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Old 11-25-2008, 01:40 PM   #1
Innovative Tuning
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Default Evo warning... 674 whp on 93 octane + meth

I know it's not a Subaru, but we thought it was a cool car so I wanted to share. This is a daily driver setup tuned on AEM EMS.
Brian Crower stroker kit, T67 Shearer manifold turbo kit, plus the supporting intercooler, intake/exhaust, and fuel mods you'd expect.
93 octane with meth injection. It's always fun to see a 4 cylinder make good power on pump or pump/meth for a daily driven application.

I also thought it was interesting to compare the torque output and curve on this setup to the STIs we do so much more of.

As you can see the graph is uncorrected so the numbers aren't inflated. I had street tuned the car and and tested it afterwards on Magnus's dyno in Toronto where the customer is from. I was asked to retune the car and tune it up to see what it can make and then back it off. It turns out I never increased the boost because it made plenty of power just from tuning. The car went from 489-623 whp with tuning (no boost adjustment), and then to 674 whp with the manifold and retuning the fueling back to where it was. I'm not a magician so clearly the tune needed some attention. It could have made more power still, but this is already plenty so there was no point in bumping the boost up or getting aggressive with timing. The manifold worked as advertised so we were happy.

The alignment on the car is off a bit. That made the car want to run wild on the dyno which made the graph undulate a bit, but it will get an alignment at some point. As you can see max boost was 31.08 psi and it tapered to 25-26 psi at redline.




We tested the car with and without Magnus's new cast manifold for the Evo. Here's a little video showing the before/after dyno pulls etc.



For reference, Gary who wrenches at our shop has a DSM with 480 whp uncorrected on this dyno. It goes low 10's at 137-138 mph at 3000 lb weight.
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:02 PM   #2
BrentS
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Wow, that is nice! That car would be an absolute blast to drive around!
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:10 PM   #3
APS04silverwrx
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good god
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:16 PM   #4
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I notice a lot of EVO's run 30+ psi on 93+meth as daily drivers while the consensus is 25-26psi over here for Subarus. Is your opinion built Subaru motors could run the same?
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Old 11-25-2008, 02:27 PM   #5
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I saw 600+ in the title and my first thought..............EVO
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Old 11-25-2008, 04:01 PM   #6
Innovative Tuning
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It can definitely be done with the right build on a Subaru.

Evo guys often deal with head flow while they have a stock turbo. They get that issue right out of the way. STI guys either never touch the heads or don't port plus add cams. The few that build the engine, port the heads, upgrade cams, and have a turbo and intake/exhaust mods to flow this much air efficiently can run this boost on pump/meth no problem.

It's more a difference in the Subaru vs. Mitsu customer than anything.
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Old 11-25-2008, 04:14 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Innovative Tuning View Post
It's more a difference in the Subaru vs. Mitsu customer than anything.
It's also a difference of pulling a valve cover and slapping in 2 cams in 2 hours vs pulling a motor, changing 4 cams and reinstalling a motor

Back OT: WOW.
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Old 11-25-2008, 04:18 PM   #8
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better flowing heads, short runner intake/exhaust manifolds help the VE on the evo's. These are the three things that stick right out. I believe they can also run more lift on their cams without as much machining of the heads.
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Old 11-25-2008, 04:29 PM   #9
APS04silverwrx
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almost perfect power band, Lag would not be an issue outside of first gear!
I bet it just hauls!
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Old 11-25-2008, 04:40 PM   #10
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4G63T's rule.

If your evo runs 12s its slow, lol.
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Old 11-25-2008, 04:52 PM   #11
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I am seeing more and more this. Good job and keep it up.
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Old 11-25-2008, 05:10 PM   #12
Innovative Tuning
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjrutzky View Post
It's also a difference of pulling a valve cover and slapping in 2 cams in 2 hours vs pulling a motor, changing 4 cams and reinstalling a motor

Back OT: WOW.
You're absolutely right about cam install.

On the other hand it's still a difference in customer base. Subaru guys are getting used to 35R's for street cars while Evo guys are running 37r/t67's/40Rs or bigger on the street and have been for a while.
280 is a common duration for a shelf cam for an Evo while Subaru guys are just warming up to the idea of putting that in a drag car.

Many guys with Evos are fully prepared to build the shortblock, port the heads, upgrade the cams and valvetrain plus gears. Subaru guys generally only want to do some of the above, or none. Like I said, a Subaru can definitely do this. You just have to go to the lengths the Evo guys are going to. One Subaru I tuned comes to mind. He paid to play and his car makes about 600 on pump gas (no meth).
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Old 11-25-2008, 05:47 PM   #13
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Quote:
better flowing heads, short runner intake/exhaust manifolds help the VE on the evo's. These are the three things that stick right out. I believe they can also run more lift on their cams without as much machining of the heads.
The iron block (assuming this is not an Evo X) helps withstand high boost a bit too lol
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Old 11-26-2008, 12:36 AM   #14
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Look at the cost of parts for a mitsu compared to them of a subaru 10K Axis motors, etc 10K on a Evo motor will get you a very long way.
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Old 11-26-2008, 07:26 PM   #15
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damn very nice #s!!
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Old 11-26-2008, 07:38 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Innovative Tuning View Post
You're absolutely right about cam install.

On the other hand it's still a difference in customer base. Subaru guys are getting used to 35R's for street cars while Evo guys are running 37r/t67's/40Rs or bigger on the street and have been for a while.
280 is a common duration for a shelf cam for an Evo while Subaru guys are just warming up to the idea of putting that in a drag car.

Many guys with Evos are fully prepared to build the shortblock, port the heads, upgrade the cams and valvetrain plus gears. Subaru guys generally only want to do some of the above, or none. Like I said, a Subaru can definitely do this. You just have to go to the lengths the Evo guys are going to. One Subaru I tuned comes to mind. He paid to play and his car makes about 600 on pump gas (no meth).
Well put. To summarize, us subaru guys have NO balls lol.
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Old 11-26-2008, 07:58 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by APS04silverwrx View Post
good god
+1 Damn!
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Old 11-26-2008, 10:53 PM   #18
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The cost this is a big issue...I have a built motor 272 cams GT37R(T67) and a light port job...My car runs amazing and I've been useing it as my daily driver since my se-r is broken. The problem is, I dont have the money to build a sleved block, and get a wild headgames port job. The evo's have a big advantage with the iron block. Pistons rods berrings and cams go a long way in an evo.
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Old 11-27-2008, 01:56 AM   #19
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yea if prices on sleeved blocks and built blocks in general came down i bet we would see a lot more sti/wrx with big hp numbers all over the country.
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Old 11-27-2008, 09:01 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Token-Negro View Post
Look at the cost of parts for a mitsu compared to them of a subaru 10K Axis motors, etc 10K on a Evo motor will get you a very long way.
Love the screen-name dude!!

Happy turkey day!
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Old 11-27-2008, 11:23 AM   #21
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LOL. Subarus can not run 45-50 or whatever psi. They may be able to compete with the performance of this car but will never be able to compete with cars like the buschur, ams, or devo cars. I am sure there are others that i left out just thought i would say those few.

The subaru motor just cant handle those boost levels. The block will eventually push itself apart. 35psi is about the safe limit from what i have been told.

I dont think it has anything to do with the customers It is mainly the fact that you can do a rod and piston swap to a 4g63 and have a motor ready for 500-600whp with a set of cams. Maybe more power not really sure. I have a friend with a 2.3 evo, bone stock heads but he has gsc280s and he has been 131mph in a fullweight evo. This is on the stock ecu and stock maf. Biggest difference is the block, in my opinion.
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Old 11-27-2008, 12:17 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by verc View Post
I notice a lot of EVO's run 30+ psi on 93+meth as daily drivers while the consensus is 25-26psi over here for Subarus. Is your opinion built Subaru motors could run the same?
That because there fully closed deck block's. There's a lot of R&D into those 4g63's.

People run 30psi on the EJ207's all day.
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Old 11-27-2008, 12:19 PM   #23
spoolinsti05
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Innovative Tuning View Post
You're absolutely right about cam install.

On the other hand it's still a difference in customer base. Subaru guys are getting used to 35R's for street cars while Evo guys are running 37r/t67's/40Rs or bigger on the street and have been for a while.
280 is a common duration for a shelf cam for an Evo while Subaru guys are just warming up to the idea of putting that in a drag car.

Many guys with Evos are fully prepared to build the shortblock, port the heads, upgrade the cams and valvetrain plus gears. Subaru guys generally only want to do some of the above, or none. Like I said, a Subaru can definitely do this. You just have to go to the lengths the Evo guys are going to. One Subaru I tuned comes to mind. He paid to play and his car makes about 600 on pump gas (no meth).


Nice Mike puttin that work in! Did you guy's get another dyno?
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Old 11-27-2008, 12:34 PM   #24
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i have an 03 evo and i plain on using meth with AMS 35r setup this spring,after driving one my mind is made up..
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Old 11-27-2008, 10:50 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oneoverWRX View Post
LOL. Subarus can not run 45-50 or whatever psi. They may be able to compete with the performance of this car but will never be able to compete with cars like the buschur, ams, or devo cars. I am sure there are others that i left out just thought i would say those few.

The subaru motor just cant handle those boost levels. The block will eventually push itself apart. 35psi is about the safe limit from what i have been told.
I dont think it has anything to do with the customers It is mainly the fact that you can do a rod and piston swap to a 4g63 and have a motor ready for 500-600whp with a set of cams. Maybe more power not really sure. I have a friend with a 2.3 evo, bone stock heads but he has gsc280s and he has been 131mph in a fullweight evo. This is on the stock ecu and stock maf. Biggest difference is the block, in my opinion.
This is the problem.. People think this way... I have run 30psi on 93 octane for a year on a piston and rod motor with cams EJ25/WRX HEADS.. 40-42psi on race gas all day long, reason I didnt go higher is because the turbo couldnt. 0 problems..
I have customers that make 500+whp on stock motors and run into the 10s,.. 1 with a stock ecu and MAF.

While you are right that the block is diffrent, you are wrong in saying you "cant" as the OP posted.. People are scared to try.. I try and I seem to be getting the cars going down the track fast.

As for competeing with guys like Dave B, AMS, devo... Its just easier to go fast in the other platform.
Look at the Pr cars, Big Valley to be exact, that car is just as fast as any other evo with a 42r, or the few other PR boys that have gone 9s on smaller turbos, just like the EVO guys.
So in closing, the OP is right... Most subie guys are just scared to try it.
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