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Old 11-30-2008, 04:53 PM   #51
hoppergrande
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 520hpsti View Post
cheap. fast. reliable.

pick 2.
love that! lol

but ya ive heard very bad things about fp...
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Old 11-30-2008, 05:16 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axion7606 View Post
380whp and beating 600's? you must be racing 80's sport bikes or squids!
I guess it comes down to who knows how to drive best. Ive been a licensed driver 24 years now I have come across many 600RR that I have had no problems with. I've had this debate with many n00bs on NASIOC (or younger drivers as well) Im just saying I know what I know and 600cc's is not a big deal, yes you can say blah blah HP to weight ratio and 1/4 mile this and that but get your average bike driver against an experienced driver in a AWD car and you better have your "A" game

Last edited by 4ST-AIR; 11-30-2008 at 05:26 PM.
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Old 11-30-2008, 11:55 PM   #53
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My point about heat dissipation had nothing to with cast iron, just piston movement and overall layout of an I4 vs an H4.
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Old 12-01-2008, 12:31 AM   #54
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A mate of mine had a 100hp wet nos kit installed on his stocko V6 Toyota Camry several years ago for a laugh. He was racing bikes all night and there were only a couple bikes that could beat him while he was on the nos. His engine didn't last long though and he lifted the head within the first month lol.

So maybe if you wanna race bikes, the suggestion for using nos would be worth investigating - and make sure you install a larger headstud kit to ensure the added pressures don't lift the heads.
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Old 12-01-2008, 02:04 AM   #55
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Go
Evo
Im gettin tired of boxer engines..
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Old 12-01-2008, 02:32 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by 520hpsti View Post
cheap. fast. reliable.

pick 2.
concise, yet so profound
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Old 12-01-2008, 02:52 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4ST-AIR View Post
I guess it comes down to who knows how to drive best. Ive been a licensed driver 24 years now I have come across many 600RR that I have had no problems with. I've had this debate with many n00bs on NASIOC (or younger drivers as well) Im just saying I know what I know and 600cc's is not a big deal, yes you can say blah blah HP to weight ratio and 1/4 mile this and that but get your average bike driver against an experienced driver in a AWD car and you better have your "A" game
Yeah alot of people cant drive there bikes as good as they think. But I ride a r6 and I know first hand of how many beat downs I've given. including vipers, lambos, 400whp sti's. I mean people are trapping 124-129mph on a modern R6
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Old 12-01-2008, 03:32 AM   #58
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It can be done with a 35r and supporting mods on 100 octane! I am proof
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Old 12-01-2008, 07:00 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4ST-AIR View Post
I make just under 500WHP with my Spearco, 30R and Q16.

How does it run in summer? Do you ever notice your car pulling timing due to heat soak? Really, I am curious why people run TMICs when FMIC are "better" at these high power numbers. But then again, at these high numbers maybe if the car pulls a little timing then its not enough of a power zapper to really notice? I just know that around ~300-330hp if my car pulls timing then I am going to notice it.
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Old 12-01-2008, 07:15 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scramjett View Post
How does it run in summer? Do you ever notice your car pulling timing due to heat soak? Really, I am curious why people run TMICs when FMIC are "better" at these high power numbers. But then again, at these high numbers maybe if the car pulls a little timing then its not enough of a power zapper to really notice? I just know that around ~300-330hp if my car pulls timing then I am going to notice it.
Sure there's some heatsoak. But a bigger turbo does not have to work as hard as say a green or 18-20G to make the power so therefore there is actually less heat being generated.

I do run a 20psi pump map so even though I rev all the way to 7500 and make 96% of max power still I have 0 knock and do not pull timing out of the normal. Every so often I reset the ECU and clear the learned tables out but that's when I do something dumb like use FFS on a hwy run when Im running pump gas.

TMIC have come a long way in just the last few years, and many of the things people read on here about the heatsoak is just others spreading the rumours. Sure a FMIC can disapate heat much better just becasue of where it sits and the area thats cooled is much greater. If I was running a FMIC I would more than likely not need the extra safety of the 20psi tune and would be running more around the lines of 23psi on pump (that is if my tuner thought it was safe )
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Old 12-01-2008, 01:42 PM   #61
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Your NOT going to safely make 500whp on pump w/that turbo, do pump + meth or race gas and you'll easily make it, If your running 91, I wouldn't go past 400, Have you thought about a rotated 30r turbo instead of the fp red? And why do you want a tmic? Sure it will spool up a few hundred rpm's faster, If your looking for big power go w/ a fmic, those injectors you mentioned should definetely get the job done, im on 850cc and making 485whp/497tq on C-16 (117 oct), and 395whp/375tq on 91 pump, Think about ALL your options before diving into it. I also have an 04 sti but w/ the Perrin Kit
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Old 12-01-2008, 01:49 PM   #62
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Quote:
Surely you do not believe that our motors would dissipate heat more effectively if they were mounted with two cylinders pointing downward and two pointing upward?
wat? Heat naturally rises so it makes sense to me that if a the combustion is occuring on the top of the motor as opposed to the sides it can dissipate the heat better.

Quote:
My point about heat dissipation had nothing to with cast iron, just piston movement and overall layout of an I4 vs an H4.
I was agreeing with this...
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Old 12-01-2008, 02:17 PM   #63
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on pump i hope you mean e85. my buddy has a red powered STi and makes 487 on c16. h
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Old 12-01-2008, 02:56 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4ST-AIR View Post
I guess it comes down to who knows how to drive best. Ive been a licensed driver 24 years now I have come across many 600RR that I have had no problems with. I've had this debate with many n00bs on NASIOC (or younger drivers as well) Im just saying I know what I know and 600cc's is not a big deal, yes you can say blah blah HP to weight ratio and 1/4 mile this and that but get your average bike driver against an experienced driver in a AWD car and you better have your "A" game
Im not so sure about this. I have a R6 and am pretty sure from a roll i can handle my STI with no problem and R6's arent made for going in a straight line what so ever. From a dig might be a different story as i cant launch the bike worth crap but i didnt buy the bike for going fast in a straight line, thats what the cars for
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Old 12-01-2008, 03:53 PM   #65
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most modern 600cc bikes are good for a low 11 @ 125-130 mph from what ive come across..

Those numbers seem to be consistent with what most of the dorks on here that drop 20 grand into their slowbarus and run 11s.

my friends mustang traps @ 125+ and from a roll he beat me, but i was in the wrong gear (wasnt payin attention)..he told me he beat an r1 from a roll too but i suspect that the rider was a newbie. f4i's are considered the slowest amongst the modern bikes but its still fast enough to keep up with most anything on the road.

I didnt race him from a dig side to side but he launched from a stop sign and I was redlined from 1st to 2nd and I kept on his tail, but barely, and i weigh about 140 lbs. then we hit a redlight..

mustangs w/ slicks from a roll = faaast.

a fast wrx/sti/evo/tsi-awd/gsx could prob beat most bikes from a dig, but from a roll, especially at higher speeds, bikes have the advantage IMO. That is unless you're pushing 700+ @ all 4 wheels (trapping 140+) on either of these cars and are in the sub 3200 lb range w/ driver.

Last edited by mxpunk; 12-01-2008 at 04:25 PM.
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Old 12-01-2008, 04:38 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve.804 View Post
wat? Heat naturally rises so it makes sense to me that if a the combustion is occuring on the top of the motor as opposed to the sides it can dissipate the heat better.
well funny thing is that for performance, you want the heads to be colder

that's why many race motors will try and run "reverse cooled" hell all the LS motors are that way now...that was probably the only good thing that came from the LT1 over standar SBC.
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Old 12-01-2008, 04:51 PM   #67
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Agreed.
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Old 12-01-2008, 06:30 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mxpunk View Post
most modern 600cc bikes are good for a low 11 @ 125-130 mph from what ive come across..

Those numbers seem to be consistent with what most of the dorks on here that drop 20 grand into their slowbarus and run 11s.

my friends mustang traps @ 125+ and from a roll he beat me, but i was in the wrong gear (wasnt payin attention)..he told me he beat an r1 from a roll too but i suspect that the rider was a newbie. f4i's are considered the slowest amongst the modern bikes but its still fast enough to keep up with most anything on the road.

I didnt race him from a dig side to side but he launched from a stop sign and I was redlined from 1st to 2nd and I kept on his tail, but barely, and i weigh about 140 lbs. then we hit a redlight..

mustangs w/ slicks from a roll = faaast.

a fast wrx/sti/evo/tsi-awd/gsx could prob beat most bikes from a dig, but from a roll, especially at higher speeds, bikes have the advantage IMO. That is unless you're pushing 700+ @ all 4 wheels (trapping 140+) on either of these cars and are in the sub 3200 lb range w/ driver.
Actually bikes have the advantage from a dig, a busa and a 14 are the only two bikes with "decent" aerodynamics. The rest have soooo much drag it's not even funny. From a roll I never met a 600cc bike I couldn't outrun with my old nitrous Honda (granted it was a built motor, two stages, two fuel tanks, and 300whp worth of nitrous alone) but the same bikes I could roll over from a 60 kick on the street would put 2-3 tenths on me at the track because I couldn't 330ft as well as them.

In higher powered scenarios, my GSXR1000 will run 9.70's all day long at 144 yet running a mid 10 second Supra on the street that also traps 144 will result in my bike getting spit out the exhaust of that car.

If you look at the difference in half track numbers you will see why, a car will backhalf better down the strip than a bike will, I run 118 in the 1/8 and 144 in the 1/4. Pretty standard for a stock motor GSXR1000. A big single supra however will usually trap in the 112-113 range in the 1/8 when it's running 144 in the 1/4. A friend of mine in NC owns Majestic Motorsports and when I was living out there, he went against many a 1000 on the street and raped them yet they would drag him down the track. The aerodynamics play just as much of a roll in roll racing as horsepower and bikes simply lack the aero.
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Old 12-01-2008, 06:47 PM   #69
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From a roll I have done very well vs almost every bike I've run into on the street. And I know people won't believe it but I beat an R1 from a roll last year with my old built motor pushing 26-27psi on 93/meth. 60-130, I got the jump and he was in my blind spot the whole time. No doubt the bike could have been ridden better, but still.
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Old 12-01-2008, 06:51 PM   #70
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No doubt the bike could have been ridden better, but still.
Too true, too much of the time...
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Old 12-01-2008, 07:16 PM   #71
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i lol'd at this thread "i want to go fast!" hahaha Talladega Nights
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Old 12-01-2008, 07:37 PM   #72
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Buy P&L's 08 STi that did it!
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Old 12-01-2008, 07:40 PM   #73
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you will need a GT40R as a min to get those figures on pump fuel...
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Old 12-02-2008, 09:11 AM   #74
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Originally Posted by slodsm View Post
Actually bikes have the advantage from a dig, a busa and a 14 are the only two bikes with "decent" aerodynamics. The rest have soooo much drag it's not even funny. From a roll I never met a 600cc bike I couldn't outrun with my old nitrous Honda (granted it was a built motor, two stages, two fuel tanks, and 300whp worth of nitrous alone) but the same bikes I could roll over from a 60 kick on the street would put 2-3 tenths on me at the track because I couldn't 330ft as well as them.

In higher powered scenarios, my GSXR1000 will run 9.70's all day long at 144 yet running a mid 10 second Supra on the street that also traps 144 will result in my bike getting spit out the exhaust of that car.

If you look at the difference in half track numbers you will see why, a car will backhalf better down the strip than a bike will, I run 118 in the 1/8 and 144 in the 1/4. Pretty standard for a stock motor GSXR1000. A big single supra however will usually trap in the 112-113 range in the 1/8 when it's running 144 in the 1/4. A friend of mine in NC owns Majestic Motorsports and when I was living out there, he went against many a 1000 on the street and raped them yet they would drag him down the track. The aerodynamics play just as much of a roll in roll racing as horsepower and bikes simply lack the aero.
Interesting. While I believe everything you said, the majority of bike riders, including myself cannot launch worth a damn

The power to weight ratio of bikes is still awesome though..most modern 600s are good for 11s in the 1/4 and thats damn fast, for something bonestock.

<--im a bit biased though, i love love love motorcycles.
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Old 12-02-2008, 09:12 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
well funny thing is that for performance, you want the heads to be colder

that's why many race motors will try and run "reverse cooled" hell all the LS motors are that way now...that was probably the only good thing that came from the LT1 over standar SBC.
hey homemade..care to explain what this "reverse cooled" thing is? inquiring minds want to know!
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