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Old 10-26-2011, 03:53 AM   #1401
TurismoLou
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitford View Post
Thanks for the input. Can you recommend a good site to be browsing for this type of vehicle?
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f153/

http://www.jk-forum.com/forumdisplay...ler&order=desc

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=36
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Old 10-26-2011, 04:38 AM   #1402
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Figured i should probably chime in since myself and my car are being debated. Not trying to start a huge debate as what always happens on NASIOC but wanted to put my piece to clear up some of the confusion/misconceptions. Not here to debate my pricing! That is reserved for a potential buyer and myself.

BTW, some VERY nice XJs on here, makes me want to keep mine! Going to miss the XJ community, a lot of very friendly individuals.

Will

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitford View Post
Would I be stupid to buy/trade for this thing?:

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2256126
Of course not

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cody06 View Post
It's not "bro-lifted" as most of those rigs would break 1,000 things if you took it down a trail - these are definately trail mods.
Ill take this as a compliment

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitford View Post
This is interesting:

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2238342

Another thread for an XJ but this advertises a 99 for sale, not a 2000. Also, it's cheaper and white but with the same mileage? What am I missing here?
That is one of my other Cherokees, i also had a red 99 (sadly it was totaled by some idiot on his cellphone that hit me). Sold the white one because there was no need for two cherokees. Mileage was a coincidence.

For the record this one sold for $9,750.

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Originally Posted by Cody06 View Post
Very peculiar indeed.

I suspect Nigerians will contact you to arrange shipping somehow.
Yeah pretty sure my english is too good.
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Old 10-26-2011, 08:27 AM   #1403
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Originally Posted by Slow5oh View Post
I'm hoping she pics the 80 series since there is a clean, well maintained, and locked one in Colorado that I'm itching to get her. Already got approval from my credit union too!
Wow really, you need to take out a lien on an at least 14 year old truck? I really hope that clean one you buy doesn't need the typical 80 baselining which tends to be another couple grand on top of the truck to make it factory fresh.
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Old 10-26-2011, 10:09 AM   #1404
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Whitty-
Being in SoCal if you don't buy an LJ or a JK I'll kick you in the junk.
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Old 10-26-2011, 10:12 AM   #1405
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Owning a Jeep is the fastest way to becoming a mechanic, especially if you want to take it on the trail. You will break stuff, no matter how well built it is, or how careful you drive, just a matter of time.

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Old 10-26-2011, 10:22 AM   #1406
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Whitford: If you're shopping for an XJ, this is what you want:

98 or 99 I6 without ABS, which means it comes with the Chrysler 8.25" rear end. It's substantially stronger than the D35.

98-99 have the high pinion D30 front axle which makes lifting it easier (2000-2001 have the low pinion version), and the 2000-2001 cylinder head casting is known to crack.

If you're into XJ's like I am, check out NAXJA.ORG, it's a great forum.
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Old 10-26-2011, 10:32 AM   #1407
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The HPD30 was all the years IIRC, it's just VAC and Ujoint size that was different on early XJ's
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Old 10-26-2011, 10:36 AM   #1408
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Originally Posted by Sideshowbob View Post
The HPD30 was all the years IIRC, it's just VAC and Ujoint size that was different on early XJ's
Yeah, the HPD30 was all the years... except 2000 and 2001
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Old 10-26-2011, 10:52 AM   #1409
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LoL they went to the LP?
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Old 10-26-2011, 11:07 AM   #1410
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Yep, here's a good list from over on NAXJA:

Quote:
Axles

Front Axles
Dana 30 high pinion 1984-1999. Reverse cut gears, 27 spline, 1.16" diameter shafts, 7.13" ring gear. Non-ABS axles are vacuum disconnect through 1991. All 1992-2001 are non-disconnect. 1989-95 with ABS and all 1995-2001 have 5-297x u-joints, all others have 5-260x u-joints.

Dana 30 low pinion TJ style used 2000-01. Standard cut gears - 27 spline, 1.16" diameter shafts, 7.13" ring gear, 5-297x u-joints.

5-297x and 5-760x u-joints interchange.

Rear Axles
Note: Dana 35 axles are sometimes referred to as Dana 35C - The "C" does not stand for c-clip. It stands for "custom" meaning it came from Dana unfinished.
Note: Chrysler 8.25 c-clip axles - none of these axles were used on XJs with ABS brakes. If you have ABS, you have the Dana 35. Without ABS you could have either axle, Chry 8.25 or D35.


Dana 35 non c-clip - 27 spline, 1.18" diameter shafts, 7.58" ring gear, 2.62" axle tube - used 84-89
Dana 35 c-clip - 27 spline, 1.18" diameter shafts, 7.58" ring gear, 2.62" axle tube - used 90-01
Chrysler 8.25 - 27 spline, 1.17" diameter shafts, 8.25" ring gear, 3" axle tube - used 91-96
Chrysler 8.25 - 29 spline, 1.21" diameter shafts, 8.25" ring gear, 3" axle tube - used 97-01
Dana 44 non c-clip - 30 spline, 1.31" diameter shafts, 8.5" ring gear, 2.75" axle tube - used 87-89 on some (not all) XJs equipped with towing package.
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Old 10-26-2011, 11:17 AM   #1411
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Wow really, you need to take out a lien on an at least 14 year old truck? I really hope that clean one you buy doesn't need the typical 80 baselining which tends to be another couple grand on top of the truck to make it factory fresh.
This. Factor in the potential front axle rebuild ( which just about all 80s need when you buy them) too.

I think my baseline and fixing on the 80 that I bought ran me a total of 3100 and change, but that's a little above and beyond the norm. I put in a 2wd kit, new shafts/birfs and had new driveshafts made with CVs instead of the stock style as mine was lifted beyond shims.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shavenyak View Post
Whitford: If you're shopping for an XJ, this is what you want:

98 or 99 I6 without ABS, which means it comes with the Chrysler 8.25" rear end. It's substantially stronger than the D35.

98-99 have the high pinion D30 front axle which makes lifting it easier (2000-2001 have the low pinion version), and the 2000-2001 cylinder head casting is known to crack.

If you're into XJ's like I am, check out NAXJA.ORG, it's a great forum.
I wouldnt focus so much on getting the 8.25, a d44 rear axle swap is cake on an xj. 98-99 are the cherry years, the best of all worlds. The 99 intake manifold was the best that was ever on a 4.0L cherokee.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sideshowbob View Post
LoL they went to the LP?
yup. to match the tj and lower production costs. It's a real pile of poop.

Thankfully 77-79 f250 axles swap into an xj quite easily ( although not as easy as a yj) . It makes going full width not too terrible of a headache. The only thing you absolutely need to buy bracket wise to make it happen is a "bridge" to go over the center section on the front axle so you dont have to worry about welding to cast.



Btw whitford - that XJ is ENORMOUSLY overpriced for what it is. the parts are mostly garbage. That price range is ls1 swapped , full width with arb lockers and an atlas tcase territory.

I'd pass and not look back. I'd pay 6 at the top end for that thing and end up with close to 4 more in it to set it up properly.

Hell, if you want one that bad, I'll find one locally in nashville that is stock and not too abused. you buy it and buy whatever parts you want on it. I'll bring it over to my house and install whatever you want in it. pick it up next time you're in town. I'll bet ya we could find something worth building for 4-5. a the lift, tires, gears, etc ( the important stuff) might run you 4-5 for nice high quality stuff. I'll build you bumpers and sliders if you want them. You'll save 4 grand and get a road trip from TN to cali out of it. plus there are still some fun wheeling spots in eastern tn. hell we could buy one with a popped motor and replace the 4.0 and it could be even cheaper.

You dont have to pay me a dime, I like working on stuff. you can bring over a case of abita and get me on the list next time your pops plays locally. you just have to work with me on timing because this would be a free time type thing and I need to get my galaxie back on the road first.

Last edited by zombiekiller; 10-26-2011 at 11:27 AM.
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Old 10-26-2011, 11:41 AM   #1412
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Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
I wouldnt focus so much on getting the 8.25, a d44 rear axle swap is cake on an xj. 98-99 are the cherry years, the best of all worlds. The 99 intake manifold was the best that was ever on a 4.0L cherokee.
Yep I usually pay 300-400 for the axle. I have swapped several.

Take 99 insert D44 from xj.

TJ rubicon D44 swaps right into the front, you can buy a bare housing fairly cheap, use your D30 brakes... and just buy gears/carrier/locker and you cut your costs in half.

Then your good up to 37"tires as long as you dont abuse the skinny pedal.
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Old 10-26-2011, 11:43 AM   #1413
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Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
This. Factor in the potential front axle rebuild ( which just about all 80s need when you buy them) too.

I think my baseline and fixing on the 80 that I bought ran me a total of 3100 and change, but that's a little above and beyond the norm. I put in a 2wd kit, new shafts/birfs and had new driveshafts made with CVs instead of the stock style as mine was lifted beyond shims.

Yeah, yours is a bit more over the top than your typical front axle rebuilding which normally doesn't require new birfs ($450 each brand new). The front and rear axle job is a typical $1,200 if done by a professional. If you want to do brakes at the same time, tack on another $500 or so in rotors and pads.

Headgasket, look for another $1500 in parts and labor. Rebuilding the head is optional but that's another $300 right there if you want it perfect.

Cooling system in the 80s are old. Most owners neglect them. A full overhaul which can cost another $500 in just parts alone. This is a DIY. Not hard at all.

AC, prepare your angus. I am leaving mine broken. I ain't ready to tackle the **** show just yet.

Power steering, PHH, fan clutch, e-brake, these are also other know failures mostly because of age. Crap adds up. But once it is all sorted out, it's a great truck to own....well, besides the 12mpg.
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Old 10-26-2011, 11:56 AM   #1414
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Originally Posted by express_wagon View Post
Yeah, yours is a bit more over the top than your typical front axle rebuilding which normally doesn't require new birfs ($450 each brand new). The front and rear axle job is a typical $1,200 if done by a professional. If you want to do brakes at the same time, tack on another $500 or so in rotors and pads.

Headgasket, look for another $1500 in parts and labor. Rebuilding the head is optional but that's another $300 right there if you want it perfect.

Cooling system in the 80s are old. Most owners neglect them. A full overhaul which can cost another $500 in just parts alone. This is a DIY. Not hard at all.

AC, prepare your angus. I am leaving mine broken. I ain't ready to tackle the **** show just yet.

Power steering, PHH, fan clutch, e-brake, these are also other know failures mostly because of age. Crap adds up. But once it is all sorted out, it's a great truck to own....well, besides the 12mpg.
oh i miss mine, dont get me wrong. i do not miss the 12 mpg and constant need to carry around 2 tool boxes to ensure that i'll make it home.

If i could find one with a popped motor for about a grand and swap the drivetrain out for an LSx or a diesel on the cheap, i'd be all for it.
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Old 10-26-2011, 11:58 AM   #1415
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Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
If i could find one with a popped motor for about a grand and swap the drivetrain out for an LSx or a diesel on the cheap, i'd be all for it.
cheap? I don't think so.

There are no kits for these things. Every single one is a project and will probably overrun you 300%. And you'll need to carry 3 tool boxes with a drawer full of spare parts.
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Old 10-26-2011, 12:20 PM   #1416
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cheap? I don't think so.

There are no kits for these things. Every single one is a project and will probably overrun you 300%. And you'll need to carry 3 tool boxes with a drawer full of spare parts.
I don't particularly need a "kit" . A reman toyota motor for an LC ( if you're paying someone to drop in a jasper) will run somewhere around 4 grand.

i could get an ls1, 4l60 and wiring harness for it for around 2300 . Add another 2 grand for the finishing parts, steel and consumables and i still call it " on the cheap" . The only moderately difficult part is either getting an adapter for trans to tcase or machining one myself.

I've already swapped a 4bt into an 86. I just bought a bread truck. it cost me under 3500 soup to nuts.

if i grabbed a chevy truck with a 5.3 at an insurance auction, i'm sure i could get the price down even more if i modified the original harness instead of buying.

its nice to have a large 2 car garage and a fairly nice fabrication tool set!
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Old 10-26-2011, 01:29 PM   #1417
Whitford
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Originally Posted by 1FSTREX View Post
Figured i should probably chime in since myself and my car are being debated. Not trying to start a huge debate as what always happens on NASIOC but wanted to put my piece to clear up some of the confusion/misconceptions. Not here to debate my pricing! That is reserved for a potential buyer and myself.

BTW, some VERY nice XJs on here, makes me want to keep mine! Going to miss the XJ community, a lot of very friendly individuals.

Will

Of course not

Ill take this as a compliment

That is one of my other Cherokees, i also had a red 99 (sadly it was totaled by some idiot on his cellphone that hit me). Sold the white one because there was no need for two cherokees. Mileage was a coincidence.

For the record this one sold for $9,750.

Yeah pretty sure my english is too good.
Thanks for chiming in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sideshowbob View Post
Whitty-
Being in SoCal if you don't buy an LJ or a JK I'll kick you in the junk.
Why is that? I'm definitely open to a Wrangler.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Phenx View Post
Owning a Jeep is the fastest way to becoming a mechanic, especially if you want to take it on the trail. You will break stuff, no matter how well built it is, or how careful you drive, just a matter of time.

Yeah, I'm a bit concerned about that as I'm no mechanic. I will be taking it to trails but not excessively.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shavenyak View Post
Whitford: If you're shopping for an XJ, this is what you want:

98 or 99 I6 without ABS, which means it comes with the Chrysler 8.25" rear end. It's substantially stronger than the D35.

98-99 have the high pinion D30 front axle which makes lifting it easier (2000-2001 have the low pinion version), and the 2000-2001 cylinder head casting is known to crack.

If you're into XJ's like I am, check out NAXJA.ORG, it's a great forum.
Thanks for the input!

Quote:
Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
I wouldnt focus so much on getting the 8.25, a d44 rear axle swap is cake on an xj. 98-99 are the cherry years, the best of all worlds. The 99 intake manifold was the best that was ever on a 4.0L cherokee.

yup. to match the tj and lower production costs. It's a real pile of poop.

Thankfully 77-79 f250 axles swap into an xj quite easily ( although not as easy as a yj) . It makes going full width not too terrible of a headache. The only thing you absolutely need to buy bracket wise to make it happen is a "bridge" to go over the center section on the front axle so you dont have to worry about welding to cast.

Btw whitford - that XJ is ENORMOUSLY overpriced for what it is. the parts are mostly garbage. That price range is ls1 swapped , full width with arb lockers and an atlas tcase territory.

I'd pass and not look back. I'd pay 6 at the top end for that thing and end up with close to 4 more in it to set it up properly.

Hell, if you want one that bad, I'll find one locally in nashville that is stock and not too abused. you buy it and buy whatever parts you want on it. I'll bring it over to my house and install whatever you want in it. pick it up next time you're in town. I'll bet ya we could find something worth building for 4-5. a the lift, tires, gears, etc ( the important stuff) might run you 4-5 for nice high quality stuff. I'll build you bumpers and sliders if you want them. You'll save 4 grand and get a road trip from TN to cali out of it. plus there are still some fun wheeling spots in eastern tn. hell we could buy one with a popped motor and replace the 4.0 and it could be even cheaper.

You dont have to pay me a dime, I like working on stuff. you can bring over a case of abita and get me on the list next time your pops plays locally. you just have to work with me on timing because this would be a free time type thing and I need to get my galaxie back on the road first.
Alright, thanks for the input regarding the silver XJ. I think you're right. It's too bad because the seller seems like a really nice guy. I'd be all over it if it were competitively priced.

Plus, I think I would be getting in over my head with that list of parts. I'd rather get something like you said, something near stock with little to no abuse and then modify it myself over time.

And thank you for your offer, which is awesome. I'd love to take you up on it as I know what can be had out there. But alas, I am in a bit of a rush and would like to sell my car ASAP. So I'm probably going to be looking locally for something.

Is it a bad idea altogether for someone like me with little mechanical know-how to even be thinking about stepping into this realm? Or should I just stop being a girl? Are these things (XJ's, etc.) really that unreliable?

The last Jeep I spent time with was my dad's 96 Wrangler and we never had a problem with it.

BTW, zombiekiller, my dad just found an 89 Ford pickup down there with 22k original miles on it for less than $1000. I was so jealous.
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Old 10-26-2011, 01:40 PM   #1418
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Why is that? I'm definitely open to a Wrangler.
Because driving with the top off and doors off is ****ing awesome. I miss the season already, and you have a year round season for it.

If you want a Wrangler I would say this is the order-

LJ Rubicon
LJ (with a D44 rear only)
TJ Rubicon
TJ (with a D44 rear only)
JK


LJ Rubicon would put you into a vehicle that you could wheel pretty hard with just a $1,000 lift, some skids, and some 33's.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitford View Post
Is it a bad idea altogether for someone like me with little mechanical know-how to even be thinking about stepping into this realm? Or should I just stop being a girl? Are these things (XJ's, etc.) really that unreliable?
Nah, they are super easy and rewarding to work on. No overly tight spaces or other nonsense.

I don't think of them as unreliable, but they have their quirks. I would NOT buy a JK that has the first Pentastar in it, they are ****. That pretty much means buying a brandy new JK unless you can find one of the rare ones with the 4.0L Straight Six.


Nice mods but overpriced-
http://ventura.craigslist.org/cto/2641294540.html

TJ Rubi-
http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/cto/2583518512.html

Another TJ Rubi-
http://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst...638401645.html
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Old 10-26-2011, 01:47 PM   #1419
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Thanks for the info and links! That second car is definitely more of my price range.
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Old 10-26-2011, 01:48 PM   #1420
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Keep in mind the LJ has a 17" more wheelbase (space), you pay a premium for that. I have seen LJ's for much less than that.

Here-
http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/cto/2668779342.html

Edit- he is a Jesus freak too, usually those people are anal about their stuff.

Last edited by Sideshowbob; 10-26-2011 at 01:54 PM.
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Old 10-26-2011, 02:30 PM   #1421
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitford View Post
Thanks for chiming in.



Why is that? I'm definitely open to a Wrangler.



Yeah, I'm a bit concerned about that as I'm no mechanic. I will be taking it to trails but not excessively.



Thanks for the input!



Alright, thanks for the input regarding the silver XJ. I think you're right. It's too bad because the seller seems like a really nice guy. I'd be all over it if it were competitively priced.

Plus, I think I would be getting in over my head with that list of parts. I'd rather get something like you said, something near stock with little to no abuse and then modify it myself over time.

And thank you for your offer, which is awesome. I'd love to take you up on it as I know what can be had out there. But alas, I am in a bit of a rush and would like to sell my car ASAP. So I'm probably going to be looking locally for something.

Is it a bad idea altogether for someone like me with little mechanical know-how to even be thinking about stepping into this realm? Or should I just stop being a girl? Are these things (XJ's, etc.) really that unreliable?

The last Jeep I spent time with was my dad's 96 Wrangler and we never had a problem with it.

BTW, zombiekiller, my dad just found an 89 Ford pickup down there with 22k original miles on it for less than $1000. I was so jealous.
i learned alot of wrenching skills on jeeps. They are a perfect " learn to wrench" vehicle. Not much changed over the 18 year cherokee run.

specifics did, but you'll learn them by researching. Just please please please, ask or email or send a carrier pigeon when you find one you like. I looked for an xj for rachel for a while. I think i went to look at about 20 of them. each of the 20, regardless of price, has major issues that you probably wouldnt want to deal with.

I went to look at one, 71K original miles, it was a 60th anniversary edition. Looked great inside and out, till i took one look at the radiator overflow bottle and noticed that it was literally full of oil.

When i pointed it out to the guy, he goes " i'll knock $50 so you can get a replacement bottle without oil in it" and this jeep was priced at almost 9 grand. I paid 7800 for a 98 xj with 40K on it in 2002. no way in hell i'm paying almost 10 grand for a 10 year old jeep with serious motor issues.

if your pop finds another truck like that down here, please let me know. I'll go buy it in a heartbeat.

p.s. jeep 91 and newer 4.0L/aw4 combos are one of the most reliable, bulletproof setups ever produced if they've been properly cared for.

the 4.0 L basic design has been around since 1964 and has what some would call an "extra " main bearing ( it has 7, most 6 cyls have 6).

I've seen an almost stock aw4 trans take a lot of drivetrain shock from an almost 500hp motor pushing a wrangler on 39 inch bfg krawlers going up a rock face that was almost near vertical.

they're tough.
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Old 10-26-2011, 02:45 PM   #1422
TurismoLou
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sideshowbob View Post
Keep in mind the LJ has a 17" more wheelbase (space), you pay a premium for that. I have seen LJ's for much less than that.

Here-
http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/cto/2668779342.html

Edit- he is a Jesus freak too, usually those people are anal about their stuff.
What do you mean "those" people?














































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Old 10-26-2011, 02:48 PM   #1423
Whitford
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sideshowbob View Post
Keep in mind the LJ has a 17" more wheelbase (space), you pay a premium for that. I have seen LJ's for much less than that.

Here-
http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/cto/2668779342.html

Edit- he is a Jesus freak too, usually those people are anal about their stuff.
Oh snap, that would be near perfect if it were a manual and a bit cheaper. I still need to see what I can get for my car and that won't be until this weekend when I give Carmax a try for the first time. Figure it can't hurt to get a free appraisal but KBB estimates I can get 20k in a private sale.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zombiekiller View Post
i learned alot of wrenching skills on jeeps. They are a perfect " learn to wrench" vehicle. Not much changed over the 18 year cherokee run.

specifics did, but you'll learn them by researching. Just please please please, ask or email or send a carrier pigeon when you find one you like. I looked for an xj for rachel for a while. I think i went to look at about 20 of them. each of the 20, regardless of price, has major issues that you probably wouldnt want to deal with.

I went to look at one, 71K original miles, it was a 60th anniversary edition. Looked great inside and out, till i took one look at the radiator overflow bottle and noticed that it was literally full of oil.

When i pointed it out to the guy, he goes " i'll knock $50 so you can get a replacement bottle without oil in it" and this jeep was priced at almost 9 grand. I paid 7800 for a 98 xj with 40K on it in 2002. no way in hell i'm paying almost 10 grand for a 10 year old jeep with serious motor issues.

if your pop finds another truck like that down here, please let me know. I'll go buy it in a heartbeat.

p.s. jeep 91 and newer 4.0L/aw4 combos are one of the most reliable, bulletproof setups ever produced if they've been properly cared for.

the 4.0 L basic design has been around since 1964 and has what some would call an "extra " main bearing ( it has 7, most 6 cyls have 6).

I've seen an almost stock aw4 trans take a lot of drivetrain shock from an almost 500hp motor pushing a wrangler on 39 inch bfg krawlers going up a rock face that was almost near vertical.

they're tough.
Thanks bud, I really appreciate the input.
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Old 10-26-2011, 02:53 PM   #1424
TurismoLou
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Anti-hybrid

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Ooh, get a Wrangler Whitty, do eet
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Old 10-26-2011, 02:54 PM   #1425
Whitford
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That one that sideshow linked is really nice.
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