or even a stock turbo, to begin with but somehow I have working AVCS in that car. How does that happen? Merged harnesses + STI ECU along with the STI engine.

It's also not rewiring "the entire car" as you stated, just merging the STI engine/ECU portion to the rest of the WRX bulkhead harness. It's about 30 or so wires to do.

Some people have to merge as they live in states where there is emissions testing or they would just prefer to use the stock ECU. Also, for less than the cost of a standalone, you can get your harnesses merged by a professional shop and everything looks and works like would if it were still stock. Less work for you, more business for them. Either that or you can save the $1000+ and do it yourself if you feel comfortable enough to tackle the wiring.

Quote:
search for wrinkleboi

he did the entire swap into his bugeye just as I am saying how to do it. maybe you could pm him and let him know he should've merged the harness.
Yeah, I'll get right on that I was simply explaining that there was another alternative to "the only swap ever in the world for bugeyes and if you don't do it you are stupid and wrong and you smell."
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Old 08-16-2008, 04:55 PM   #14
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So give me an example of what sensors and whatnot would needed to be changed ? Interior sensors such as the tach , speedo, gauges?
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Old 08-16-2008, 05:37 PM   #15
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So give me an example of what sensors and whatnot would needed to be changed ? Interior sensors such as the tach , speedo, gauges?
I haven't studied the 02/04 diagrams, but they use the same interiors, do they not? If so, the STI stuff should plug right in and you'll just have to merge whatever connectors don't. There are some GC guys that swap in the newer interiors so they can do that. If that doesn't work out for you, or if it scares you, look into a harness merge. If you don't want to do that, you can do the way that domestic_abuser said and lose AVCS functionality.

Edit: I have also heard that a separate AVCS harness exists, but I'm not sure where to get it.

Last edited by silentt; 08-16-2008 at 06:00 PM.
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Old 08-16-2008, 06:23 PM   #16
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Iaperformance makes a conversion harness for the avcs.... Not worried about Avcs... Just the dbw system and what not... If the interior gauges are the same and really all I have to do is change out the harness then this swap is no prob.... Just wondering about dbw... Ive got the pedal and the harness ... Hmm I don't know maybe I'm freaking out about easy stuff.... Thanks so much guys! Check out iaperformance.com for the harness... Used on a lot of the v7 swaps....
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Old 08-16-2008, 06:49 PM   #17
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Iaperformance makes a conversion harness for the avcs.... Not worried about Avcs... Just the dbw system and what not... If the interior gauges are the same and really all I have to do is change out the harness then this swap is no prob.... Just wondering about dbw... Ive got the pedal and the harness ... Hmm I don't know maybe I'm freaking out about easy stuff.... Thanks so much guys! Check out iaperformance.com for the harness... Used on a lot of the v7 swaps....

I know there is a harness, but what I'm getting at is you still need an ECU. The harness will work with a ver.7 swap and ecu, not a ver.7 swap and USDM ecu. I give up.
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Old 08-16-2008, 07:55 PM   #18
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In drftwell's situation, he has everything he needs to do a complete swap, much like the GC guys have been doing for years. He merges the STI engine wiring to the rest of his bulkhead harness which will allow him to use DBW, the STI ECU (therefore being able to have working AVCS) and the STI motor without modification. Hell, my 99 RS didn't have working AVCS, or even a stock turbo, to begin with but somehow I have working AVCS in that car. How does that happen? Merged harnesses + STI ECU along with the STI engine.

It's also not rewiring "the entire car" as you stated, just merging the STI engine/ECU portion to the rest of the WRX bulkhead harness. It's about 30 or so wires to do.

Some people have to merge as they live in states where there is emissions testing or they would just prefer to use the stock ECU. Also, for less than the cost of a standalone, you can get your harnesses merged by a professional shop and everything looks and works like would if it were still stock. Less work for you, more business for them. Either that or you can save the $1000+ and do it yourself if you feel comfortable enough to tackle the wiring.


Yeah, I'll get right on that I was simply explaining that there was another alternative to "the only swap ever in the world for bugeyes and if you don't do it you are stupid and wrong and you smell."
Abuser, this is the exact type of swap I was talking about in my first few posts. Still think I don't know ****?
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Old 08-16-2008, 11:37 PM   #19
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I have the ecu...? I'm not trying to use the 2.0 Wrx ecu... I know that avs wouldn't work with that... Is that what your saying? Ok here's my list of stuff I already have: 04 Sti ecu 04 motor harness , 04 dash harness,pedal assembly, wires for the pedal,and I'm going to get the iaperformance avcs kit,...... Anything else I need? And I'm getting the neotronics dccd controller for the tranny.... But we won't get into the tranny stuff....so it should be pretty basic ? Switch harnesses and all that?
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Old 08-16-2008, 11:38 PM   #20
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Thanks again guys for the help! I really appreciate it!
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Old 08-17-2008, 12:10 AM   #21
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I have the ecu...? I'm not trying to use the 2.0 Wrx ecu... I know that avs wouldn't work with that... Is that what your saying? Ok here's my list of stuff I already have: 04 Sti ecu 04 motor harness , 04 dash harness,pedal assembly, wires for the pedal,and I'm going to get the iaperformance avcs kit,...... Anything else I need? And I'm getting the neotronics dccd controller for the tranny.... But we won't get into the tranny stuff....so it should be pretty basic ? Switch harnesses and all that?
If you do the harness merge, you won't need the iaperformance avcs kit. I'd also recommend the Spiider DCCD controller over the neetronics unless you are rallying. The Spiider DCCD controller gives you full OEM DCCD functionality but the neetronics you can make your own custom maps. For 99.8% of people, the Spiider dual mode controller is more than enough, and it's cheaper than the neetronics as well.
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Old 08-17-2008, 04:10 PM   #22
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If you do the harness merge, you won't need the iaperformance avcs kit. I'd also recommend the Spiider DCCD controller over the neetronics unless you are rallying. The Spiider DCCD controller gives you full OEM DCCD functionality but the neetronics you can make your own custom maps. For 99.8% of people, the Spiider dual mode controller is more than enough, and it's cheaper than the neetronics as well.

where can you actually get the spiider controller? I know the Neetronics is like $400ish or something like that. The guys at JDMSPECC4U (vendor) said you can put almost 90% power either to the front or rear at anytime.
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Old 08-17-2008, 06:58 PM   #23
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Sweet! Well I guess thatll be for a different time....just worried about getting the motor in and running...
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Old 08-17-2008, 07:40 PM   #24
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where can you actually get the spiider controller? I know the Neetronics is like $400ish or something like that. The guys at JDMSPECC4U (vendor) said you can put almost 90% power either to the front or rear at anytime.
http://dccdpro.com/ is where you can get Spiider's controller. It is cheaper than the neetronics except for the deluxe model, which is one that can work with the STI cluster DCCD display. Spiider is also #1 in customer service for anywhere or anyone I have bought something from. He is an awesome guy and is willing to go the extra mile to make sure everyone is satisfied and that everything works properly. I have the Dual Mode controller which is $325.

Also, you can't put almost 90% power to the front or rear at ANY time. The 04-05 (possibly 06 as well), the torque distribution with the DCCD fully open is 35f/65r. As you apply more locking force to the center differential, it goes towards 50/50. For the 07s, the ratio is 45f/55r and can go to 50/50.
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Old 08-18-2008, 10:45 PM   #25
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Ok so since its an 04 I won't be needing the immobolizer stuff! Yay! Great news to my ears! So I shouldn't have to change that many wires to do the swap! Yay!
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