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Old 02-21-2009, 05:27 PM   #1
sponaugle
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 4498
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Portland, Oregon
Vehicle:
WRX H6-3.0 Turbo
www.surgelinetuning.com

Default A little GT30 .63 action..

I recently switched from the .82 A/R turbine housing to the .63 A/R turbine housing on my GT30R equipped 08 STI. Since I recently put in a new shortblock, I decided to do a tune to get a good pump fuel map to drive around on. Nothing crazy, just a good 21-22psi pump map.

I thought I would share a few of the details and log.

Mods:
2008 STI
Cobb AP v 2, with Speed Density Software
Perrin GT3076R .63 Kit
Perrin FMIC + Intake
DW 850cc Injectors
Perrin Fuel Rails
Walbro 255 Pump
Perrin Headers
Perrin Full Exhaust
92 Octane Oregon Pump Fuel
Stock Boost Control with Perrin EBCS



Results: 391 lb-ft, 378whp @ 22psi.



Here is a look at the power and torque (measured with our Mustang Dyno), plus an overlay of ‘Calculated Load’ and ‘MAF’. During the tune I scaled the MAF table down a bit so peak load wouldn’t go above 4.0, as that limit removal isn’t in the beta software I was using. With the Perrin intake you already get a bit of downscale, which is nice to keep MAF voltages lower. The absolute MAF-HP or Load-Torque will not be correct, but the relative values are spot on. As is obvious, Torque follows load, and HP follows MAF. If you get a good MAF curve dialed in, just logging load/MAF can get you a great HP/Torque estimate (if you are interested in differences, not absolute values.

As for ‘conservative tune’, I prefer to let my numbers talk. I posted a complete datalog below. (hint hint)



Here is graph of data from that dyno pull. You can see timing, boost, and AFRs. AFRs are 11.2-11.5. See datalog below.



Here is a look at the Injector Duty Cycle (and MAF for comparison). 80% peak injector duty cycle.. Just about perfect. There is not enough headroom with these injectors to do E85 unfortunately. With a well calibrated MAF curve it is amazing how closely it follows duty cycle.



Here is a pull on the street. You can see that load is higher on the street, and boost spools a bit faster. Looks like I need to increase the dyno load just a bit.



Last, but not least, some flat foot shifting ( running 18-19psi map ). Yummy!

Jeff Sponaugle
Surgeline Tuning
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Last edited by sponaugle; 02-22-2009 at 11:44 AM.
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:29 PM   #2
sponaugle
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Member#: 4498
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Portland, Oregon
Vehicle:
WRX H6-3.0 Turbo
www.surgelinetuning.com

Default

Code:

MAF	BOOST	TPS	WGDC	LOAD	INJ	RPM	Tdyn	IGN	AFR
21.04	0.29	100	0	1.28	4.43	989	0.8	10.5	15.88
21.04	0.29	100	0	1.28	4.43	989	0.8	10.5	15.46
21.04	0.29	100	0	1.28	4.43	989	0.8	10.5	14.86
21.38	0.29	100	54.12	1.31	4.46	1045	0.94	10.5	14.36
21.38	0.29	100	54.12	1.31	4.46	1045	0.94	10.5	14.20
22.71	0.29	100	54.12	1.32	4.68	1096	1.04	11	14.20
22.71	0.29	100	54.12	1.32	4.68	1096	1.04	11	14.29
22.71	0.29	100	54.12	1.32	4.68	1096	1.04	11	14.46
26.07	0.44	100	54.12	1.38	4.84	1135	1.01	9.5	14.69
26.07	0.44	100	54.12	1.38	4.84	1135	1.01	9.5	14.03
26.07	0.44	100	54.12	1.38	4.84	1135	1.01	9.5	14.26
28.56	0.58	100	54.12	1.43	5.3	1183	0.99	8.5	14.42
28.56	0.58	100	54.12	1.43	5.3	1183	0.99	8.5	15.09
30.54	0.87	100	54.12	1.46	6.12	1248	2.06	9	14.71
30.54	0.87	100	54.12	1.46	6.12	1248	2.06	9	14.20
30.54	0.87	100	54.12	1.46	6.12	1248	2.06	9	14.01
31.32	1.02	100	54.12	1.49	6.45	1314	3.98	9.5	13.91
31.32	1.02	100	54.12	1.49	6.45	1314	3.98	9.5	13.88
33.72	1.16	100	54.12	1.51	6.94	1355	5.08	10	13.85
33.72	1.16	100	54.12	1.51	6.94	1355	5.08	10	13.81
33.72	1.16	100	54.12	1.51	6.94	1355	5.08	10	13.77
35.15	1.31	100	54.12	1.52	7.3	1425	6.84	11	13.76
35.15	1.31	100	54.12	1.52	7.3	1425	6.84	11	13.71
36.84	1.45	100	54.12	1.52	7.34	1496	8.8	12	13.69
36.84	1.45	100	54.12	1.52	7.34	1496	8.8	12	13.71
36.84	1.45	100	54.12	1.52	7.34	1496	8.8	12	13.85
38.57	1.6	100	54.12	1.51	7.74	1578	10.49	13	13.97
38.57	1.6	100	54.12	1.51	7.74	1578	10.49	13	14.03
38.57	1.6	100	54.12	1.51	7.74	1578	10.49	13	14.03
41.94	1.89	100	54.12	1.54	8.3	1621	12.1	14	14.06
41.94	1.89	100	54.12	1.54	8.3	1621	12.1	14	14.04
43.9	1.89	100	54.12	1.55	8.74	1708	13.53	14	14.04
43.9	1.89	100	54.12	1.55	8.74	1708	13.53	14	13.99
43.9	1.89	100	54.12	1.55	8.74	1708	13.53	14	14.01
45.23	2.03	100	70.2	1.54	9.05	1767	15.04	18.5	13.98
45.23	2.03	100	70.2	1.54	9.05	1767	15.04	18.5	13.99
46.04	2.18	100	70.2	1.53	9.49	1853	16.46	20	13.97
46.04	2.18	100	70.2	1.53	9.49	1853	16.46	20	14.05
46.04	2.18	100	70.2	1.53	9.49	1853	16.46	20	14.11
48.99	2.32	100	70.2	1.55	9.88	1929	17.98	19.5	14.19
48.99	2.32	100	70.2	1.55	9.88	1929	17.98	19.5	14.19
48.99	2.32	100	70.2	1.55	9.88	1929	17.98	19.5	14.24
51.63	2.47	100	70.2	1.57	10.19	1990	19.89	20	14.26
51.63	2.47	100	70.2	1.57	10.19	1990	19.89	20	14.17
55.37	2.61	100	65.1	1.62	11.45	2065	19.97	19	13.92
55.37	2.61	100	65.1	1.62	11.45	2065	19.97	19	13.68
55.37	2.61	100	65.1	1.62	11.45	2065	19.97	19	13.50
58.63	2.76	100	60.39	1.67	12.69	2124	19.71	19	13.29
58.63	2.76	100	60.39	1.67	12.69	2124	19.71	19	13.02
58.63	2.76	100	60.39	1.67	12.69	2124	19.71	19	12.74
62.1	3.05	100	52.55	1.72	13.65	2207	19.49	18	12.56
62.1	3.05	100	52.55	1.72	13.65	2207	19.49	18	12.41
66.28	3.34	100	47.84	1.79	15.26	2308	19.2	17.5	12.31
66.28	3.34	100	47.84	1.79	15.26	2308	19.2	17.5	12.23
66.28	3.34	100	47.84	1.79	15.26	2308	19.2	17.5	12.18
70.79	3.77	100	40	1.86	16.17	2369	18.76	16.5	12.14
70.79	3.77	100	40	1.86	16.17	2369	18.76	16.5	12.11
75.19	4.35	100	37.65	1.92	17.25	2450	18.31	15.5	12.12
75.19	4.35	100	37.65	1.92	17.25	2450	18.31	15.5	12.07
75.19	4.35	100	37.65	1.92	17.25	2450	18.31	15.5	12.00
78.97	4.79	100	38.43	1.98	18.5	2551	17.69	15.5	11.89
78.97	4.79	100	38.43	1.98	18.5	2551	17.69	15.5	11.88
78.97	4.79	100	38.43	1.98	18.5	2551	17.69	15.5	11.87
84.75	5.37	100	39.22	2.04	19.65	2632	17.18	14.5	11.89
84.75	5.37	100	39.22	2.04	19.65	2632	17.18	14.5	11.83
93.01	6.09	100	39.61	2.13	20.84	2713	16.6	15	11.83
93.01	6.09	100	39.61	2.13	20.84	2713	16.6	15	11.79
93.01	6.09	100	39.61	2.13	20.84	2713	16.6	15	11.76
104.1	6.82	100	40.78	2.25	23.41	2814	15.7	15	11.67
104.1	6.82	100	40.78	2.25	23.41	2814	15.7	15	11.56
116.87	7.98	100	43.14	2.42	26.38	2944	14.74	15.5	11.46
116.87	7.98	100	43.14	2.42	26.38	2944	14.74	15.5	11.34
116.87	7.98	100	43.14	2.42	26.38	2944	14.74	15.5	11.21
129.09	9.28	100	45.88	2.59	30.05	3062	13.18	15.5	11.13
129.09	9.28	100	45.88	2.59	30.05	3062	13.18	15.5	11.09
142.18	10.88	100	47.84	2.7	32.34	3158	11.68	16.5	11.07
142.18	10.88	100	47.84	2.7	32.34	3158	11.68	16.5	11.11
142.18	10.88	100	47.84	2.7	32.34	3158	11.68	16.5	11.15
156.02	12.76	100	49.02	2.84	35.09	3290	10.03	15.5	11.29
156.02	12.76	100	49.02	2.84	35.09	3290	10.03	15.5	11.37
156.02	12.76	100	49.02	2.84	35.09	3290	10.03	15.5	11.53
173.26	15.37	100	49.41	3	38.33	3455	7.33	12.5	11.62
173.26	15.37	100	49.41	3	38.33	3455	7.33	12.5	11.68
173.26	19.14	100	50.2	3.53	49.11	3654	3.77	12	11.59
222.15	19.14	100	50.2	3.53	49.11	3654	3.77	12	11.39
222.15	19.14	100	50.2	3.53	49.11	3654	3.77	12	11.22
240.66	21.9	100	48.63	3.84	54.93	3843	0.49	12	11.21
240.66	21.9	100	48.63	3.84	54.93	3843	0.49	12	11.33
240.66	21.9	100	48.63	3.84	54.93	3843	0.49	12	11.47
253.79	22.34	100	48.24	3.78	55.51	4003	-0.08	13	11.52
253.79	22.34	100	48.24	3.78	55.51	4003	-0.08	13	11.57
272.68	22.34	100	48.63	3.81	59.53	4228	-0.36	13.5	11.57
272.68	22.34	100	48.63	3.81	59.53	4228	-0.36	13.5	11.60
272.68	22.34	100	48.63	3.81	59.53	4228	-0.36	13.5	11.56
278.43	22.34	100	49.41	3.86	62.11	4411	-0.14	14	11.55
278.43	22.34	100	49.41	3.86	62.11	4411	-0.14	14	11.51
292.79	22.34	100	48.24	3.81	64.57	4586	-0.25	14	11.49
292.79	22.34	100	48.24	3.81	64.57	4586	-0.25	14	11.44
292.79	22.34	100	48.24	3.81	64.57	4586	-0.25	14	11.40
296.24	21.9	100	46.67	3.76	65.4	4716	-0.22	14.5	11.36
296.24	21.9	100	46.67	3.76	65.4	4716	-0.22	14.5	11.34
296.24	21.9	100	46.67	3.76	65.4	4716	-0.22	14.5	11.33
304.28	21.47	100	47.06	3.75	68.49	4939	0.01	15	11.29
304.28	21.47	100	47.06	3.75	68.49	4939	0.01	15	11.25
319.21	21.32	100	49.02	3.73	70.68	5097	0.1	15.5	11.22
319.21	21.32	100	49.02	3.73	70.68	5097	0.1	15.5	11.20
319.21	21.32	100	49.02	3.73	70.68	5097	0.1	15.5	11.17
324.97	21.61	100	49.8	3.74	72.27	5212	-0.01	15.5	11.13
324.97	21.61	100	49.8	3.74	72.27	5212	-0.01	15.5	11.12
335.52	21.76	100	49.8	3.76	74.42	5367	-0.3	16	11.12
335.52	21.76	100	49.8	3.76	74.42	5367	-0.3	16	11.13
335.52	21.76	100	49.8	3.76	74.42	5367	-0.3	16	11.16
347.52	21.9	100	50.2	3.74	77.17	5565	-0.37	16.5	11.14
347.52	21.9	100	50.2	3.74	77.17	5565	-0.37	16.5	11.16
347.52	21.9	100	50.2	3.74	77.17	5565	-0.37	16.5	11.13
353.01	22.05	100	50.2	3.72	79.21	5712	-0.37	16.5	11.16
353.01	22.05	100	50.2	3.72	79.21	5712	-0.37	16.5	11.13
354.85	22.05	100	49.8	3.7	80.09	5866	-0.51	16.5	11.13
354.85	22.05	100	49.8	3.7	80.09	5866	-0.51	16.5	11.10
354.85	22.05	100	49.8	3.7	80.09	5866	-0.51	16.5	11.10
359.22	22.05	100	49.41	3.62	79.99	5952	-0.56	17	11.12
359.22	22.05	100	49.41	3.62	79.99	5952	-0.56	17	11.13
358.6	21.9	100	48.63	3.53	79.26	6091	-0.54	17.5	11.17
358.6	21.9	100	48.63	3.53	79.26	6091	-0.54	17.5	11.21
358.6	21.9	100	48.63	3.53	79.26	6091	-0.54	17.5	11.26
357.34	21.47	100	47.84	3.43	80.23	6268	-0.26	18	11.29
357.34	21.47	100	47.84	3.43	80.23	6268	-0.26	18	11.30
357.34	21.47	100	47.84	3.43	80.23	6268	-0.26	18	11.32
354.84	21.32	100	47.84	3.36	79.09	6392	-0.1	18.5	11.33
354.84	21.32	100	47.84	3.36	79.09	6392	-0.1	18.5	11.33
353.6	21.03	100	47.84	3.3	78.94	6492	0.01	18.5	11.30
353.6	21.03	100	47.84	3.3	78.94	6492	0.01	18.5	11.29
353.6	21.03	100	47.84	3.3	78.94	6492	0.01	18.5	11.30
360.48	20.89	100	48.24	3.25	80.09	6586	0.15	19	11.32
360.48	20.89	100	48.24	3.25	80.09	6586	0.15	19	11.29
354.84	21.32	100	48.24	3.24	80.4	6612	0.01	19.5	11.29
354.84	21.32	100	48.24	3.24	80.4	6612	0.01	19.5	11.30
354.84	21.32	100	48.24	3.24	80.4	6612	0.01	19.5	11.36
352.99	20.89	100	48.24	3.15	79.75	6797	0.19	20.5	11.37
352.99	20.89	100	48.24	3.15	79.75	6797	0.19	20.5	11.40
352.99	20.74	100	48.24	3.08	78.53	6817	0.14	21	11.38
352.39	20.74	100	48.63	3.08	78.53	6817	0.14	21	11.64
352.39	20.74	100	48.63	3.08	78.53	6817	0.14	21	11.76
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:50 PM   #3
sponaugle
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Oh.. and here is a look at the fuel map:



I decided to make the fuel map simple, and work on the MAF curve to try to get AFRs close to the targets. It worked pretty well, but still needs a bit more work. The load comp map could use a few tweaks as well.



EDIT: Here is the dynamic map, which is added to the base map.



Cheers,


Jeff Sponaugle
Surgeline Tuning

Last edited by sponaugle; 02-24-2009 at 12:02 AM.
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:58 PM   #4
TDagen
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Sweet!!!! gt3076 >or 3071?
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:06 PM   #5
sponaugle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TDagen View Post
Sweet!!!! gt3076 >or 3071?
3076R, .63 A/R

With the .82 at 27psi peak and 24-25 at redline with Meth Spray I did 470 lb-ft of torque and 430 whp, but I doubt I could get that much whp with the .63. Once I get a few more miles on the shortblock I'll turn up the boost a bit in the midrange and see how it does. I did manage a few pulls at 400-405 lb-ft while tuning.

Cheers,

Jeff Sponaugle
Surgeline Tuning

Last edited by sponaugle; 02-24-2009 at 12:02 AM.
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:09 PM   #6
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Great running car, Just wondering how come you used 90 octane? Isn't 93 or so available out there? We all get jealous because 91 is the highest commonly used here in CA, We would all kill for 93 to be in our cars FULL TIME, just wondering why you didnt feel the same way.
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:13 PM   #7
sponaugle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KB'izzle View Post
Great running car, Just wondering how come you used 90 octane? Isn't 93 or so available out there? We all get jealous because 91 is the highest commonly used here in CA, We would all kill for 93 to be in our cars FULL TIME, just wondering why you didnt feel the same way.
Typo.. fixed. Premium gas here is 92 octane. 90 octane sounds downright scary.

And yes, I hate tuning on the Cali 91!

Jeff Sponaugle
Surgeline Tuning

Last edited by sponaugle; 02-24-2009 at 12:04 AM.
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:13 PM   #8
TDagen
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Nice will you ever put larger injectors on and use E-85 on this since 90 oct is terrible? That MAf looks like its scaled great! I can't wait for spring...
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:19 PM   #9
TDagen
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That 08 def. puts down some good power with .63 and pump gas... At only 22psi also.
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:20 PM   #10
sponaugle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TDagen View Post
Nice will you ever put larger injectors on and use E-85 on this since 90 oct is terrible? That MAf looks like its scaled great! I can't wait for spring...
Indeed 92 octane is terrible. [typo on my part]

I was planning on using some DW1000s to do E85. I did E85 in my EZ30R 2002 WRX (http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1645176), although I doubt I will be able to match the 540+ lb ft of torque.

Jeff Sponaugle
Surgeline Tuning

Last edited by sponaugle; 02-24-2009 at 12:04 AM.
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:30 PM   #11
TDagen
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Ez30R ftw only 20 psi 541 ft/lb wow...Now thats a cool project, does v6 suck down the E-85??
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:34 PM   #12
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good results, exceptional and thorough data

appreciate your contribution to this forum
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:42 PM   #13
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Ez30R ftw only 20 psi 541 ft/lb wow...Now thats a cool project, does v6 suck down the E-85??
100% duty cycle with 6 injectors at 810ccs, so that is about the same as maxing out 4 1215cc injectors on an EJ.

Jeff Sponaugle
Surgeline Tuning

Last edited by sponaugle; 02-24-2009 at 12:04 AM.
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:49 PM   #14
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About damn time some tuner actually posted information regarding their tunes and some excellent documentation. Great job, Jeff. Looks good
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:07 PM   #15
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Yea it is about time someone posted up some good information with out hiding timing or Afr or something lol.
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:10 PM   #16
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Quote:
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Yea it is about time someone posted up some good information with out hiding timing or Afr or something lol.
I was about the post the SAME thing.

Awesome work, and thanks for sharing the details.

What kind of engine upgrades have you made? Pistons? Rods?
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:24 PM   #17
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Jeff, maybe I missed it, but what are you using for boost control on this car?
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:42 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by jordanretro1223 View Post
I was about the post the SAME thing.

Awesome work, and thanks for sharing the details.

What kind of engine upgrades have you made? Pistons? Rods?
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Jeff, maybe I missed it, but what are you using for boost control on this car?
The shortblock I built at home. New case (I split the sleeve on the old one. ). Weisco pistons, Carrillo rods, ACL bearings, stock crank.

Boost control is stock, but with a Perrin EBCS. It works pretty well on the street, and I have I-Drive set at wastegate (16psi), S-Drive at 18.5psi, and S# at 22psi.

I'm switching to an AEM 5 bar map sensor this week so I can run Speed Density at higher boost levels. With the higher MAP, I should be able to use the stock boost control up to 30psi.

Jeff Sponaugle
Surgeline Tuning

Last edited by sponaugle; 02-24-2009 at 12:04 AM.
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:50 PM   #19
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Hey how is the double pumper working out on the Ez30r are you still switching to the a1000? Reason I ask is I am looking at throwing in a Fullblown double pumper in my car to run 1250cc injectors w/Atp 3076.

Last edited by TDagen; 02-22-2009 at 01:53 AM.
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:55 PM   #20
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Thanks for an interesting post.

Do you have dyno charts from this car that show a good (apples-to-apples) comparison of the .63 and .82 housings?
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Old 02-21-2009, 09:37 PM   #21
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I would almost pay to see the AVCS tables, or plots.
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Old 02-22-2009, 11:39 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TDagen View Post
Hey how is the double pumper working out on the Ez30r are you still switching to the a1000? Reason I ask is I am looking at throwing in a Fullblown double pumper in my car to run 1250cc injectors w/Atp 3076.
I still have the double pumps on the EZ30R car, but I'll switch to an A1000 before track season. The double pump setup works fantastic in terms of flow, but I am most worried about reliability. If one pump fails you would never know until you really need the fuel.

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I would almost pay to see the AVCS tables, or plots.
No worries, I'll grab them from my laptop and post them up. They are not super secret, that is for sure!

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Originally Posted by NSFW View Post
Thanks for an interesting post.

Do you have dyno charts from this car that show a good (apples-to-apples) comparison of the .63 and .82 housings?
Yep, I don't have them on my computer here at home, but I'll stop by the shop and grab data for a few. I think last time I looked I had a bit over 160 dyno pulls in the database for this car.

Jeff Sponaugle
Surgeline Tuning

Last edited by sponaugle; 02-24-2009 at 12:05 AM.
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Old 02-22-2009, 12:40 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by sponaugle View Post
I still have the double pumps on the EZ30R car, but I'll switch to an A1000 before track season. The double pump setup works fantastic in terms of flow, but I am most worried about reliability. If one pump fails you would never know until you really need the fuel.

Jeff
Right and its not like would notice until you hit full boost, even if you seen it on the wideband it could be too late. That worries me a little. I just don't wanna get the full surge tank set up for DD and Drag racing...lol
Very kind of you to post up all of this information, It has me iching to get out and get tuning my car again lol...
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Old 02-22-2009, 12:49 PM   #24
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Quote:
good results, exceptional and thorough data appreciate your contribution to this forum
here here! I've stockpiled data posted on this site by Jeff, and used that and some basic math--in lieu of testing anything real-world--to come up with my power adder setup. it's amazing what you can learn with concise data/graphs and explanations from someone in-the-know.

thanks, and nice job with the 08.

ps - what I really dig is how the dyno plots are always scaled the same. I've actually photoshopped a bunch of them together and overlayed them for a little real-world support for compressor map data
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Old 02-22-2009, 01:14 PM   #25
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Great info with 'real' data as usual , very interesting an informative, thx
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