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Old 04-14-2009, 11:50 AM   #1
Rene2.5RS
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Default 2006 WRX VF39 Race Map

Started work on a race map for my vf39ed wrx. So far the results are looking great over my pump map. Now I will be working on re plumbing the EWG to get some more boost out of it in the upper range.

I really don't feel like coping everything over from my pump tune thread so here you go:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1623281

Mods are:
104 oct
Built motor, with Cosworth 278/274 cams
Helix EWG up-pipe, Tial 38mm EWG, with self made custom extension tube and dump tube
APS Inlet
Perrin V2 Rails
DW 750cc
Walbro 255lph
HKS DP
Greddy Evo 2 CB
SPT Inatke
SSAC FMIC
TGV Deletes
Hallman Pro / GMBCS Hybrid

Here is the big note, this motor was built for a GT35 so please no comments about having the VF39 on there. I am just having fun with it for now until the tranny, new injectors, and turbo are on the car.

Dyno:
310hp/~360tq


Overlay, Pump vs. Race


Video while at DSG
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDoVgq5v4qI

Once I get everything close to done I will be heading to the track, and Matt, the tuner said he would meet me there to finish up tuning.

Questions and comments?

-Rene
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Old 04-14-2009, 11:58 AM   #2
juanmedina
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I think is awesome I want to see how much the CAMs will help the turbo. You should use C16 and go for 11s, is your car full weight? How much boost are you planning on running? I have to wait until the 05/08 to try to run 11s
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Old 04-14-2009, 11:58 AM   #3
blowbyu24
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nice looking set up.....i bet you are excited for the 35r
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Old 04-14-2009, 12:16 PM   #4
STi Mikey
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Finally! A vf 39 on a built motor, Im excited. It is a great way to break in the motor and also a way of seeing what that baby turbo can really accomplish.

By the looks of it, im assuming there is no correction in your plot. On 1.0 my car makes exactly 310whp as well!! Curious though, with the cams i figured the graph would hold more to the right?? I fall off to 28X. Maybe you should stop by the Shop in norwalk ct and have Junior take a look at it. Obviously that turbo can only flow so much air, but im willing to bet your timing isnt as aggressive as it can be up top, safely, with such a build (or the cams are just not a good combo with such a small turbo).

Last edited by STi Mikey; 04-14-2009 at 12:25 PM.
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Old 04-14-2009, 01:38 PM   #5
Rene2.5RS
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I have done a lot of my tuning myself but with the race map I have decided to run no knock control so this is why I am having all the major tuning done on a dyno with the use of det cans. My car has always hated the being tuned and this time around using the det cans we were able to hear why, the motor is very noisy and when the ewg cracks open you can clearly hear it through the motor. This and the heads are very noisy. Which is why we have decided on no knock control. My thoughts were to tune for 104 octane fuel and never run less than C16 for the added safety.

At the end of the video I pan the camcorder to the screen if you look closely you will notice that what you are looking at is actually 4 overlaid dyno pulls that are all +/- 3 hp & tq.

Also this is on Rotella T 15w-40 oil. I know I could pick some power up going to a much lighter oil when racing like a 0w-30 but the motor is built for 15-40 and that is all it ever sees including the dead of winter.

juanmedina - I will actually be doing some testing on the weight of the car. I want to go to the track full weight as it rolls now, and then strip most of the interior and go back and see the differences. I will be trailering the car to and from the track now in fear of the tranny. I hopefully will be visiting the track in May at the earliest. Tuning we found that 24-25 psi was a good range. We got it up to 28 psi and the MAFv was lower than 24-25. Right now I am running about 16.5 psi at 7500 rpm, I would like to try and get that up to 18.5-19 and see if there is any improvement.

blowbyu24 - Thanks, I am not trying to think of the 35r much because I am still about a year away from that. When I blew the motor in 07 I figured I only ever wanted to have the motor out once and knew what I wanted with the car and built it accordingly. It is fun now, but I get a lot of flack from people for only having a VF39, I have thought about going to a 20g for now, but I want to have fun at the track with 39

STi Mikey - "Finally! A vf 39 on a built motor" you are not the first to day this. I am interested in seeing what I can get out of it. When you say you fall off to 28X, at what rpm is that. I have not seen many plots of a 39 running out to 7500 rpm. Also yes this is at 1.0 correction.
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Old 04-14-2009, 01:44 PM   #6
LateApex31
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We never run an extra correction factor on our dyno and the atmospheric correction for that day was .966. The boost falls off hard up top due to the soft wastegate spring which allows exhaust manifold pressure to push the WG open.
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Old 04-14-2009, 01:46 PM   #7
STi Mikey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rene2.5RS View Post
I have done a lot of my tuning myself but with the race map I have decided to run no knock control so this is why I am having all the major tuning done on a dyno with the use of det cans. My car has always hated the being tuned and this time around using the det cans we were able to hear why, the motor is very noisy and when the ewg cracks open you can clearly hear it through the motor. This and the heads are very noisy. Which is why we have decided on no knock control. My thoughts were to tune for 104 octane fuel and never run less than C16 for the added safety.

At the end of the video I pan the camcorder to the screen if you look closely you will notice that what you are looking at is actually 4 overlaid dyno pulls that are all +/- 3 hp & tq.

Also this is on Rotella T 15w-40 oil. I know I could pick some power up going to a much lighter oil when racing like a 0w-30 but the motor is built for 15-40 and that is all it ever sees including the dead of winter.

juanmedina - I will actually be doing some testing on the weight of the car. I want to go to the track full weight as it rolls now, and then strip most of the interior and go back and see the differences. I will be trailering the car to and from the track now in fear of the tranny. I hopefully will be visiting the track in May at the earliest. Tuning we found that 24-25 psi was a good range. We got it up to 28 psi and the MAFv was lower than 24-25. Right now I am running about 16.5 psi at 7500 rpm, I would like to try and get that up to 18.5-19 and see if there is any improvement.

blowbyu24 - Thanks, I am not trying to think of the 35r much because I am still about a year away from that. When I blew the motor in 07 I figured I only ever wanted to have the motor out once and knew what I wanted with the car and built it accordingly. It is fun now, but I get a lot of flack from people for only having a VF39, I have thought about going to a 20g for now, but I want to have fun at the track with 39

STi Mikey - "Finally! A vf 39 on a built motor" you are not the first to day this. I am interested in seeing what I can get out of it. When you say you fall off to 28X, at what rpm is that. I have not seen many plots of a 39 running out to 7500 rpm. Also yes this is at 1.0 correction.
280 @ 7000. I think im in the 260 range at 7300, and have reved it out at the track to right around there on a few 114mph passes. The car doenst seem to fall on its face up top at the track but reving a stock car to7-7500 isnt good so i take turns holding 4th and shifting fifth with absolutely no variance in results. If your bringing her to the track as is, I would highly recomend shifting at 6200 in third and fourth. with the 5 speed you should be comfortably in the 11's
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Old 04-14-2009, 01:59 PM   #8
Rene2.5RS
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In regards to the EWG plumbing see my awesome paint drawing below. I currently run the top port open, and I plan on changing that

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Old 04-17-2009, 10:08 AM   #9
Rene2.5RS
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STi Mikey what track do you visit? I normally head up to Lebanon Valley since I will be trailering it is the closest track for me.

-Rene
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Old 04-17-2009, 12:04 PM   #10
06njsti
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wow thats awesome for a vf39, i really want to go bigger this summer but love how fast my vf spools
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Old 06-25-2009, 08:51 AM   #11
sexyyrex
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ahh rene, your car is far too quiet! haha how have you been? hows the car comming along? any chance to track it this year yet?
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Old 06-25-2009, 11:20 AM   #12
Swine
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Yesh peak tq at 4k? That blows unless you have a funkylicous dyno. When do you see full boost on the street?
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Old 06-25-2009, 11:56 AM   #13
juanmedina
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swine View Post
Yesh peak tq at 4k? That blows unless you have a funkylicous dyno. When do you see full boost on the street?
My VF39 with stock engine and E85 used to hit peak torque at 4200 RPM. This car is tune for top end not for a short burst of power at 3500 RPM

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Old 06-25-2009, 12:30 PM   #14
DuCash
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Rene, shouldn't you be making more trq than that for a 2.5L, also i don't think your powerband should fall off so much up top for someone using cams?
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Old 06-25-2009, 12:31 PM   #15
Steve.804
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cams will generally push the power to the right of the powerband. I know the Dynamics Dynos read pretty low so that looks like some pretty impressive numbers. I can't wait to see some trap speeds.

Quote:
Rene, shouldn't you be making more trq than that for a 2.5L
That's at 4400rpms though. That's a ton of torque for such a small turbo that late in the rpm.

Last edited by Steve.804; 06-25-2009 at 12:36 PM.
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Old 06-25-2009, 01:44 PM   #16
BlackJavaPearl04
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awesome man im doing the same thing while waiting for mt 35r....
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Old 06-25-2009, 02:06 PM   #17
CatfaceType-R
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something is wrong if you are losing power that early with cams...
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Old 06-25-2009, 02:37 PM   #18
DuCash
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve.804 View Post
cams will generally push the power to the
That's at 4400rpms though. That's a ton of torque for such a small turbo that late in the rpm.
I'm not knocking the set-up, just that i made the same amount of trq with my JDM 2.0L Sti with the VF37 turbo, and that's on 90oct + meth

Quote:
Originally Posted by soon2bblackongold View Post
something is wrong if you are losing power that early with cams...
Cams should boost your top-end power....or is it that the turbo has run out of breath???
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Old 06-25-2009, 02:45 PM   #19
juanmedina
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuCash View Post
I'm not knocking the set-up, just that i made the same amount of trq with my JDM 2.0L Sti with the VF37 turbo, and that's on 90oct + meth



Cams should boost your top-end power....or is it that the turbo has run out of breath???
numbers....
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Old 06-25-2009, 02:57 PM   #20
Phatron
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rene2.5RS View Post
Once I get everything close to done I will be heading to the track, and Matt, the tuner said he would meet me there to finish up tuning.
based on your dyno plots its not even worth wasting the money on race gas......you only picked up 5-10whp in the drag racing powerband.
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Old 06-25-2009, 03:50 PM   #21
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+1 for a boost graph. Perhaps you're trying to hold too much boost and killing the efficiency.
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Old 06-25-2009, 03:55 PM   #22
Swine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
based on your dyno plots its not even worth wasting the money on race gas......you only picked up 5-10whp in the drag racing powerband.
While i would normally agree with you, my +10whp/wtq race gas map picked up over 2mph than my pump gas map.

Car is an 05 STI with a catless TBE, pos short ram...pump and a race map from Topspeed.



Trapped 107.5mph on pump and trapped 109.7mph on race. Same track, similar temps but different nights. Conditions were similar(cool, clear, 30-50% humidity...unsure of the calc d/a though).

Soooo just fyi...
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Old 06-25-2009, 04:03 PM   #23
Swine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
My VF39 with stock engine and E85 used to hit peak torque at 4200 RPM. This car is tune for top end not for a short burst of power at 3500 RPM

My sti held over 300wtq for 2500rpm(on ts's dyno obviously). His with alot more go fast parts holds it for 1500 rpms. Something is amise me thinks.

Just looking at his numbers, the only thing i have to look at currently, n o t impressed. But if these numbers get him a 110+ trap, i will be.
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Old 06-25-2009, 04:35 PM   #24
juanmedina
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swine View Post
My sti held over 300wtq for 2500rpm(on ts's dyno obviously). His with alot more go fast parts holds it for 1500 rpms. Something is amise me thinks.

Just looking at his numbers, the only thing i have to look at currently, n o t impressed. But if these numbers get him a 110+ trap, i will be.
Again numbers , if you look at my old road dyno I only hit a max 330wtq at 4140RPM on E85 22.7psi and I trapped 94mph in the 1/8th with a VF39

At what track did you run? This thread is old anyways

I agree 10hp = 1 tenth which is a lot to me!
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Old 06-25-2009, 09:09 PM   #25
Swine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
Again numbers ,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swine View Post
Just looking at his numbers, ***********the only thing i have to look at currently***********


Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
if you look at my old road dyno I only hit a max 330wtq at 4140RPM on E85 22.7psi and I trapped 94mph in the 1/8th with a VF39
On road dyno software...i know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
At what track did you run?
Montgomery motorsports park.

Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
I agree 10hp = 1 tenth which is a lot to me!
Agreed, hell my +10hp race gas tune got me 0.25 sec and 2.2mph. Well worth the extra $50 it cost for the map...people spend way more then $50 on useless other crap that doesnt give them anything.
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