2002 wrx hybrid advice.

W0R2X · 04-05-2009, 12:13 AM

hey guys,
call me dumb but i've got some questions about the setup im running. so far, i have an 02 wrx hybrid, vf 39, larger tmic, turboback, gutted uppipe, and a k&n drop in filter. all installed with no tune. im working on getting 565cc injectors and a walbro pump, and then a tune.
anyway, first off, i did the sti block swap, and i was advised to get a tune right away. well i never did and i drove the car like that for over a year. it ran great. then recently i swapped the vf39, and the larger tmic with a modded perrin ypipe. still no tune.
i've been told that i will max out my injectors, which i dont seem to be, and that my car wouldnt run right with the 2.0 litre ecu, but i have not noticed any negative effects. runs smooth and great power gain.
so whats up? is everyone tune paranoid? im not bagging on anyone im just confused.

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JSarv · 04-05-2009, 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by W0R2X

hey guys,
call me dumb but i've got some questions about the setup im running. so far, i have an 02 wrx hybrid, vf 39, larger tmic, turboback, gutted uppipe, and a k&n drop in filter. all installed with no tune. im working on getting 565cc injectors and a walbro pump, and then a tune.
anyway, first off, i did the sti block swap, and i was advised to get a tune right away. well i never did and i drove the car like that for over a year. it ran great. then recently i swapped the vf39, and the larger tmic with a modded perrin ypipe. still no tune.
i've been told that i will max out my injectors, which i dont seem to be, and that my car wouldnt run right with the 2.0 litre ecu, but i have not noticed any negative effects. runs smooth and great power gain.
so whats up? is everyone tune paranoid? im not bagging on anyone im just confused.

^^ WOW ^^

Hope your pockets aren't empty yet - you'll be buying a new shortblock here real soon...

Just out of curiosity was your 205 modded and untuned when it let go? Don't go blaming poor bearings - bearings fail because of detonation too..

-Jerod

DeathPool · 04-05-2009, 12:54 AM

In all honesty, I am suprised it hasnt popped yet.

That being said, if the engine going on you in the future isnt a huge concern, just leave it and keep driving it until it dies (or doesnt, who knows.) I however, would get the larger injectors and get it tuned.

vik_wrx · 04-05-2009, 12:57 AM

Tune asap

Wheeler Bement · 04-05-2009, 02:02 AM

When I did my swap I flashed the stock 02 tune in as well to see how it would run. It was my experience that timing was way down and that the car would give loads of fine learning knock correction. After bumping the timing up, it went away. Anything over ~10-12 psi on a TD04 will max the injectors after 5K rpm, but that is at a target AFR of sub 10.

So far, I have been using the 06 WRX map as a reference, which has been really good so far. The biggest thing that helped was removing the CL/OL delay...

W0R2X · 04-05-2009, 04:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSarv

^^ WOW ^^

Hope your pockets aren't empty yet - you'll be buying a new shortblock here real soon...

Just out of curiosity was your 205 modded and untuned when it let go? Don't go blaming poor bearings - bearings fail because of detonation too..

-Jerod

im in a weird situation, and my injectors did not come when planned. but i will be getting them along with a tune. my 2.0 died because of a flood. and it was completely stock.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathPool

In all honesty, I am suprised it hasnt popped yet.

That being said, if the engine going on you in the future isnt a huge concern, just leave it and keep driving it until it dies (or doesnt, who knows.) I however, would get the larger injectors and get it tuned.

again, injectors and tune will come asap

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wheeler Bement

When I did my swap I flashed the stock 02 tune in as well to see how it would run. It was my experience that timing was way down and that the car would give loads of fine learning knock correction. After bumping the timing up, it went away. Anything over ~10-12 psi on a TD04 will max the injectors after 5K rpm, but that is at a target AFR of sub 10.

So far, I have been using the 06 WRX map as a reference, which has been really good so far. The biggest thing that helped was removing the CL/OL delay...

thanks ill keep the 06 wrx map in mind. unfortunately, i have no experience in tuning at all, so this is why im trying to get help.

kellygnsd · 04-05-2009, 08:12 AM

Do a compression test before you tune just to humor us ok.

JSarv · 04-05-2009, 09:14 AM

Look we are not trying to be mean, or at least I'm not, its just sad that you've got so much money into it and let it go like you have.

A tune is 99% of a turbo cars reliability and drive ability whether you want to believe it or not. I mean don't get me wrong it is your car, but don't cheat yourself man.

Jerod

thorne · 04-05-2009, 10:25 AM

ummmmmm

you should just give me your motor because you obviously don't like it.

white2002rs · 04-05-2009, 12:17 PM

Your extremely lucky to still have your car running, whether you notice or not the difference the damage is still being done, look at it this way your ecu still thinks its a got a stock 2.0 in it but the reality which your fully aware is that you don't. GET A TUNE ASAP!!!!!!

W0R2X · 04-05-2009, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSarv

Look we are not trying to be mean, or at least I'm not, its just sad that you've got so much money into it and let it go like you have.

A tune is 99% of a turbo cars reliability and drive ability whether you want to believe it or not. I mean don't get me wrong it is your car, but don't cheat yourself man.

Jerod

thanks i appreciate that. im not doubting the facts about a tune, like i said, i just dont have any experience in it.

so what terminal factors am i facing? smaller injectors causing ______?

JSarv · 04-05-2009, 04:33 PM

Ring/land damage and bearing damage from detonation...

You have a larger bore and a totally different VE plot now with the hybrid setup.. You running your OE timing and fueling will really screw things up...

Since your fueling is maf based - only to about 190 g/s and your 2.5 even with the stock turbo will flow that easily your over running your ecu's fueling ability (unless tuned)

Your timing for the change in VE/displacement will change- your ecu will compensate to a certain point - but you will see a night/day x100 difference in driveability and way safer power...

IF it lasts long enough to get a tune... Think of it this way your 2.0 could take in 200 grams of air - it would fuel to almost that (2.0's will take in more but not much more on the stock turbo) your 2.5 has alot more "space" for that air to fill - however your stock tune does not know that and is only applying fuel till a certian point - anything after that you just run lean - which creates high egt's and a very high knock tendancy..

Knock - heat kill engines in a hurry... Your lucky to have made it this long to be honest with you.

I personally wouldn't start the car without a quick safe tune - to drive it to go get tuned... Its a pretty serious thing - as on a turbo motor/any motor a tune can/will determine how long an engine lasts - if its poor at least...

-Jerod

Your only advantage is your lack of power making your doing with the ****ty tune and small turbo - that is probably the only reason it still runs...

04-05-2009, 12:13 AM	#1
W0R2X Scooby Newbie Member#: 88706 Join Date: Jun 2005 Vehicle: 2002 WRX Black	2002 wrx hybrid advice. hey guys, call me dumb but i've got some questions about the setup im running. so far, i have an 02 wrx hybrid, vf 39, larger tmic, turboback, gutted uppipe, and a k&n drop in filter. all installed with no tune. im working on getting 565cc injectors and a walbro pump, and then a tune. anyway, first off, i did the sti block swap, and i was advised to get a tune right away. well i never did and i drove the car like that for over a year. it ran great. then recently i swapped the vf39, and the larger tmic with a modded perrin ypipe. still no tune. i've been told that i will max out my injectors, which i dont seem to be, and that my car wouldnt run right with the 2.0 litre ecu, but i have not noticed any negative effects. runs smooth and great power gain. so whats up? is everyone tune paranoid? im not bagging on anyone im just confused. * Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

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04-05-2009, 12:54 AM	#3
DeathPool Scooby Specialist Member#: 186966 Join Date: Aug 2008 Chapter/Region: MWSOC Location: Chicago, IL Vehicle: 2004 WRX Sedan Stg.2 WRB	In all honesty, I am suprised it hasnt popped yet. That being said, if the engine going on you in the future isnt a huge concern, just leave it and keep driving it until it dies (or doesnt, who knows.) I however, would get the larger injectors and get it tuned.

04-05-2009, 12:57 AM	#4
vik_wrx Scooby Specialist Member#: 194804 Join Date: Nov 2008 Chapter/Region: International Location: Trinidad Vehicle: 2004 VF43 WRX - sold WRB	Tune asap

04-05-2009, 02:02 AM	#5
Wheeler Bement Scooby Specialist Member#: 15652 Join Date: Feb 2002 Chapter/Region: TXIC Location: sugar land, katy Vehicle: 2002 2.5L WRX Wag. 160K club	When I did my swap I flashed the stock 02 tune in as well to see how it would run. It was my experience that timing was way down and that the car would give loads of fine learning knock correction. After bumping the timing up, it went away. Anything over ~10-12 psi on a TD04 will max the injectors after 5K rpm, but that is at a target AFR of sub 10. So far, I have been using the 06 WRX map as a reference, which has been really good so far. The biggest thing that helped was removing the CL/OL delay...

04-05-2009, 08:12 AM	#7
kellygnsd Scooby Guru Member#: 32669 Join Date: Feb 2003 Chapter/Region: SCIC Location: Rancho C Vehicle: 2007 FR TS EFR 7670 LINK G4 hybrid STi	Do a compression test before you tune just to humor us ok.

04-05-2009, 09:14 AM	#8
JSarv Scooby Specialist Member#: 163445 Join Date: Nov 2007 Chapter/Region: MWSOC Location: Effingham IL (Central IL) Vehicle: l33t ******* 12.07@115.9mph-EJ205	Look we are not trying to be mean, or at least I'm not, its just sad that you've got so much money into it and let it go like you have. A tune is 99% of a turbo cars reliability and drive ability whether you want to believe it or not. I mean don't get me wrong it is your car, but don't cheat yourself man. Jerod

04-05-2009, 10:25 AM	#9
thorne Scooby Newbie Member#: 130063 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Ohio Vehicle: 2003 WRX Silb	ummmmmm you should just give me your motor because you obviously don't like it.

04-05-2009, 12:17 PM	#10
white2002rs * Banned * Member#: 101491 Join Date: Nov 2005 Chapter/Region: South East Location: whorelando, fl Vehicle: 2002 wrsti wrb	Your extremely lucky to still have your car running, whether you notice or not the difference the damage is still being done, look at it this way your ecu still thinks its a got a stock 2.0 in it but the reality which your fully aware is that you don't. GET A TUNE ASAP!!!!!!

04-05-2009, 04:33 PM	#12
JSarv Scooby Specialist Member#: 163445 Join Date: Nov 2007 Chapter/Region: MWSOC Location: Effingham IL (Central IL) Vehicle: l33t ******* 12.07@115.9mph-EJ205	Ring/land damage and bearing damage from detonation... You have a larger bore and a totally different VE plot now with the hybrid setup.. You running your OE timing and fueling will really screw things up... Since your fueling is maf based - only to about 190 g/s and your 2.5 even with the stock turbo will flow that easily your over running your ecu's fueling ability (unless tuned) Your timing for the change in VE/displacement will change- your ecu will compensate to a certain point - but you will see a night/day x100 difference in driveability and way safer power... IF it lasts long enough to get a tune... Think of it this way your 2.0 could take in 200 grams of air - it would fuel to almost that (2.0's will take in more but not much more on the stock turbo) your 2.5 has alot more "space" for that air to fill - however your stock tune does not know that and is only applying fuel till a certian point - anything after that you just run lean - which creates high egt's and a very high knock tendancy.. Knock - heat kill engines in a hurry... Your lucky to have made it this long to be honest with you. I personally wouldn't start the car without a quick safe tune - to drive it to go get tuned... Its a pretty serious thing - as on a turbo motor/any motor a tune can/will determine how long an engine lasts - if its poor at least... -Jerod Your only advantage is your lack of power making your doing with the ****ty tune and small turbo - that is probably the only reason it still runs...