Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Tuesday July 7, 2015
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > Motorsports

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-16-2009, 04:24 PM   #1
PitwrkzZ1
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 94316
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Northern Westchester
Vehicle:
2002 WRX

Default Karting thread

Discuss any type of karting in here!

My local indoor track (GPNY) has 6.5 hp Sodi RX7 karts. I'm getting pretty good laptimes (about a second off the lap records for both tracks) but one thing I still haven't really got is how to slide correctly, which is really important considering that there are high speed runs following where the slide would give me good exit speeds.

I understand the whole weight transfer concept, but I cant seem to put it into practice...what si the correct procedure? Brake then slide? How far should I go into the corner? Also, the kart often dies on me (revs go way down) on corner exit when i think I'm getting a good slide...why would that happen?

BTW, it seems to me that karting is more like rally than road racing. Anybody else get this feeling? haha

Track map
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
PitwrkzZ1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 01-16-2009, 05:22 PM   #2
nhat
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 140163
Join Date: Feb 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: 3MI Racing
Vehicle:
03 STi
hellaflunctional

Default

here's our karting spot in northern va - http://www.allsportsgp.com





the track is pretty slick and last time i was there, 4 sub-24.5 laps are what's required to qualify for the super karts. i missed it by 1 lap the only time we hit the brakes on this track is going into turn 1. tap the brakes, get the rear out, and then get on the gas through the turn.

i want to check out this place in DE - http://www.midatlanticgrandprix.com/

Last edited by nhat; 01-16-2009 at 05:27 PM.
nhat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2009, 05:30 PM   #3
Counterfit
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 124254
Join Date: Aug 2006
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Rhode Island
Vehicle:
2006 06 SGM Slowbaru
"The Scoobinator"

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PitwrkzZ1 View Post
Discuss any type of karting in here!

My local indoor track (GPNY) has 6.5 hp Sodi RX7 karts. I'm getting pretty good laptimes (about a second off the lap records for both tracks) but one thing I still haven't really got is how to slide correctly, which is really important considering that there are high speed runs following where the slide would give me good exit speeds.

I understand the whole weight transfer concept, but I cant seem to put it into practice...what si the correct procedure? Brake then slide? How far should I go into the corner? Also, the kart often dies on me (revs go way down) on corner exit when i think I'm getting a good slide...why would that happen?

BTW, it seems to me that karting is more like rally than road racing. Anybody else get this feeling? haha

Track map
Were you there for the Garage419 Invitational?
Counterfit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2009, 06:01 PM   #4
PitwrkzZ1
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 94316
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Northern Westchester
Vehicle:
2002 WRX

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Counterfit View Post
Were you there for the Garage419 Invitational?
I was there. They raffled off the last two spots in the race, and the ticket that was called was 005. Mine was 006

I have raced with Matt Farah before though. His cameraman (I forget his name, but his username on here is Trademark and he has an RSTi) is a really good driver.
PitwrkzZ1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2009, 06:37 PM   #5
PaCmAn84
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 136675
Join Date: Jan 2007
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: I'm with your mother
Default

I was at GPNY for ther 3hr evet last year were you there?
PaCmAn84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2009, 06:38 PM   #6
chimchimm5
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 88501
Join Date: Jun 2005
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: NorCal
Vehicle:
2011 WRX Hatch
Dark Grey

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PitwrkzZ1 View Post
Discuss any type of karting in here!

My local indoor track (GPNY) has 6.5 hp Sodi RX7 karts. I'm getting pretty good laptimes (about a second off the lap records for both tracks) but one thing I still haven't really got is how to slide correctly, which is really important considering that there are high speed runs following where the slide would give me good exit speeds.

I understand the whole weight transfer concept, but I cant seem to put it into practice...what si the correct procedure? Brake then slide? How far should I go into the corner? Also, the kart often dies on me (revs go way down) on corner exit when i think I'm getting a good slide...why would that happen?

BTW, it seems to me that karting is more like rally than road racing. Anybody else get this feeling? haha
It sounds like you're talking about indoor recreational karting.... a leisure activity I like to participate in. Here's what I've come up with and I'd love to hear what more experience/skilled people respond with.

- Karts don't have "suspensions" so weight shift mostly consists only of the compliance of the tires. However, what's completely different about a kart from a car is that you can dynamically add a whole 'nother dimension to weight shift by shifting the weight of the DRIVER. This is significant. Lean OUT in the turns to weigh down the outer wheels. Adjust your lean to which wheel needs the traction.

- Karts don't turn like cars. The front steering is design such that when the steering is turned it causes the kart to sit on 3 wheels (2 front, 1 outside rear) This has the effect of "sliding" the rear in order to turn... this is where the "like rally" part comes in.

- Karts often only have brakes on the REAR axel. This makes the braking system significantly less effective than a car... which means sliding sideways can be (not always) just effective (or more) than straight braking. It all depends. But there are a lot of kart tracks that are "don't brake" tracks.

- All kart turning is part of your braking zone (both straight and trail braking). Think of the racing line. If you are still turning and not in a braking zone, you didn't do it right.

- The kart braking/turning means this is totally different from a car. In a car, you straight brake hard which causes the nose to dive. From the dive, you roll into turn in (while coming off brake) and this sets you up for the turn. In a kart, dive is almost negligible. Since turning is done by mechanically kicking the rear out, I imagine this is more similar to using throttle oversteer to swing the tail around on a high powered RWD car.

- Karts tend to be "under powered" so momentum preservation is of utmost importance. If you're bogging the engine, consider a different line that better preserves your kart momentum and engine momentum.

Quote:
How far should I go into the corner? Also, the kart often dies on me (revs go way down) on corner exit when i think I'm getting a good slide...why would that happen?
You are not slowing sufficiently early enough. The point that is the "slowest velocity" the kart will be going should be well before the apex. If you are "dead" on corner exit, then you are sliding wide and didn't slow early enough, get on the gas and straighten early enough, and hit your apex properly. Your slide, while fun, is killing your lap time.

The moment you are describe is what faster drivers utilize to pass people bogging down. They know you're going to make that mistake so they'll drive a later apex coordinated with your position so that when you bog, they pass you on the inside.

Last edited by chimchimm5; 01-16-2009 at 06:51 PM.
chimchimm5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2009, 09:01 PM   #7
Blåbil
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 48362
Join Date: Nov 2003
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Metro DC area
Vehicle:
240 volvo brick
03 wrb/gold impreza

Default

My company just went there this afternoon for 120 laps, I'm completely hooked on this now. Ended up getting first place averaging low 25 sec laps. Had a total blast!

Quote:
Originally Posted by nhat View Post
here's our karting spot in northern va - http://www.allsportsgp.com

the track is pretty slick and last time i was there, 4 sub-24.5 laps are what's required to qualify for the super karts. i missed it by 1 lap the only time we hit the brakes on this track is going into turn 1. tap the brakes, get the rear out, and then get on the gas through the turn.

i want to check out this place in DE - http://www.midatlanticgrandprix.com/
Blåbil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2009, 09:11 PM   #8
flyboymike
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 83765
Join Date: Mar 2005
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: The modern Yellow Peril
Vehicle:
2005 WRX wagon
WR Blue

Default

http://www.americanindoorkarting.com/

Multiple tracks, 6hp and 9hp super karts... lots of fun. 1.5 seconds to go to qualify for the 9 hp!

I've done Allsport as well. Good times.
flyboymike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2009, 10:09 PM   #9
nhat
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 140163
Join Date: Feb 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: 3MI Racing
Vehicle:
03 STi
hellaflunctional

Default

i want to head down to richmond to try out gforce - http://www.gforcekarts.com/
nhat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2009, 10:25 PM   #10
blue blurr
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 51111
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: eating nastysocks
Default

I use my old Energy Parilla for testing. It's no where near competitive anymore, but it still is a great training tool. I'm thinking about picking up a new chassis and a Rotax motor to start racing that, but cars are taking all my funding...




Last edited by blue blurr; 01-17-2009 at 01:31 AM.
blue blurr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2009, 10:47 PM   #11
Snowphun
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 1800
Join Date: Jul 2000
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Way South Shore MA
Vehicle:
WRX /WRX/Cooper S
awd/awd/fwd

Default

Indoor karting certainly has its place, but it is expensive and pretty frustrating given the massive differences between the karts.

I'd recommend getting yourself out to NJ Motorsports and renting a Rotax for an afternoon. These are pretty tame compared to ICC but make the indoor karts look like toys in comparison. I run a Rotax at F1 Outdoor and it is a great way to get into real wheel to wheel racing very quickly.

http://www.njmotorsportspark.com/karting.html
Snowphun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 12:46 AM   #12
brianmcd
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 52144
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Blacksburg/Richmond, Va
Vehicle:
05 STi
95 Spec3

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nhat View Post
i want to head down to richmond to try out gforce - http://www.gforcekarts.com/
GForce is pretty fun. It's not a slick track like Allsports. I've done GForce, Allsports, and AIK, and AIK is my favorite. AIK has 2 tracks, which they combine into the "supertrack" on some nights. It's a ton of fun. GForce just doesn't have that many turns. There's really only 2 turns and 1 little left-right complex where you aren't wide open throttle. I wish they'd reconfigure the track to make it more interesting.
brianmcd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2009, 01:34 AM   #13
jimmi
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 172959
Join Date: Feb 2008
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Franklin, TN
Vehicle:
2008 08 EVO XGSR, 01
EclipseGT SDS, 15 Mazda6

Default

The indoor karts are fun...in my experience, you are the victim of the setup at whatever place you go and if you get one with good or bad power. Not their fault but it is difficult to get these things really close. I have always found that underpowered karts benefit from increased castor because the cornering in a live axel kart is governed by how fast and when they pick up the inside rear wheel. When underpowered, the worst thing the kart does is accelerate (best thing it does is corner followed by braking) so you want to almost never take your foot off the gas. For indoor, concrete karts I have driven, they push most of the time so you have to try and induce oversteer to get them to pivot in the corners...usually they respond well to sort of chucking them in a way where they don't bog. You can try and use a slide to roll off speed on entry but I always learn a track backward out of a corners....get the exit right, then the midpoint of the corner so that you are correctly setup for exit and the entry as fast as you can and stay undercontrol not to screw up the mid point and exit. rental karts don't accelerate very well so every fraction of a second you wait to go to power you pay for at the end of the straight.

As an aside, I have always found that karts with more power and low stall clutches or direct drive are more rewarding to drive because they allow you to do more with your driving. Additionally, you can set the kart up (or buy the kart) that fits your driving style and body type. Short fat drivers need different basic characteristics than short thin people and tall thin people etc. I always like one that has a very positive front end so shift wieght arouth the front pretty quickly but I am not that tall. Very tall people induce a bit of understeer because they raise the center of gravity and usually benefit from a stiffer kart than I like.....

If you really are getting into it you should look into buying a kart of your own and go racing. IMO it is the best way to get into motorsports. Karts are a blast, relatively cheap to own, hard to get hurt in and will out run most cars...even race prepared karts. For example, I sat on pole for the 1998 (yes been a while but, hey I have just finished up medical school so not that much time for racing right now) International Federation Karting Winter Olympics with a time that was 5 SECONDS faster than the fastest SCCA car (ZR1 corvette I believe) from the previous weekend. I actually don't recall a single track where we were slower than the cars that ran the same track.

Still do some racing myself but not near as much...here is a pict of me from the Robopong 200 2007 that was broadcast on SpeedTV. Some of the entries included indy car drivers Scott Dixon, Dan Weldon, Grahm Rahal and Jeff Simmons:
jimmi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2009, 09:36 AM   #14
TimStevens
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 4817
Join Date: Mar 2001
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Albanyish, NY
Vehicle:
2012 STI, '02 WRX
'91 MR2, '05 Speed Triple

Default

Giving this a bump as I'm pondering getting into karting... as in buying a kart and going to an outdoor track. What are you guys running, and is there any gotchas I should avoid getting into it?

Closest to me seems to be http://www.ovrp.com/, and it seems I need to get down there and take a class, try it out, etc.
TimStevens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2009, 09:40 AM   #15
mav1c
Hoodbridge!
Moderator
 
Member#: 560
Join Date: Nov 1999
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Woodbridge, VA
Vehicle:
2006 STi, '11 A4
Crystal Gray, Silver

Default

I'd definitley like to try a "real" kart, but have only done "recreational" karting at AllSports and VIR. I really want to try NJMP F1 next time I'm there.

Video from this past Tuesday at AllSports.
mav1c is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2009, 10:02 AM   #16
boost junkie
Top Scoob 009
 
Member#: 68273
Join Date: Aug 2004
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Silver Spring, MD
Vehicle:
2012 WRX
GD Race Car in progress

Default

Tim, you should come out to summit point next time we go karting. Not quite as nice as NJMP but it's a lot closer and still 100000000000x better than indoor.
boost junkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2009, 10:33 AM   #17
TimStevens
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 4817
Join Date: Mar 2001
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Albanyish, NY
Vehicle:
2012 STI, '02 WRX
'91 MR2, '05 Speed Triple

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by boost junkie View Post
Tim, you should come out to summit point next time we go karting. Not quite as nice as NJMP but it's a lot closer and still 100000000000x better than indoor.
Sounds like fun, but that's > 7 hrs from me
TimStevens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2009, 11:52 AM   #18
Snowphun
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 1800
Join Date: Jul 2000
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Way South Shore MA
Vehicle:
WRX /WRX/Cooper S
awd/awd/fwd

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mav1c View Post
I'd definitley like to try a "real" kart, but have only done "recreational" karting at AllSports and VIR. I really want to try NJMP F1 next time I'm there.
Does NJMP F1 rent "real karts"? I know they have consession rentals which aren't really any different than the indoor karts. FI Outdoors Boston does not rent proper karts but there are vendors who will set you up with everything you need during open practices.

Tim, OVRP is a good place, nice people. If you want to head out to eastern MA I can get you in touch with an arrive and drive setup and you'll get way more seat time than you can use. Tuesday practice runs from noon - 6pm in the summer and is empty. Hours of neck stretching seat time.
Snowphun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2009, 11:53 AM   #19
mav1c
Hoodbridge!
Moderator
 
Member#: 560
Join Date: Nov 1999
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Woodbridge, VA
Vehicle:
2006 STi, '11 A4
Crystal Gray, Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimStevens View Post
Sounds like fun, but that's > 7 hrs from me
I think he was referring to me.
mav1c is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-24-2009, 01:16 PM   #20
TimStevens
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 4817
Join Date: Mar 2001
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Albanyish, NY
Vehicle:
2012 STI, '02 WRX
'91 MR2, '05 Speed Triple

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowphun View Post
Tim, OVRP is a good place, nice people. If you want to head out to eastern MA I can get you in touch with an arrive and drive setup and you'll get way more seat time than you can use. Tuesday practice runs from noon - 6pm in the summer and is empty. Hours of neck stretching seat time.
Hmm, possibly. I feel like I should just get down to OVRP and get a feel for how things operate. I also read that someone signed up for the one-day training program and got to try out a bunch of different kart types, which would be great too. Now that I know what TAG means ( ) I've heard its the way to go. I had thought about jumping into a shifter since I'm pretty familiar with sequential gearboxes already, but everyone's saying not to go there to start. I'd still like to try one, though...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mav1c View Post
I think he was referring to me.
TimStevens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2009, 12:02 PM   #21
TimStevens
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 4817
Join Date: Mar 2001
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Albanyish, NY
Vehicle:
2012 STI, '02 WRX
'91 MR2, '05 Speed Triple

Default

Signed up for a school one week from today at OVRP. Can't wait!
TimStevens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2009, 01:37 PM   #22
Snowphun
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 1800
Join Date: Jul 2000
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Way South Shore MA
Vehicle:
WRX /WRX/Cooper S
awd/awd/fwd

Default

Good deal Tim, you'll have a blast. It's an interesting track, not super fast but a lot to do. I'd recommend you do the lesson in a Rotax, or at least a TAG kart. I did their school (8?) years ago and used a glorified concession kart, not quite the same thing.

Looks like I won't get out there until mid September at the earliest.
Snowphun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2009, 01:43 PM   #23
TimStevens
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 4817
Join Date: Mar 2001
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Albanyish, NY
Vehicle:
2012 STI, '02 WRX
'91 MR2, '05 Speed Triple

Default

Thanks, and I hope it'll be a helluva better than that for the money they're charging.

I definitely want to do it in a TAG, and Rotax if possible, since that's what I'm thinking I'll wind up with once I take the plunge and buy something.

Still need to call Tim down there and work out the details.
TimStevens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2009, 08:20 PM   #24
Snowphun
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 1800
Join Date: Jul 2000
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Way South Shore MA
Vehicle:
WRX /WRX/Cooper S
awd/awd/fwd

Default

I still have my Fullerton chassis sitting in the basement (I pulled the engine for spares). OVRP was (is?) the US importer so they were very common there. Drop any old TAG on it and off you go. Just remember if you go anything other than Rotax you can't run at F1.
Snowphun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2009, 08:30 PM   #25
TimStevens
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 4817
Join Date: Mar 2001
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Albanyish, NY
Vehicle:
2012 STI, '02 WRX
'91 MR2, '05 Speed Triple

Default

Should I make the check out to you or the Mrs?

Will catch up with ya afterward and see if you're looking to get rid of it.
TimStevens is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
KARTING THREAD indoor/outdoor FAST4 Mid West Subaru Owners Club Forum -- MWSOC 5 02-10-2010 06:53 PM
Winter Kart season thread, come and join the fun raamaudio Rocky Mountains Impreza Club Forum -- RMIC 2 11-17-2008 06:37 PM
The B4D Friday Karting Thread rogue Off-Topic 518 05-05-2008 02:42 PM
SoCal Kart Thread whesung Southern California Impreza Club Forum -- SCIC 33 07-23-2007 01:54 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:50 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2015 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2015, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.