Subaru WRC Car "actual" power output?

Jewbaru · 03-13-2002, 03:49 PM

I remember reading a while back, that the Subaru WRC car was the "weakest" of the bunch, so I did a little digging the other day. I browsed to RallyLive.com and looked up the specs for the Impreza WRC Car. They were listed at:

Max power: 300 bhp at 5500 rpm
Max torque: 490 Nm at 4000 rpm (361 lb-ft/50kg-m)

Which is quite a bit less than any of the other cars. So, I decided to browse to the Subaru World Rally Team site, and check the specs they listed. They listed it at:

Power: 300bhp @ 5500rpm
Torque: 60kg-m/4000rpm (434 lb-ft/588Nm)

That's a hell of a difference, so what's the deal? My best guess is SWRT is listing the output for the new car which debuts next week, considering they said they got an increase in power with the new exhaust manifold. Any opinions, or speculation? John? Anyone?

I also checked the specs Mitsu lists for the Evolution on their website with the specs Rally-Live lists, and they're the same.

P.S. The SWRT specs put it at #2 in the power output department behind Skoda (going by Rally-Live's specs for the other cars).

[EDIT] I can't spell!

* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

johnfelstead · 03-13-2002, 04:55 PM

you are wasting your time using oficial power figures on the WRC specs because they all have to lie to be deemed legal.

The FIA mandates a 300BHP limit on power. I dont know why they bother because the way the engine power is limited is by a measurable turbo inlet restrictor.

This all goes back to the banning of GroupB when the FIA declared 300BHP would be the limit for groupA. It's a nonsense to set a limit on power because you cant police that or scrutineer for it.

They are all pushing around 330BHP and 500-540lb/ft of torque. You wont ever get the oficial dyno plots though, just like you wont ever get an F1 engines dyno plot or true max revs being disclosed.

callawayv · 03-13-2002, 05:39 PM

Is it limited kind of like the C.A.R.T. cars, with a "pop-off" valve?

johnfelstead · 03-13-2002, 05:48 PM

Nope, it's a 34mm restrictor that is fitted to the inlet of the turbocharger. It limits airflow, not boost.

What they use in CART is a presure pop off valve that if more boost than the valve is set to is produced that bleeds to atmosphere. CART dont limit airflow though so you can have very high power even with low boost.

Both engines are completely diferent in philosophy of design and use.

ColinL · 03-13-2002, 05:57 PM

the flow limit can be reached at low rpm with exotic turbochargers and engine management, thus the extremely high torque figures jon is quoting.

same reason audi R8s destroyed the field the last 2 years in ALMS... flow restriction is much less crippling to forced induction than naturally aspirated.

Axiochus · 03-13-2002, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by johnfelstead
Nope, it's a 34mm restrictor that is fitted to the inlet of the turbocharger. It limits airflow, not boost.

Yeah, unless you're Toyota. Then, it just has to look like you've got a restrictor, and airflow is limited.

Cigar2 · 03-14-2002, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by johnfelstead
Nope, it's a 34mm restrictor that is fitted to the inlet of the turbocharger. It limits airflow, not boost.

What they use in CART is a presure pop off valve that if more boost than the valve is set to is produced that bleeds to atmosphere. CART dont limit airflow though so you can have very high power even with low boost.

Both engines are completely diferent in philosophy of design and use.

Leads into this question doesn't Professor? i-Club Forums - "Chirping Sound" revisited please...
Address:http://i-club.com/forums/showthread....hreadid=155234

And why it's important to the performance of the motor in the car's. Basically has per Professor John's teaching's.
The blow-off valve/wastegate (whatever term you want to use) is there to prevent the air going into the turbo from going supersonic.
And thus cause and "Unstart" (a term from a problem with the SR-71 Blackbird engines at high speed) or a stall of the turbo blade.
Then adding to that the "bang-bang" system and how that works all together.

samowrx · 03-14-2002, 12:39 AM

in wrc you don't look at hp to determine which car is faster. the straightaways are so short that you'll never hit top speed so it doesn't even matter. TORQUE and a good driver determines performance in wrc cars

In2Deep · 03-14-2002, 05:10 AM

Look at what the US Rally Team car does with a bigger restrictor

03-13-2002, 03:49 PM	#1
Jewbaru Scooby Specialist Member#: 1994 Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: "Teh Hebro Town"	Subaru WRC Car "actual" power output? I remember reading a while back, that the Subaru WRC car was the "weakest" of the bunch, so I did a little digging the other day. I browsed to RallyLive.com and looked up the specs for the Impreza WRC Car. They were listed at: Max power: 300 bhp at 5500 rpm Max torque: 490 Nm at 4000 rpm (361 lb-ft/50kg-m) Which is quite a bit less than any of the other cars. So, I decided to browse to the Subaru World Rally Team site, and check the specs they listed. They listed it at: Power: 300bhp @ 5500rpm Torque: 60kg-m/4000rpm (434 lb-ft/588Nm) That's a hell of a difference, so what's the deal? My best guess is SWRT is listing the output for the new car which debuts next week, considering they said they got an increase in power with the new exhaust manifold. Any opinions, or speculation? John? Anyone? I also checked the specs Mitsu lists for the Evolution on their website with the specs Rally-Live lists, and they're the same. P.S. The SWRT specs put it at #2 in the power output department behind Skoda (going by Rally-Live's specs for the other cars). [EDIT] I can't spell! * Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

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03-13-2002, 04:55 PM	#2
johnfelstead Scooby Specialist Member#: 856 Join Date: Feb 2000 Chapter/Region: International Location: Hampshire, England, UK Vehicle: 2005 JDM STi Black	you are wasting your time using oficial power figures on the WRC specs because they all have to lie to be deemed legal. The FIA mandates a 300BHP limit on power. I dont know why they bother because the way the engine power is limited is by a measurable turbo inlet restrictor. This all goes back to the banning of GroupB when the FIA declared 300BHP would be the limit for groupA. It's a nonsense to set a limit on power because you cant police that or scrutineer for it. They are all pushing around 330BHP and 500-540lb/ft of torque. You wont ever get the oficial dyno plots though, just like you wont ever get an F1 engines dyno plot or true max revs being disclosed.

03-13-2002, 05:39 PM	#3
callawayv Scooby Newbie Member#: 11732 Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Seattle Washington Vehicle: 1987 RX White w/blue	Is it limited kind of like the C.A.R.T. cars, with a "pop-off" valve?

03-13-2002, 05:48 PM	#4
johnfelstead Scooby Specialist Member#: 856 Join Date: Feb 2000 Chapter/Region: International Location: Hampshire, England, UK Vehicle: 2005 JDM STi Black	Nope, it's a 34mm restrictor that is fitted to the inlet of the turbocharger. It limits airflow, not boost. What they use in CART is a presure pop off valve that if more boost than the valve is set to is produced that bleeds to atmosphere. CART dont limit airflow though so you can have very high power even with low boost. Both engines are completely diferent in philosophy of design and use.

03-13-2002, 05:57 PM	#5
ColinL Scooby Guru Member#: 114 Join Date: Jul 1999 Chapter/Region: MWSOC Location: Wichita, KS and Whoring, OT Vehicle: '03 Evo, Rice White '01 Erion CBR 929	the flow limit can be reached at low rpm with exotic turbochargers and engine management, thus the extremely high torque figures jon is quoting. same reason audi R8s destroyed the field the last 2 years in ALMS... flow restriction is much less crippling to forced induction than naturally aspirated.

03-14-2002, 12:39 AM	#8
samowrx Scooby Specialist Member#: 8403 Join Date: Jul 2001	in wrc you don't look at hp to determine which car is faster. the straightaways are so short that you'll never hit top speed so it doesn't even matter. TORQUE and a good driver determines performance in wrc cars

03-14-2002, 05:10 AM	#9
In2Deep Scooby Specialist Member#: 10651 Join Date: Sep 2001 Chapter/Region: SWIC Location: www.PoweredbyMario.com Vehicle: 2013 WRX - Silver HB 04STI(sold) 06STI(sold)	Look at what the US Rally Team car does with a bigger restrictor