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Old 12-29-2008, 12:48 PM   #1
AVANTI R5
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Default Ten Small Cars We Might BE Getting




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Automotive News [sub] ainít committing themselves on this one, using typography to highlight that this is a list of ten small cars that could be coming our way. But theyíre right to flag these cars as potential U.S. imports. When the U.S./world economy recovers, the price of gas is sure to ascend. Yes, when. Remember: automakers need to plan on a five-year timeline. To NOT plan for a recovery would be a mistake. And, as Detroit should have learned at least once in the last twenty years, any full-line carmaker worth more than $3b should not place all its eggs in a single vehicular basket. Itís an interesting list, but wouldnít you really rather have a full-size Honda Accord or Toyota Corolla or, well, anything? And of course, I donít mean you in the Chervolet Camaro sense. I mean you, as in 100k+ units per year. Or, put another way, how many competitors does the MINI need?
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/ten...cans-wont-buy/





































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Old 12-29-2008, 12:53 PM   #2
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Give us the Polo, Corsa, IQ, Ka, and 500. The rest you can keep.
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Old 12-29-2008, 12:54 PM   #3
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I would love me some Polo GTI!! Or a corsa with the turbo motor, or a fiesta ST180, or pretty much anything else from europe that's a small hatchback with a peppy engine.
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Old 12-29-2008, 02:12 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subydude View Post
I would love me some Polo GTI!! Or a corsa with the turbo motor, or a fiesta ST180, or pretty much anything else from europe that's a small hatchback with a peppy engine.
What's considered peppy there, is not considered so here.
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Old 12-29-2008, 02:50 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Stanley View Post
What's considered peppy there, is not considered so here.
Sure...a 200hp Corsa VXR is not peppy.
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Old 12-29-2008, 06:22 PM   #6
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I like how they say 'how many competitors for the Mini do we need?' and the point is, that whole euro Supermini segment needs to be brought back and embraced in the US. Ppl here do NOT need large sedans, SUVs, trucks, etc. They simply grew into them and created lifestyles to support them. The majority of us need to scale back, spend less money, use less space and back off from thee excessive overindulgent supersize american lifestyles that we've grown accustomed to. Having small, stylish fun to drive, but not excessive cars shoudl be a good first step.

Plus it'll tell some ppl to lose some damn weight.
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Old 12-29-2008, 06:42 PM   #7
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My vote for Polo diesel!
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Old 12-29-2008, 09:47 PM   #8
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Yay, more speculation! =]
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Old 12-29-2008, 10:14 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by edkwon View Post
I like how they say 'how many competitors for the Mini do we need?' and the point is, that whole euro Supermini segment needs to be brought back and embraced in the US. Ppl here do NOT need large sedans, SUVs, trucks, etc.
Here, we need ride height. You can't drive a Mini in winter here when the snow gets over 4". How often does that happen, you ask? How 'bout 6 months out of the year... Last week, we got 9" in about 8 hours. I'm all for small cars, but they really need to watch the ride height on them. People complain about the Outback's ride height, but really even without CAFE Subaru was right to make that move (at least with the Outback) for that car/segment. I see a whole 'lot of Outbacks motatin' in the same snow that I see zero Mini's in (and it's not that we don't have Minis here in Bozeangeles...)

P.s. - that Opel Corsa stole the front-end from the '09 Matrix.
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Old 12-29-2008, 10:37 PM   #10
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P.s. - that Opel Corsa stole the front-end from the '09 Matrix.
Unlikely, considering it came out two years before the Matrix.
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Old 12-30-2008, 11:20 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowcat View Post
Here, we need ride height. You can't drive a Mini in winter here when the snow gets over 4". How often does that happen, you ask? How 'bout 6 months out of the year... Last week, we got 9" in about 8 hours. I'm all for small cars, but they really need to watch the ride height on them.
It never snows in Europe, so they don't understand that.

:rolleyes:
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Old 12-30-2008, 11:26 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beaverboy View Post
It never snows in Europe, so they don't understand that.

And all my memories of sleding down the hill are fake?

Krzys

PS Hmmm I see no "rolleyes" in original.

PS2 Driving in country with high snowdrifts is an adventure. I suspect sometimes even truck drivers may have problems seeing above. Are there any Miatas driven during winter in Montana?
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Old 12-30-2008, 11:29 AM   #13
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I would not consider Montana to represent a "normal" picture of the United States. I'm sure that Euro subcompacts would sell very well in the southern half of the country. Maybe you could consider one for Montana in the summertime, and use the extreme ride height of your 09 Matrix in the winter?
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Old 12-30-2008, 11:39 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowcat View Post
Here, we need ride height. You can't drive a Mini in winter here when the snow gets over 4". How often does that happen, you ask? How 'bout 6 months out of the year... .
Hey genius, you know i'm not referring to ppl who live in areas like that, but to ppl who drive trucks and SUVs in the urban areas that never see offroad use or snowdrifts the height of small children. You ever lived in a major city, they're still everywhere and overused.

We need more of these micro superminis in congested urban metropolitan areas, i'm not referring to the countryside.

And yes europe and scandanavia gets tons of snow too, yet they seem to do just fine driving cars up there and use trucks only when theey need to.
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Old 12-30-2008, 04:03 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by darknightohio View Post
Sure...a 200hp Corsa VXR is not peppy.
When was the last time you were in Europe?
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Old 12-30-2008, 05:03 PM   #16
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The only EDM cars we ever hear about or pay attention to over here are the peppy ones. That doesn't mean everybody over there drives a turbocharged hatchback... Actually painfully slow little fuel efficient cars are quite numerous over there, especially when you are in or near the major cities.

Doesn't snow in Europe? Somebody here has obviously not experienced winter in Poland, Russia, or any of the scandinavian countries. Even England gets some snow sometimes. After reading that post, I keep hearing history lectures in my head about wars that took place out in that area of eastern Poland and beyond into Russia. The French tried that once... Once. Germans thought they could succeed where that little French dude with the funny hat had failed... Didn't work so well for them either when their tanks couldn't even operate in the harshness of the winters over there. Eastern Europe is actually becoming more prosperous and you see tons of little econo boxes driving around there even with the harsh winters. To say it doesn't snow in Europe is kinda funny though.
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Old 12-30-2008, 05:32 PM   #17
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Everytime I read something from thetruthaboutcars, I'm underwhelmed by the logic involved.

The first car doesn't exist yet. No opinion can be formed.
The second is Chinese, good luck with crash standards.
Third is the Fiat 500, which if the mini is any indication will sell like hotcakes (next cheapest Italian car in the US is $100k more)
Fourth is a Hyundai, which Hyundai US already sells a car of this size here, but not of this quality.
Fifth is a small Merc, which doesn't do well in Europe.
Sixth....Corsa....Yeah....a VXR please
Seventh is iQ, far better than the Smart which seems to be doing well so far.
Eighth is a Polo, which would be the first small light VW in over a decade.
Ninth is a Ka, which might be a stretch. Lets see how the Fiesta does first.
Tenth is a pricey tiny Audi, which will be so-so in europe.

Basically there are two ways for Euro market small cars to work here....

1.Be very good and successful there, and hold a premium price here (see Mini, GTI)

2.Be "cheap as chips".
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Old 12-30-2008, 08:25 PM   #18
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give ME the 500 and the Corsa VXR, the rest YOU can keep
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Old 12-30-2008, 09:15 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derbagger View Post
Basically there are two ways for Euro market small cars to work here....

1.Be very good and successful there, and hold a premium price here (see Mini, GTI)

2.Be "cheap as chips".
I'd think that option #2 is their best bet. I don't think there is enough of a market to support a large number of premium priced premium built small cars in the current economy. Minis are popular, and they sell well, but they make up a pretty small percentage of cars you see on the road... And they were selling even better when every young posh person could get a car loan with crap credit history and little or no money down. These little cars will have to compete with the Corolla and Yaris, and the hoard of other small inexpensive cars hitting the market that younger folks might have a fighting chance at actually being able to get a loan for. And remember how many of us Americans think (excluding car enthusiasts, I'm talking about average Joe down the street), bigger is better, so if they can get a bigger car that is still reliable and has decent build quality for the same price they'll often choose the bigger car.
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Old 12-31-2008, 02:35 AM   #20
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i want the IQ and i want the Mazda 2 to come too!
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Old 12-31-2008, 08:45 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derbagger View Post
1.Be very good and successful there, and hold a premium price here (see Mini, GTI)

2.Be "cheap as chips".
Your post is pretty spot-on, but I wanted to point out the GTI as a bad example. The GTI doesn't really hold a premium price here. At $22.9K ($1K over Civic Si), it's average for the sport compact segment, especially given the (initial... zing!) quality of the car. You *might* be able to say that about the Rabbit, but compared to like the Mazda3's pricing, it's still pretty cheap.

Mini's are spot on though.
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Old 01-01-2009, 12:30 PM   #22
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i want an iQ!!!!


and a polo and a fiesta. then i'll have a REAL difficult decision. I don't know how i'd make a decision based on anything other than price between those three, but i think it pretty much beats out any of the current offerings(smart is laughable, mini is too expensive, scion is huge, yaris is terrible, fit is awesome but hard to get your hands on for a reasonable price, and it's too big.) between a polo, fiesta, and iQ i'd be real hard pressed to come to a decision. the iQ is bound to be way cheaper than either of the others(even cheaper than a Ka, which is... well i'd rather have an iQ even if it was 3k more. the Ka seems like a terrible idea compared to the fiesta)and the polo is probably going to have a nicer finish than the Ka/Fiesta. It'd come down to how cheap the Polo is.

Still, this would all be waaaay closer of a decision than ANY other new car fight I am invested in.




that is,


until the toyotabaru evolution of the AE86 comes out. if that car comes out i WILL get it.

if none of these cars happen, i'll get an MS3.
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Old 01-01-2009, 12:41 PM   #23
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Fiesta will be here early 2010; the Ka is essentially a Fiat Panda with new skin.
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Old 01-01-2009, 07:51 PM   #24
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after driving a scion xA i'm convinced that I want a small toyotamade city hatch.

if it has a subaru engine and badges, all the better
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Old 01-01-2009, 07:56 PM   #25
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I want the subaru R2. New York city has a few converted to electric as test cars.
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