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Old 04-28-2009, 07:44 PM   #2451
UncleSpud
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[quote=gimmersong;26529551]
Quote:
Originally Posted by TuningIsLife View Post
After seeing a few posts about other people having motor issues with their 2009 Subarus, I would like to see who all is having problems.

Today I myself detected internal engine failure. By detected I mean I heard a loud knocking sound at 2000-3000 RPMs.

Add me to the list, I purchased my car in October and I had just under 6000 miles on it when it blew a rod bearing, taking out my turbo as well.
The dealership has told me that turbos are backordered all across the state(s?) and I've been with a rental for near a month.

Subaru is also claiming that this is my fault since the tires were well worn, but is replacing this under Subaru's 'customer goodwill' policy. All I have to do is sign the papers when they get in, and I'm not sure I want to since this seems to be a massive problem with the engine running too lean.

I live at altitude, 5000ft daily and my home is at 8200, which certainly doesn't help matters (Boulder, Colorado).

Any advise?

-Sam
I also live at altitude (6000 ft), and I bought my August-built sedan from a dealer in your town. My car is OK (so far), but I've absolutely no confidence in it.

If SoA were interested in "goodwill," you wouldn't be waiting a month for a new motor/turbo, nor would you have to sign papers as a consequence of worn tires. Goodwill, as I'd define it, would be having SoA admit the problem it has with early production '09 WRX's and fixing them.

My advice would be to raise holy hell with the dealer and SoA until your car is repaired or replaced under the Colorado lemon law. As to the problem with the WRX running lean, this is news to me, and I'm not sure how this directly related to a problem with the block. Perhaps someone with greater technical expertise can address this...
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Old 04-28-2009, 07:46 PM   #2452
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Originally Posted by Tea cups View Post
That sucks, man. As I said before, it used to be thought that 5k miles and you were safe. That eventually went up to 10k. Just goes to show us that we have no idea. Maybe some will fail at 30k, 60k? Who knows? Maybe Subaru does but they aren't talking. Good job, Subaru. What a cluster ****.
Did you ever find anyone to assist with the list? I would volunteer but I am an impulse away from canning this thing and buying a different make vehicle on about a weekly basis. If we didn't get snow around here it would already be a done deal. Corvette or Camaro (Build your own 1SS, Black, RS Package, Ground Effects to see what I mean).

Also anyone see the new Grand Sport Corvette for 2010? Wow Ash want! I've been reading rumors here and there that the Grand Sport package should end up not much more than current Z51 pricing!
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Old 04-28-2009, 08:20 PM   #2453
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.......

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Old 04-28-2009, 08:32 PM   #2454
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Originally Posted by Michael Yount View Post
I left this message directed to Chairman of SOA Mr. Tomohiko Ikeda tonight at this blog site - http://blogs.phillynews.com/inquirer..._subaru_1.html
That article is from 2007. No one is going to respond.
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Old 04-28-2009, 08:33 PM   #2455
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[quote=AshJWilliams;26531076]
Quote:
Originally Posted by gimmersong View Post

I'm not sure the tune has anything to do with the problem. In previous years STI's came with a lean tune that caused engine failures. This appears to be a different problem entirely; a bearing failure of which the origin is not exactly known just yet.

I am not sure what they want you to sign; regardless of what it is I would be disinclined to sign it (ie the way you have described it doesn't sound good).

If it has been 30 days you should look into your state's lemon laws. My understanding was that if it was in the shop for more than 30 days (Ohio) period it could be claimed as a lemon. Others have indicated that even after 30 days one must give the manufacturer one more chance to remedy the problem but I'm not so sure that is correct...? Either way look in to it; it is my assessment that if you can get rid of the 09 WRX without to much monetary loss you should do so. Otherwise I suggest you mention to them that you are considering the lemon laws. Another member did that and they fixed his car ASAP (regardless of the turbo shortage).
I mentioned lemon law when they couldn't get parts for my car and they some how found parts that supposedly weren't even in the country. Mine had already been in for 30 days and they were going to keep it for 3 more weeks waiting for the part. They also compt me a month of payments.
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Old 04-28-2009, 08:40 PM   #2456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gimmersong View Post

I'm not sure the tune has anything to do with the problem. In previous years STI's came with a lean tune that caused engine failures. This appears to be a different problem entirely; a bearing failure of which the origin is not exactly known just yet.

I am not sure what they want you to sign; regardless of what it is I would be disinclined to sign it (ie the way you have described it doesn't sound good).

If it has been 30 days you should look into your state's lemon laws. My understanding was that if it was in the shop for more than 30 days (Ohio) period it could be claimed as a lemon. Others have indicated that even after 30 days one must give the manufacturer one more chance to remedy the problem but I'm not so sure that is correct...? Either way look in to it; it is my assessment that if you can get rid of the 09 WRX without to much monetary loss you should do so. Otherwise I suggest you mention to them that you are considering the lemon laws. Another member did that and they fixed his car ASAP (regardless of the turbo shortage).
That was me....to the OP....trust me, the dealer/SOA does NOT want to buy your car back. Because not only will they lose money on buying it back, but they STILL have to replace the engine too, at their own expense, and then try to sell the car again with a replacement engine.

Look into your state's lemon laws. Some are 15 days. Some are 30. They differ by state.

Also, I would not sign a paper saying it was "your fault." If you haven't contacted SOA's customer service line, you should do so ASAP and at least get a number and make sure the regional rep is coming out.
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Old 04-28-2009, 09:19 PM   #2457
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Reading this thread is getting stressful
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Old 04-28-2009, 09:22 PM   #2458
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Originally Posted by Dartholomew View Post
I think it's also interesting to note that for hatches at least, it seems like VINs have jumped from 80xxxx to 82xxxx. Does anyone have an 81xxxx? Maybe the 81xxxx models went to different markets (and if so, have there been any failures in these)?
Nope there are 81xxxx hatches. The one i had been looking at was an 814xxx.

If this problem is fixed AND if Subaru comes out and makes some kind of meaningful statement, i may wait a couple months and lowball the dealer when they start trying to clear out the 2009's, or just wait for the 2010's.
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Old 04-28-2009, 09:44 PM   #2459
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Thumbs up New Motor is running!

Hey everyone, I got my car back today and the motor is quieter,smoother, and has more low end torque. I hope it lasts. I will keep the forum posted.
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Old 04-28-2009, 09:57 PM   #2460
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......

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Old 04-28-2009, 10:01 PM   #2461
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......

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Old 04-28-2009, 10:22 PM   #2462
irish44j
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^^makes you wonder if the previous SOA chairman got axed because of this situation. I mean, just replacing the engines of the cars in this thread has cost Subaru alot of $$ and return customers....
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Old 04-28-2009, 10:29 PM   #2463
Tea cups
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AshJWilliams View Post
Did you ever find anyone to assist with the list? I would volunteer but I am an impulse away from canning this thing and buying a different make vehicle on about a weekly basis.
No, I decided tol continue updating it for now. It was just a pain updating the SS every failure, so now I'm just doing it every 3-5, so not too bad.
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Old 04-28-2009, 11:14 PM   #2464
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subaru is claiming that the motors are failing due to oil contamination in the oil that was put in when they were built. thats what i heard from my boss today. weve got a couple at the shop that went including a xt forester. i have a wrx 7/08 build date an mine failed at 5800. whatever at least subaru is stepping up and dishing out long blocks and not trying to piece them back together. just a thought.
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Old 04-28-2009, 11:50 PM   #2465
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsham109 View Post
subaru is claiming that the motors are failing due to oil contamination in the oil that was put in when they were built. thats what i heard from my boss today. weve got a couple at the shop that went including a xt forester. i have a wrx 7/08 build date an mine failed at 5800. whatever at least subaru is stepping up and dishing out long blocks and not trying to piece them back together. just a thought.
jsham, sorry about your car. Please post your vin# and build date in the thread below or you can pm Tea cups with the infromation.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1695936
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Old 04-29-2009, 01:04 AM   #2466
incongruity
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Originally Posted by Tea cups View Post
No, I decided tol continue updating it for now. It was just a pain updating the SS every failure, so now I'm just doing it every 3-5, so not too bad.
Just say the word and (well, and send me the spreadsheet) and I'll set it up on google docs and add any editors we want -- that still seems like the least painful option to me....

In any case, Tea cups, thanks for doing all that you've done on this...
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Old 04-29-2009, 06:02 AM   #2467
Michael Yount
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......

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Old 04-29-2009, 06:50 AM   #2468
MackeyMack
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Default Another Failure

I just had my car towed to the dealer last night. The engine was making a loud knocking noise. I will have the dealer check it out and confirm later, but it sounded just like the youtube video. The only solace I have is that it is a lease. I will drive it for 3 more years, turn it in, and cross Subaru off the list of choices for my next car.
VIN: 800469
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Old 04-29-2009, 08:42 AM   #2469
Tea cups
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Originally Posted by incongruity View Post
Just say the word and (well, and send me the spreadsheet) and I'll set it up on google docs and add any editors we want -- that still seems like the least painful option to me....

In any case, Tea cups, thanks for doing all that you've done on this...
I looked at the google docs, but the spreadsheet capabilities are limited and could not do the formatting that I wanted. Regardless, I just update the screenshot every 3 failures or so, or once a week and it is not really a pain anymore. Just was a pain updating after every single failure especially when there was a large number in a short period of time.
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Old 04-29-2009, 12:55 PM   #2470
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Originally Posted by jsham109 View Post
subaru is claiming that the motors are failing due to oil contamination in the oil that was put in when they were built. thats what i heard from my boss today. weve got a couple at the shop that went including a xt forester. i have a wrx 7/08 build date an mine failed at 5800. whatever at least subaru is stepping up and dishing out long blocks and not trying to piece them back together. just a thought.
I think this is a viable theory, I changed my oil at 500 miles. I do not believe there has been anybody with engine failure that has changed their oil so early.
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Old 04-29-2009, 01:08 PM   #2471
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Originally Posted by Verity View Post
I think this is a viable theory, I changed my oil at 500 miles. I do not believe there has been anybody with engine failure that has changed their oil so early.
Possible -- But you would figure they would of issued a service bulletin to have everyone in the danger zone called in for a system flush, or remaining vehicles on the lots to do the same...

Unless by 'Oil' they mean like assembly lube... *shurg*
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Old 04-29-2009, 01:09 PM   #2472
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hatever at least subaru is stepping up and dishing out long blocks and not trying to piece them back together.
Although the first time around they DID rebuild my friends '08 STI (piston melt down) ... before putting in a new '09 engine when the bearings went out a short time later.
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Old 04-29-2009, 01:17 PM   #2473
AshJWilliams
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Originally Posted by Verity View Post
I think this is a viable theory, I changed my oil at 500 miles. I do not believe there has been anybody with engine failure that has changed their oil so early.
This seems unlikely to me. Keep in mind that with the mileages we have seen thus far at engine failure (as high as 13,XXX miles) some engines failed after having not only one but multiple oil changes (for the 13,XXX engine there should have been 3 oil changes). Does it make sense that an engine would suddenly fail at 13,000 miles after having multiple oil changes due to contaminated oil from the factory (although I suppose it is possible, ie contaminants embed in bearing material, but it just seems unlikely to me)?
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Old 04-29-2009, 01:32 PM   #2474
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Originally Posted by Michael Yount View Post
......Got my analysis this afternoon. I may be ok. Despite all the trash in the filter -- tin and antimony (Babbitt) -- both listed out at a big fat ZERO, and copper was in the normal range. If a bearing were going, those counts would be abnormally high. I did have an abnormal silicone count, fairly normal for a new motor/aluminum block/heads. The other count that was abnormally high was silver of all things. The analysis note attributed it "possibly to solder". Who knows. We'll see where it goes for the next analysis........
A routine $20 UOA will not give you the total picture on wear metals. ICP elemental analysis (which is what you get from Blackstone, Polaris, etc with a standard UOA) has an upper detection limit of 10 um. Any metallic particles larger than that will not show up on a standard UOA.

Polaris states it clearly on their website:
"If you depend solely on Elemental Analysis by ICP to detect wear metal concentrations, you may not always know when a catastrophic failure is in progress."

Your "trash in the filter" was telling you the true story, and the UOA may be misleading you.
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Old 04-29-2009, 04:36 PM   #2475
UncleSpud
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Originally Posted by jsham109 View Post
subaru is claiming that the motors are failing due to oil contamination in the oil that was put in when they were built. thats what i heard from my boss today. weve got a couple at the shop that went including a xt forester. i have a wrx 7/08 build date an mine failed at 5800. whatever at least subaru is stepping up and dishing out long blocks and not trying to piece them back together. just a thought.
Sounds like you work for Subaru. We appreciate the input, but did SoA provide anything in writing to confirm this?

We've had a number of failures with folks who have changed oil early on, which would seem to rule out oil contamination in those cases. The problem with the bearings seems to be the most popular theory, but in the absence of any information from SoA, we might as well hire exorcists to fix our motors.
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