Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Sunday July 13, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > Motorsports

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-11-2008, 10:04 PM   #1
illini_wrx
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 155844
Join Date: Aug 2007
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Arctic Circle
Default auto-x: Can a WRX be competitive in SM?

I did all my modding before getting in to auto-x, and I'm currently in SM, but I'm not competitive at all. So I have a huge dilemma as to what class I should run in: STU vs. ESP vs. SM. Here's my relevant mod list.

Code:
Catless TBE,
Catless Up-pipe,
44mm Tial External Wastegate, 
APS TMIC
GM Boost Solenoid
stock td04 - AccessPort tuned to 20psi peak boost
H6 rear brake upgrade (bigger rotors)
17x9 wheels, 245 tires (>140 tread rating)
STi lateral links + box-style endlinks
What would it take to be competitive in SM? Or should I ditch the EWG and go back to ESP?

Thanks for all your help!
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
illini_wrx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2008, 10:57 PM   #2
Boxologist
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 21118
Join Date: Jul 2002
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: LI, NY
Default

nationally u have no chance. Locally it depends on your skill and ur competetion. get better and go to a starter set of Rcomps(ie NT01,RA1,R888) and see if STU or ESP is better for u. u may be a td05/1 year of experience/Rcomps away from being a good car for your region.
Boxologist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2008, 11:44 PM   #3
Davidss
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 27446
Join Date: Oct 2002
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: DFW
Default

I would take some parts off and go to stx.
Davidss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2008, 11:55 PM   #4
illini_wrx
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 155844
Join Date: Aug 2007
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Arctic Circle
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davidss View Post
I would take some parts off and go to stx.
my wheels and tires keep me out of STX, and they were too expensive (and too pretty ) to sell.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxologist View Post
nationally u have no chance.
well what would it take to have a chance? that's what i'm trying to get at here.

are we talking full on time-attack car, completely gutted, with a 2.5L race engine swap, trans swap with shorter gears, and massive wheels/tires? or are you saying that even a ridiculously modded WRX can't compete in SM nationally?
illini_wrx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 12:00 AM   #5
mofugga
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 19540
Join Date: Jun 2002
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Clearwater, FL
Vehicle:
2000 old skool RS
BRP

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by illini_wrx View Post
my wheels and tires keep me out of STX, and they were too expensive (and too pretty ) to sell.

well what would it take to have a chance? that's what i'm trying to get at here.

are we talking full on time-attack car, completely gutted, with a 2.5L race engine swap, trans swap with shorter gears, and massive wheels/tires? or are you saying that even a ridiculously modded WRX can't compete in SM nationally?
boatloads of money and talent and you got a shot.
mofugga is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 12:10 AM   #6
bl_easy
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 91407
Join Date: Jul 2005
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: the souf
Vehicle:
Ver. 2 WRX STi wagon
but it's a bucket

Default

SM = money pit class

Having said that, a 2002 WRX made 10th place in the 2006 Topeka National event

Last edited by bl_easy; 11-12-2008 at 12:24 AM.
bl_easy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 12:26 AM   #7
808-wrx
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 151703
Join Date: Jun 2007
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: bremerton Washington
Vehicle:
2002 wrx 6speed son!
WRB

Default

why did you get a 44mm ewg for a stock turbo??? Their is no point.
808-wrx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 12:40 AM   #8
illini_wrx
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 155844
Join Date: Aug 2007
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Arctic Circle
Default

so after flipping through the scca rule book, it looks like a 2.5L swap isn't even legal in SM... can someone verify this? it says that engines have to be "factory options" and the 257 obviously wasn't. does that also mean no 207 swap either?


Quote:
Originally Posted by 808-wrx View Post
why did you get a 44mm ewg for a stock turbo??? Their is no point.
at the time i was planning on going 16/18G, plus i wouldn't have saved any money downgrading the kit to a 38
illini_wrx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 03:19 AM   #9
S1MPSONS
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 90357
Join Date: Jul 2005
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: www.HamfistRacing.com / NYC
Vehicle:
2006 Corey's EVO
& 1993 Mazda RX7

Default

You can put any Subaru motor in a Subaru for SM.
S1MPSONS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 08:22 AM   #10
digitalseance
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 104400
Join Date: Jan 2006
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: SouthSide Jax, FL
Vehicle:
169k mile race car
Black

Default

iLLini_wrx,

The Champaign County Sports Car Club has a LOT of tough drivers. I just relocated away from Bloomington about 6 months ago and I'm the former webmaster and wrote the online registration application that you most likely used to register for the Rantoul events.

Craig (red evo) is dominating in SM and you'll never catch him. When Andy comes (black STi from TN) he's really quick too but he's catchable since he doesn't run R-comps. ESP's main competition is Dennis (grey camaro) and he's easily beaten. Barney (blue camaro) will occasionaly come down from Joliet to run and he's really quick. After 2 years of racing, I finally started beating him but it took hoosiers and very stiff springs.

My advice would be to undo the EWG and get some v710s and stick to ESP. ESP in CCSCC/CIR events is a lot of fun and you'll be competing for year end points right off the bat if you decide to run a lot of events. If you go to Chicago region, then you're on your own. You'll be up against some VERY fast drivers and fully prepped pony cars that would smoke me on a regular basis.

-Philip

From Rantoul:

Last edited by digitalseance; 11-12-2008 at 08:28 AM.
digitalseance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 09:09 AM   #11
Turn in Concepts
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 93646
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Vehicle:
Many Track Records
Let us help you go fast!

Default

We are prepping an 04 wrx for nationals in SM this year. It will be making about 430whp with big slicks and way too much into the suspension. We don't think we even have a chance with that setup....if that tells you anything.
Turn in Concepts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 10:19 AM   #12
Chiketkd
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 71634
Join Date: Sep 2004
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: C-Ville, VA
Vehicle:
In hibernation...

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bl_easy View Post
SM = money pit class

Having said that, a 2002 WRX made 10th place in the 2006 Topeka National event
That was my buddy Jose (pacobeagle) who finished 10th that year.

To the OP, SM is a money pit. To have a competitive car you need diffs, weight reduction (to get to minimum weight), wide wheels & big r-comps, coilover suspension, engine/turbo upgrades....and that's just the basics.

These are two pics of a nationally competitive STi that Navid campaigned last season:





People typically put at least 20-30K into a car to make it reasonably competitive. Others like Vic Sias (E36 BMW M3), have much, much more into their cars.
Chiketkd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 12:08 PM   #13
ratt_finkel
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 46218
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Dallas, Tejas
Vehicle:
06 EVO 9
Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiketkd View Post

People typically put at least 20-30K into a car to make it reasonably competitive. Others like Vic Sias (E36 BMW M3), have much, much more into their cars.
That sounds about right for SP. SM would be even more
ratt_finkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 12:18 PM   #14
Ralliart4
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 135927
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: San AntonioTX/kingston Jamaica
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza WRX RA
PSM

Default

HOLY CRAP!! And many of us rally guys thought the transition from g.n to gp.a was a huge gap. F'in hell because I have a FMIC now im in SM from STX and trust me its a whole different world worth of pain....

On another note if it takes 400whp to be competitive then i might as well go for it all or sell my car lol. Paco where are you man i need your jedi force.
Ralliart4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 12:20 PM   #15
Mechie3
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 120152
Join Date: Jul 2006
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Indy
Default

^^ Mm...not so much.

I've only put about $11K into my car (including a new engine, not including cost of the car) and am very competitive in ESP. Regionally the car can (and often does) beat all of the SM cars in raw time. Part of it is I buy almost all of my parts used when possible.

Nationally I didn't do so well (it's only my second year of AX) but my co driver coned away both FTD's for the class at SEAD (it was his first time driving my car btw). Still, with bigger tires and stiffer springs (both of which wouldn't have cost that much more if I got them the first time around) we both could easily have done much better. Most people were on 275's or larger for SEAD, we were on 245's with street coils and keeping up.

OP, Not sure if the lateral links are a legal upgrade. Also, you can do the 2.5 swap in ESP as part of the update backdate rule.

Chiket, any specs on that STI in terms of tires, the bodykit, etc? That looks mean.
Mechie3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 12:31 PM   #16
scobaru
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 31345
Join Date: Dec 2002
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Wisconsin
Vehicle:
05 LGT, GC8, NA
blue, white, blue

Default

if your still some what new to autocrossing I'd try to slim down to STX And get rides with people who are going faster to you and pick up some pointers. Lateral links are allowed in the ST classes
scobaru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 12:53 PM   #17
Chiketkd
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 71634
Join Date: Sep 2004
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: C-Ville, VA
Vehicle:
In hibernation...

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechie3 View Post
Chiket, any specs on that STI in terms of tires, the bodykit, etc? That looks mean.
Not sure - Navid Kahangi never really discussed his set-up much on here. Some west coast folks might be able to fill in some blanks though. He did well with the car at El Toro Pro solo in '07 (beat Sias for the win) and trophied at the Pro Finale, but then had engine issues and couldn't run in SM @ Nats. Ended up running in XP on a rebuilt motor and trophied in XP iirc...

I think he goes by the screen name Navid on here. Last I heard, he was taking a break from solo.
Chiketkd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 01:12 PM   #18
digitalseance
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 104400
Join Date: Jan 2006
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: SouthSide Jax, FL
Vehicle:
169k mile race car
Black

Default

Having run in the same region as the OP, there isn't anyone to ride with in STX, STU. The one, and virtually only one, to ride with is Russ Bedford in his SS C5 Z06. Chris isn't running a powerful car next year (switched to GS) so although he'd be a great person to ride with, he's not going to be in a car powerful enough to get a decent idea. Virtually everyone else, with only a few exceptions, isn't even divisionally competitive.

To the OP:
Russ will be out there this weekend. Go and ride with him on every run. He is really good about taking passengers unless his daughter is codriving.
digitalseance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 01:22 PM   #19
smurfwrx
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 151928
Join Date: Jun 2007
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Columbia, SC
Vehicle:
09 Triumph S3

Default

man.... this blows! I'm participating in my first-ever auto-x this Saturday in my stage2-ish bugeye in SM (PPG's did me in). I know I'll be slaughtered with it being my first time out but I thought for sure with some more practice and R-comps I could be a contender in SM next time! Guess not.

Ah well, auto-x isn't my "bag" anyway. I'll be building my car around time-attack and track days in mind and not auto-x but I'll definitely take advantage of auto-x events just to "play," but from what I'm hearing, that class takes big money to perform well in.
smurfwrx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 01:22 PM   #20
Boxologist
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 21118
Join Date: Jul 2002
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: LI, NY
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by illini_wrx View Post
my wheels and tires keep me out of STX, and they were too expensive (and too pretty ) to sell.

well what would it take to have a chance? that's what i'm trying to get at here.

are we talking full on time-attack car, completely gutted, with a 2.5L race engine swap, trans swap with shorter gears, and massive wheels/tires? or are you saying that even a ridiculously modded WRX can't compete in SM nationally?
ur still a novice so just drive anyway in that class. have an experienced drver take the car for an event once in a while to see what teh car's potentila is so u know how far off ur skills are. by the time u learn how to drive competetively, u will have figured what u want out of your autoX car and can purchase and modify accordinly.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiketkd View Post
...
People typically put at least 20-30K into a car to make it reasonably competitive. Others like Vic Sias (E36 BMW M3), have much, much more into their cars.
and Daddio just plugs into the matrix.
Boxologist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 01:31 PM   #21
Chiketkd
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 71634
Join Date: Sep 2004
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: C-Ville, VA
Vehicle:
In hibernation...

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxologist View Post
and Daddio just plugs into the matrix.
Very true!
Chiketkd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 01:31 PM   #22
bcblues
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 17256
Join Date: Apr 2002
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: America's Outback
Vehicle:
04 STi
Blue w/ custom bug splat

Default

It helps to have a fat wallet or a "sugar daddy", and "alien blood".

I am currently running SM, and I am competitive in our small region. I would be slaughtered at the National level, partly due to my under-prepped car, but mostly due to my lack of alien blood.
bcblues is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 01:32 PM   #23
Chiketkd
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 71634
Join Date: Sep 2004
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: C-Ville, VA
Vehicle:
In hibernation...

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bcblues View Post
I would be slaughtered at the National level, partly due to my under-prepped car, but mostly due to my lack of alien blood.
You can use "crazy" to substitute for the "Alien blood". I have no alien blood, but I'm working on crazy...among other things.
Chiketkd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 01:48 PM   #24
illini_wrx
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 155844
Join Date: Aug 2007
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Arctic Circle
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechie3 View Post
Also, you can do the 2.5 swap in ESP as part of the update backdate rule.
with that rule for ESP, could I swap my td04 for the 2009 wrx's vf52? or would I also have to swap the motor? that vf52 is apparently a monster, putting down 260whp+ with just a tune and a catback
illini_wrx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2008, 01:59 PM   #25
Mechie3
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 120152
Join Date: Jul 2006
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Indy
Default

^^ That's still up for debate. Find another thread about the 09 being competitive in ESP and you'll see people are trying to get it bumped. Also, you'd technically have to swap the motor to be legit.
Mechie3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
can you run race fuel in SM? rich728 Motorsports 7 05-13-2005 02:38 AM
Can a top notch motorcycle GP racer be competitive in F1???? Cossey Off-Topic 2 07-01-2004 06:01 AM
Being competative in SM at a local and regional level roybfr Motorsports 38 02-01-2004 02:48 AM
Can turn signals be clear in Va? XBD Mid Atlantic Impreza Club -- MAIC 4 11-13-2001 11:58 PM
Will WRX be shown in SoCal at an auto show? socal2.2 General Forum Archive 4 11-02-2000 10:30 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:01 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.