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Old 04-27-2009, 01:12 PM   #26
darknightohio
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Originally Posted by Clark_Kent View Post
They need to cut Saab and Hummer while they're at it.
They did, Saab, Hummer and Saturn are gone:

http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2009/04...iac-death.html
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Old 04-27-2009, 01:13 PM   #27
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^^ Yeah, but that's the thing - GM already had at least one other division that would have met the need of those "average joes". I do understand what you are saying, but Pontiac can't be the car for non-enthusiasts if they already have Chevy and Buick (and even Saturn).

Lutz was right - Pontiac had to try going up-market, it's just that it never got the time/products to fulfill those goals. The car market has been flipped totally on it's head over the past 2 years and GM wasn't doing a consistent job on pushing Pontiac's "performance" credentials. They were very wishy-washy - coming out with decent products like the G8 and Solstice, but then diluting the brand with craptacular efforts like the G3 and G4 which was being mostly pushed by their dealers.
Very true. They definately needed more time. The G3 and G4 hurt, but they were demanded by dealers who were trying to meet the wants of the previous generation Pontiac buying public.

I might check out a G8 this fall, could be a good buy...

Quote:
Originally Posted by impreza_punk View Post
So now onto the real question where do I get my G8 for a song? How does this work? Do I just show up at a Pontiac dealer and go "HA! All your bases are belong to us" or something and we both laugh a lot and they just give me one?
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Old 04-27-2009, 01:33 PM   #28
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How much will it cost to shut those dealerships; wasn't that a major expense when Oldsmobile was closed?
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Old 04-27-2009, 01:37 PM   #29
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I guess the stratification is:
Chevy->regular through sporty cars
GMC-> Trucks
Buick->Chinese market vehicles
Caddie->upscale sedans and Euro competitor cars
MIght work.
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Old 04-27-2009, 01:37 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by impreza_punk View Post
So now onto the real question where do I get my G8 for a song? How does this work? Do I just show up at a Pontiac dealer and go "HA! All your bases are belong to us" or something and we both laugh a lot and they just give me one?
For great justice!

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Old 04-27-2009, 01:40 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Yotsuya View Post
How much will it cost to shut those dealerships; wasn't that a major expense when Oldsmobile was closed?
If you look around there really aren't any "Pontiac Only" dealerships like there were with Oldsmobile (even then Oldsmobile was usually grouped with Buick back then). So for a lot of dealerships it's just going to be taking down a banner and filling the lot with one of the other brands they sell. Some dealers will switch to another brand instead of going out of business. We had some family friends who owned a long-time well known Oldsmobile dealership in Seattle and when Oldsmobile went out they actually switched to Hyundai or something like that.

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Old 04-27-2009, 01:43 PM   #32
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I guess the stratification is:
Chevy->regular through sporty cars
GMC-> Trucks
Buick->Chinese market vehicles
Caddie->upscale sedans and Euro competitor cars
MIght work.
Pretty much, except that Buick will definitely still have a presence here in the US too... Buick is probably gonna evolve into an upscale brand. Not quite as luxury as Caddy, but more so than Chevy. My guess is that Caddy is gonna go even more high-end to seperate themselves from Buick and become (hopefully) a serious competitor to the likes of Mercedes and BMW, but they will need more than just the CTS.
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Old 04-27-2009, 01:48 PM   #33
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Good riddance.
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Old 04-27-2009, 02:37 PM   #34
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Had GM swallowed its pride and called the G8 a Grand Prix or a Bonneville, I think that it would have sold much more.

GMC still exists because people are paying $5k on average more for their vehicles than comparable Chevrolets, and surveys say that a sizeable chunk of GMC buyers will go to Ford before they go to Chevy. Besides, having Buick and GMC at one lot will give dealers a full lineup of vehicles to sell, since Cadillac and Chevrolet can stand alone.
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Old 04-27-2009, 02:39 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmi View Post
I guess the stratification is:
Chevy->regular through sporty cars
GMC-> Trucks
Buick->Chinese market vehicles
Caddie->upscale sedans and Euro competitor cars
MIght work.
Chevy->regular through sporty cars, Corvette (budget Supercar), and consumer-grade trucks
GMC->upscale versions of the Chevy trucks & commercial-grade trucks

There's really no reason to change that.
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Old 04-27-2009, 02:53 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Eyeflyistheeye View Post
Had GM swallowed its pride and called the G8 a Grand Prix or a Bonneville, I think that it would have sold much more.
They should have called it a LeMans to make up for that Daewoo atrocity they watered down that name with in the '80s.

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Old 04-27-2009, 03:05 PM   #37
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Calling the G8 a Grand Prix or Bonneville would have been a huge mistake. I simply would have never looked at it if you named it after those horrible things. They needed a new name to break away from the long lingered and better off dead grand prix's and bonnevilles, whos only successes were on a rental car lot.
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Old 04-27-2009, 03:07 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by SCRAPPYDO View Post
Calling the G8 a Grand Prix or Bonneville would have been a huge mistake. I simply would have never looked at it if you named it after those horrible things. They needed a new name to break away from the long lingered and better off dead grand prix's and bonnevilles, whos only successes were on a rental car lot.
Numbers are numbers man, if the M5 was called the cumcatcher but still produced 500hp with a topspeed near 200mph, I would still drive it...
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Old 04-27-2009, 03:21 PM   #39
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Numbers are numbers man, if the M5 was called the cumcatcher but still produced 500hp with a topspeed near 200mph, I would still drive it...
...debadged.

-Mike
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Old 04-27-2009, 03:25 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by ghibli99 View Post
...debadged.

-Mike
Of course not if the emblem was recessed in the back of the trunk. x elevenity billion.

Last edited by warpath; 04-27-2009 at 03:37 PM.
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Old 04-27-2009, 03:41 PM   #41
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I am not saying that it would take away from how good a car a G8 is, but if I were just shopping around, a name as awful as grand prix or bonneville would be a liability rather than an asset to me. G8 buyers were not typical pontiac customers, as indicated by the fact that I actually test drove one. It needed a non typical Pontiac name.
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Old 04-27-2009, 04:00 PM   #42
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Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows 98; PalmSource/Palm-D062; Blazer/4.5) 16;320x320)

Dammit, I just bought an '03 Vibe as a commuter/utility car over the weekend. HaHa.

Well maybe I can go get a deal on an '09 instead.
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Old 04-27-2009, 04:00 PM   #43
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Gm has always been that companies that had great intentions but poor executions. For too long it has seemed GM has been trying to tell consumers what they want, whats good for their needs, etc...
While other companies keep progressing with each generation of design and engineering.
GM decided to spend valuable R&D money on Super Bowl ads, Movie Endorsements, NASCAR and other Marketing Exercises.
In order for GM to succeed not only is a viable restructuring plan required but an extire ovehaul of managenment, executives, enginners, marketing etc...
In other words abolish old GM standards and procedures. Personally I think a 3 brand tier would be the maximum that should be used

Chevrolet- Vehicles catered to the masses along with a few "niche" vehicles such as Corvette and Camaro. No SUV's, Crossovers, Vans or Trucks

GMC- Industrial Utility division- SUV's, Crossovers, Vans and Trucks

Cadillac- Premium Brand- Small to Full Size Luxury vehicles and SUV's- Allow for a few "niche" vehicles suck as "V Series"
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Old 04-27-2009, 04:03 PM   #44
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Sad to see Pontiac go. I can remember, as a kid seeing a '54 or '55 Pontiac with a Chief hood ornament that was chrome and, I think, an orange colored plastic! Hard to believe that in the mid '60's, Pontiac was the THIRD best selling car in America, only Chevy and Ford did better.
Pontiac Tempest, GTO, The Judge,Trans-Am, Bonneville's with TWO big four barrel carbs, ah memories!
First Oldsmobile, now Pontiac, the General may very well be going bye-bye, at least as we knew it! It couldn't change with the times, and that is not a knock on those who built them, but GM was just too big and too monolithic! Sad!
Keep it under 90, folks!
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Old 04-27-2009, 05:24 PM   #45
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GM might have actually been in great shape if they had killed off all the rebranded models years ago. Sad that upper management was so entrenched in collecting paychecks they failed to actually run a lean mean competitive company. GM could have been a whole different story right now if the leadership had actually done a decent job the past say 15 yrs. Sad in some ways to see these brands go by the way side but GM needs to make some massive changes this is only the beginning.
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Old 04-27-2009, 05:45 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darknightohio View Post
They did, Saab, Hummer and Saturn are gone:

http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2009/04...iac-death.html

sice when does this:
"the resolution of Saab, Saturn, and Hummer to the end of 2009, at the latest."

translate to they are terminating them?
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Old 04-27-2009, 06:05 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by I'm Slow View Post
sice when does this:
"the resolution of Saab, Saturn, and Hummer to the end of 2009, at the latest."

translate to they are terminating them?
terminate or selling.

It looks like Saab might already have a buyer, Hummer is on the block. Saturn appears to be dead already and completely closed by years end.
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Old 04-27-2009, 06:07 PM   #48
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i wonder if Subaru wiil pick up saab
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Old 04-27-2009, 06:08 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by DoctorNick View Post
Why the hell would you keep GMC? I mean, really. GMC?!
GMC builds bigger trucks than Chevy does. Maybe they will stop making the trucks that cross over to the Chevy line-up though.

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Originally Posted by dye.sti View Post
buick? why keep them?
So, apparently Buick is a ridonkulously huge brand in China. I don't get it, no one that I know gets it, but apparently THE car to have when you've "made it big" in China, is a Buick. That's what saves Buick from the chopping block. Pull Buick out, and kiss that huge market goodbye. As I understand it, most recent Buick models have been Opels, anyway.

One thing that I hope GM will do is grab the better cars from across it's line-up and it's now-defunct brands and stick them in it's remaining marquis.
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Old 04-27-2009, 06:11 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by mh_WRX View Post
terminate or selling.

It looks like Saab might already have a buyer, Hummer is on the block. Saturn appears to be dead already and completely closed by years end.
Yeah, Saab already has a dedicated and loyal niche market of owners, and Hummer could easily spin off into a small-market producer of niche vehicles too. (Jeep could do the same for Chrystler/Fiat.)

Saturn is dead, but it's a good bet that any decent Saturn models will show up as Chevys in the next couple of years, if they don't already have a Chevy version.
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