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Old 04-14-2009, 04:02 PM   #26
Splinter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drakar View Post
on the street and road racing yes, but drag racing no.
Somehow I don't think JccL's 2.5i is a dedicated drag car

Just a hunch tho
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Old 04-14-2009, 04:20 PM   #27
Drakar
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Originally Posted by Splinter View Post
Somehow I don't think JccL's 2.5i is a dedicated drag car

Just a hunch tho
just saying
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Old 04-14-2009, 04:41 PM   #28
Jeff54
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Originally Posted by alcoolaid View Post
gt3071? too tiny man 4088r
nah the 4088 is too big...3071 is perfect for an RS with sti pistons/rods, mild head porting and some 2000 regrinds....throw a hydra in there and some pipes and **** and 3000-4000$ later your sitting at 350+ whp....seems pretty good bang for buck if u ask me

i was serious...lol
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Old 04-14-2009, 05:02 PM   #29
JccL
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turbo talk?
and about the drag racing well i can strip the car and ... no just no

I'm expecting this to help me out with acceleration. i lost some low end acceleration doing the header swap; if i loss the 8bhp difference between the 2.5RS and 2.5i, then with a couple 2-3 hp mods or dropping 100lb i should be back to performance of a stock 2.5i with a proper sounding sube I was considering going down to smaller diameter tires to solve the problem, but i'm scraping on mall speed bumps already. lw flywheel causes too many headaches so i'm not going near those.
Anyways i got my answer as far as how to go about the install and torque specs.
thanks everyone
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Old 04-14-2009, 09:28 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by JccL View Post
turbo talk?
and about the drag racing well i can strip the car and ... no just no

I'm expecting this to help me out with acceleration. i lost some low end acceleration doing the header swap; if i loss the 8bhp difference between the 2.5RS and 2.5i, then with a couple 2-3 hp mods or dropping 100lb i should be back to performance of a stock 2.5i with a proper sounding sube I was considering going down to smaller diameter tires to solve the problem, but i'm scraping on mall speed bumps already. lw flywheel causes too many headaches so i'm not going near those.
Anyways i got my answer as far as how to go about the install and torque specs.
thanks everyone
Keep in mind that installing a lightweight flywheel is almost exactly the same as a lightened pulley, except much, much less effective...the flywheel weighs way more and has much greater diameter, thus much much higher rotational inertia. Pulley goes on the front of the crank, flywheel goes on the back. If you don't want a lightweight flywheel, I have no idea why you would buy a lightened pulley.

For those who are saying it's a worthwhile mod, and inferring that only those who have installed one can say if it's good or not, how about using some high school physics? Look up how to calculate rotational inertia, and then estimate the estimate the total change in the inertia of the entire engine rotating system which includes the flywheel, the crankshaft, the crank pulley, the alternator and it's pulley, the a/c pulley + clutch, etc, and then tell me the percentage inertia reduction from a lighter pulley is worth it.

Besides, when you just look at the flywheel-side inertia like we just did, all that will tell you is how much faster the engine will *rev in neutral*. Considering nobody is saying "my engine revs WAY faster after pulley", I think I'm right when I say the difference is minimal. If you want to figure out how much faster you will *actually accelerate*, consider the rotational inertia from the last paragraph PLUS the clutch disk (which has much larger diameter), the entire transmission, driveshaft, differential gears, axles, brake rotors and wheels plus tires. I would guess that a lightened pulley, even if it was weightless, would reduce the rotational inertia of the whole drivetrain system by less than 1/1000th.

Keep your tires properly inflated, I guarantee that will reduce parasitic drag considerably more than replacing your pulley. If you really want to minimize your engine rotational inertia on a street car for some reason, buy a 2lb flywheel made of a thin steel sheet. I bet the car will be awesome to drive.

Last edited by aspect; 04-14-2009 at 09:36 PM.
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Old 04-14-2009, 10:16 PM   #31
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dudez i g0t da vishnu pulleyz on meh car it is like woah
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Old 04-14-2009, 11:23 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by aspect View Post
Keep in mind that installing a lightweight flywheel is almost exactly the same as a lightened pulley, except much, much less effective...the flywheel weighs way more and has much greater diameter, thus much much higher rotational inertia. blah blah blah
lw flywheel can throw codes (depending on weight) and is much more effort to install....i think thats what he meant by headaches....

when you talk about increasing acceleration by reducing rotating mass you are talking about decreasing the inertia of the system (system being the vehicle)...now when you're talking free revving the engine rotational mass is huge....but when you want to practically apply those theories you are dealing with rotational mass, as well as the mass of the vehicle....the force required to move the car is a product of not only the rotational mass but also the mass of the system...now with stuff like flywheels, pulleys etc not only are you accelerating that mass linearly but also you are rotating it...reducing rotational mass is helping you reduce rotational and linear inertia....now rotational mass of the components of an engine pale into insignificance when compared to the mass of the vehicle...so what im saying is the rotational inertia of a flywheel (which everyone raves about it's effectiveness) is insignificant when compared to the inertia of the entire vehicle....just like you claim the small 4 lb savings of the crank pulley is insignificant....

my point being freeing up 4 lbs on the crank pulley, 10 lbs on the flywheel, 10 lbs with a carbon fiber hood, 20 lbs of sound deadening...all these reductions in themselves dont exactly provide you any noticeable gains...sure the flywheel will make you rev faster in neutral when the impulse of the entire vehicle is ignored, but when you're actually driving the gain is very minimal in itself....but when you add everything together, reducing rotational and static mass, you will start to see gains....

so basically doing just the pulleys meh, you're not going to notice any change...couple that with flywheel and further weight reduction in general and you'll get somewhere.....

but then again IMO the stock pulleys are ugly.....people spend a lot more than the 100$ or whatever the pulley costs on other cosmetic mods that will never get them any sort of gains (and a lot of times will hurt performance), as insignificant as those gains from the pulley may seem in themself....

so yeah....i find it funny how people dog pulleys, then go by a fancy batter tie down or a 200$ pulley cover....

dont think you're going to install the pulleys and be like damn my car is more fasterer now....but a lot of people here spend a lot more money on a lot stupider ****....
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Old 04-15-2009, 12:22 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Jeff54 View Post
so yeah....i find it funny how people dog pulleys, then go by a fancy batter tie down or a 200$ pulley cover
Yup, nothing wrong with bling! I didn't get a ver6 bumper because it was more aerodynamic, nor did I paint my wheels to increase their strength.

I agree with pretty much everything you said. What set me off is the "expecting to help with acceleration" comment. If you're trying to evaluate the merit of a performance mod, you need to consider all the variables that affect the system you are altering.
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Old 04-15-2009, 01:57 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by aspect View Post

I agree with pretty much everything you said. What set me off is the "expecting to help with acceleration" comment. If you're trying to evaluate the merit of a performance mod, you need to consider all the variables that affect the system you are altering.
for sure...i'm a big believer in $/hp when deciding what to do next....for instance there are things i could do to squeeze more power out of the 18G....more efficient exhaust..better intake manifold....blah blah blah.....

or i could just go bigger turbo (Borg s256/gt3071) for about 1000USD...which will get me much more power....woot....

problem is when you start throwing "bling" factor into the mix everything gets too complicated....thats why i try to avoid bling and keep my car looking like **** ahahhah

Last edited by Jeff54; 04-15-2009 at 12:23 PM. Reason: punk chew ate shun
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Old 04-16-2009, 07:38 PM   #35
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I Just picked one of the perrin up last month , but unfortunately , my torque wrench only goes to 80 . Any one around my area , and willing to give another vicer a hand . Thanks
p.s. buy you a beer later , that's if you old enough .
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Old 04-16-2009, 10:58 PM   #36
alcoolaid
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If you're itching for more power, I think it has come to the time where you sell the 2.5i and buy a WRX.

I'm serious.
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Old 04-17-2009, 02:16 AM   #37
Jeff54
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Originally Posted by alcoolaid View Post
If you're itching for more power, I think it has come to the time where you sell the 2.5i and buy a WRX.

I'm serious.
bull****...i will line my measly little RS that has much less than 20,000$ into (including the cost of the car) with your sti any day of the week....then talk trash about RS/2.5i's ability to make power....i think you might eat your words...

I'm also serious. Come out to mission if it ever re-opens.

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Old 04-17-2009, 02:30 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff54 View Post
bull****...i will line my measly little RS that has much less than 20,000$ into (including the cost of the car) with your sti any day of the week....then talk trash about RS/2.5i's ability to make power....i think you might eat your words...

I'm also serious. Come out to mission if it ever re-opens.

Do you solve ALL your arguments through drag racing?
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Old 04-17-2009, 02:33 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff54 View Post
bull****...i will line my measly little RS that has much less than 20,000$ into (including the cost of the car) with your sti any day of the week....then talk trash about RS/2.5i's ability to make power....i think you might eat your words...

I'm also serious. Come out to mission if it ever re-opens.

LoL! I'll be there .

I was just thinking that since he's wanting to get more power he could just trade it in. In the long run its probably cheaper than just adding small power adders or even trying to like swap a turbo motor in there.
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Old 04-17-2009, 02:35 AM   #40
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Anyways, when is mission opening? My friends say it still won't be open this Friday but it might be open next week?

Time to try to make it in to the 10's! (I wish.. more like low-mid 11's).
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Old 04-17-2009, 02:36 AM   #41
Jeff54
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Originally Posted by alcoolaid View Post
LoL! I'll be there .

I was just thinking that since he's wanting to get more power he could just trade it in. In the long run its probably cheaper than just adding small power adders or even trying to like swap a turbo motor in there.
i beg to differ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by tora View Post
Do you solve ALL your arguments through drag racing?
just the ones involving power....

and besides....this is a car forum isnt it?

go get some groceries in your lesbianmobile
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Old 04-17-2009, 02:38 AM   #42
Jeff54
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Anyways, when is mission opening? My friends say it still won't be open this Friday but it might be open next week?

Time to try to make it in to the 10's! (I wish.. more like low-mid 11's).
i dunno man.....from what i hear they need to repave the entire track...it might not even be open till late summer....

....
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Old 04-17-2009, 02:40 AM   #43
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Oh well... the 1/4 is just for people who want to go fast in a straight line. I'll do some lapping days to wait it off
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Old 04-17-2009, 02:50 AM   #44
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i beg to differ....



just the ones involving power....

and besides....this is a car forum isnt it?

go get some groceries in your lesbianmobile
Ah ha ha!! You know I am subject to peer pressure and all this goading is going to make me dump money into my Lesbian mobile just so I can spank you at the track. Then I will part it out and put it back to the way it is.
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Old 04-17-2009, 02:54 AM   #45
Jeff54
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Ah ha ha!! You know I am subject to peer pressure and all this goading is going to make me dump money into my Lesbian mobile just so I can spank you at the track. Then I will part it out and put it back to the way it is.

doooo it.....if you dont you are a *****! or a chicken....buck buck buck buck....

DOOOOOOOO ITTTT
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Old 04-17-2009, 02:56 AM   #46
Jeff54
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Oh well... the 1/4 is just for people who want to go fast in a straight line. I'll do some lapping days to wait it off
im not going to lie....i love drag racing....road racing is good too...but too expensive and not frequent enough.....i mean 300$ for a track day is so bloody expensive....i like canyon runs on roads that very very few people know about ....and thats free...
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Old 04-17-2009, 02:57 AM   #47
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btw i love talking trash and challenging people (even if its straight line)....even if i lose i dont care....its just fun to have a little friendly competition...and to get all you old geezers (like tora) out to the track...ahaahhhaah
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Old 04-17-2009, 03:31 AM   #48
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and you like the "Post Reply" button better than the "Edit Post" button
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Old 04-17-2009, 03:38 AM   #49
Jeff54
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and you like the "Post Reply" button better than the "Edit Post" button
yeah....

im lazy....get off me
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Old 04-17-2009, 03:42 AM   #50
JccL
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If you're itching for more power, I think it has come to the time where you sell the 2.5i and buy a WRX.

I'm serious.
not itching for that much more power yet, i test drove a white 05wrx that was the same price as my 2.5i, it was quite heavily modded and very fast with twice the milage. Problems with turbos turned me away, along with running high octane and pricey insurance. The power that wrx made was more than i would ever use, and would get me into a lot of trouble. So i started looking at N/A and was content with the performance but not the sound. After switching my exhaust, i'm wanting that performance i used to have back.

Turbo maybe when i'm old and have time and money to play with, maybe some open source tuning, but it's a dd so i'm not looking for the track monster you guys all speak of. haha

i just ordered a rsb to compliment the susp. hopefully that will change the car enough to keep me distracted from power.

might be worth mentioning i used to drive 2001 civic LXG, i miss that light weight car lol
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