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Old 05-26-2009, 03:26 AM   #1
zac5
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Wrong Fitment Crew #054

Default 02 wrx ej207 w/ PE1820

I don't make any significant power/torque before 5000rpm, seems pretty lame narrower powerband and less torque than last time.(same dyno, same tuner, I made 245whp/251tq last year)
It's nothing wrong with the tune, the curve is smooth and car runs solid. However, it feels totally different than before when I got to drive it. I spoke to my tuner for a new turbo. He suggested go big evo3 16g and then I will get wider powerband. But I want something bigger than 18g.
Time for a new turbo? any suggestion between 18g to Green? Lag is fine as long as when it kicks in, it kicks in hard

mods

ver.8 ej207 stock internal
PE1820
dw 850cc injectors
Speed Industry boost solenoid
walbro 255
tial 44mm ewg
Invidia header
Invidia catless downpipe
custom made 3'' midpipe
Prodrive 2.5'' rear section
Greddy fmic
Greddy type-rs bov
NGK one step colder plugs
Perrin short ram intake
s202 turbo inlet
Perrin lightweight crank pulley
was running 94octane on mustang dyno
tuned by Tony at Speed Industry
274/243

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Old 05-26-2009, 04:53 AM   #2
STimo
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IMO i'd go with a rotated 30R with .63 hotside on a EJ207.. You should see full boost around late 4K to early 5K, but the wait will be WELL worth it in the end.. Talk to Dug*E*fresh, i believe he runs a 207 with a 35R, but before that ran something like a SZ49 into deep 11's/high 10's.. IMO he's the man to talk to when it comes to the EJ207.. he's been there, done that.
From what ive seen though i wouldnt go with anything smaller than 20G..
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Old 05-26-2009, 08:39 AM   #3
DuCash
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It seems like your not using the AVCS cams that come with that motor? but even with out it, you should spool quicker.....

My tuner has a JDM GC8 2.0L STi, with a 20g and he's seeing 20psi by 4,000rpm with no AVCS...

The top end power looks great through, but 3,000 to 4,500rpm look kinda flat......

Keep up the good work and thanks for sharing you info...
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Old 05-26-2009, 10:31 AM   #4
zeropsi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuCash View Post
It seems like your not using the AVCS cams that come with that motor? but even with out it, you should spool quicker.....

My tuner has a JDM GC8 2.0L STi, with a 20g and he's seeing 20psi by 4,000rpm with no AVCS...

The top end power looks great through, but 3,000 to 4,500rpm look kinda flat......

Keep up the good work and thanks for sharing you info...
I was definitely thinking AVCS could have been utilized to help with spool...though it should still spool quicker than that. As far as the flat spot...I'm guessing it's not leaned out as hard as it could be throughout that RPM range...perhaps to keep in convservative, but still for that, 1500rpm is a little wide. Could be wrong though.

As far as something between an 18G and a Green...it'd be a 20G, which is roughly the same as what you have now, maybe a tiny bit bigger...so it wouldn't help this setup. FWIW, a local guy has a v7 207 with a Tomei ARMS M7760 turbo (TD05 20G basically) and hits full boost at/around 4K.

I think there's a wider powerband to be had with the setup as is...just my $.02 though.
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Old 05-26-2009, 10:38 AM   #5
CatfaceType-R
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dom 3, dom 2.5, gt52, amr's turbo's, htagreen, tdo5 20g

I would look into the dom3, if you have avcs enabled this turbo will kick your ass....another person on here has the 2.5dom but on the 2.5liter and hits 400/400 pretty damn early I imagine.
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Old 05-26-2009, 12:19 PM   #6
zac5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuCash View Post
It seems like your not using the AVCS cams that come with that motor? but even with out it, you should spool quicker.....

My tuner has a JDM GC8 2.0L STi, with a 20g and he's seeing 20psi by 4,000rpm with no AVCS...

The top end power looks great through, but 3,000 to 4,500rpm look kinda flat......

Keep up the good work and thanks for sharing you info...
According to my tuner, it is the turbo which picks up slow...

The lag feels like there has giant turbo in the car, while when it hitting the full boost it feels like stock STi turbo...what the heck Seems it combines all the disadvantages of small and big turbos
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Old 05-26-2009, 01:35 PM   #7
Steve.804
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Did you buy the turbo new? That flat spot is a little concerning at about 3300-3900rpm. Looks like a pre-turbo leak (gasket issue or perhaps a crack in your headers) or a really weak wastegate spring (probably not the case with the EWG).
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Old 05-26-2009, 02:52 PM   #8
zac5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve.804 View Post
Did you buy the turbo new? That flat spot is a little concerning at about 3300-3900rpm. Looks like a pre-turbo leak (gasket issue or perhaps a crack in your headers) or a really weak wastegate spring (probably not the case with the EWG).
I bought it used but in mint condition. I checked the turbo before put it on my car, everything seems fine. I had a crack in my uppipe(where moded for EWG) and I fixed it. wastegate spring is 0.9 bar(13psi) so it shouldnt be the wastegate tho...
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Old 05-26-2009, 04:28 PM   #9
Clark Turner
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Can you datalog the car to make sure the AVCS system is working?

The old PE1820 was hot in 2003. Its now 2009. I ran this setup in 2003 myself. The turbo does have late boost onset for the power it produces. Even so.. You wont be flooring the 2.0 at 3000 anyways.

Maybe what you should think about doing is to get the Version 8 twin scroll setup and toss that on the car. It has a very wide power band and still can make the power you are making now. Maybe that will make the car more enjoyable to you.

The EVO3 16g is a good choice for cheap bolt on solution. It will come on a bit faster and make the same or more power. I am not sure that it would be worth the cost.

The 18G to me is a waste of time. I never liked this turbo and after tuning hundreds I would pass on it.

The 20G is going to have the same boost onset as the 1820 but might make some more top end.

Another thought is to get some equal length headers. This will make a decent difference and give you some more midrange power for sure.

Clark
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Old 05-26-2009, 05:12 PM   #10
Steve.804
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I think a fat 20G (one with a 8cm^2 turbine housing) would be perfect for the 207. You'll make peak torque at 4000+rpm but that's perfect for a motor that rev's to 8000+ and have some really nice top-end.

IF there is an issue with the set-up as it sits, you may really like the turbo you have once it's sorted out...
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Old 05-26-2009, 05:23 PM   #11
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Definately log the avcs and see if its functioning...I did my version 8 first sans avcs with a blouch 2.5r and it was a turd down low, no drivability at all. Hooked up the avcs, had Clark tune it and it woke up big time. Currently I'm running a rotated 3076 .82 a/r and absolutely love the car, 23 psi on pump only, and it runs mid to high 11s weather dependant. Having run both set ups, the 3076 just seems like a no brainer now.

Good luck

Trey
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Old 05-26-2009, 08:50 PM   #12
STimo
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^^Yeah i always read a EJ207 with a GT3076R and .63 hotside on it was the turbo to run.. Full boost in the mid 4's and it'll make ~500whp on race gas.. Yeah IMO it looks like you have a pre-turbo leak or something too, becuase that is extremely slow spool for that turbo..
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Old 05-26-2009, 09:00 PM   #13
zac5
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Wrong Fitment Crew #054

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Turner View Post
Can you datalog the car to make sure the AVCS system is working?

The old PE1820 was hot in 2003. Its now 2009. I ran this setup in 2003 myself. The turbo does have late boost onset for the power it produces. Even so.. You wont be flooring the 2.0 at 3000 anyways.

Maybe what you should think about doing is to get the Version 8 twin scroll setup and toss that on the car. It has a very wide power band and still can make the power you are making now. Maybe that will make the car more enjoyable to you.

The EVO3 16g is a good choice for cheap bolt on solution. It will come on a bit faster and make the same or more power. I am not sure that it would be worth the cost.

The 18G to me is a waste of time. I never liked this turbo and after tuning hundreds I would pass on it.

The 20G is going to have the same boost onset as the 1820 but might make some more top end.

Another thought is to get some equal length headers. This will make a decent difference and give you some more midrange power for sure.

Clark
I had vf37 twinscroll before, put down 245/251 last year on the same dyno. It's so limited when it comes down to upgrade the twinscroll..For the new turbo in future, I really don't care about the lag as long as it worths.

Im currently running Invidia header which it's a equal length header...any thoughts what happened to my car? or just the turbo itself?

Thanks for your input
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Old 05-26-2009, 09:01 PM   #14
zac5
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thanks guys, I will try to look it up see if there's a pre-turbo leak...gosh
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Old 05-26-2009, 11:46 PM   #15
gold rush
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Do a leak down.
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Old 05-27-2009, 12:00 AM   #16
zeropsi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soon2bblackongold View Post
dom 3, dom 2.5, gt52, amr's turbo's, htagreen, tdo5 20g

I would look into the dom3, if you have avcs enabled this turbo will kick your ass....another person on here has the 2.5dom but on the 2.5liter and hits 400/400 pretty damn early I imagine.
Hmm...no offense but where are your recommendations coming from? They're all over the board, from 44lb/min turbos to 56lb/min, and each one within that range would respond drastically different depending on size. For what purpose? Just a bit confused.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zac5 View Post
According to my tuner, it is the turbo which picks up slow...

The lag feels like there has giant turbo in the car, while when it hitting the full boost it feels like stock STi turbo...what the heck Seems it combines all the disadvantages of small and big turbos
The PE's definitely seem like they're not the quickest spooling turbos...AVO's too for some reason.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Turner View Post
Can you datalog the car to make sure the AVCS system is working?

The old PE1820 was hot in 2003. Its now 2009. I ran this setup in 2003 myself. The turbo does have late boost onset for the power it produces. Even so.. You wont be flooring the 2.0 at 3000 anyways.

Maybe what you should think about doing is to get the Version 8 twin scroll setup and toss that on the car. It has a very wide power band and still can make the power you are making now. Maybe that will make the car more enjoyable to you.

The EVO3 16g is a good choice for cheap bolt on solution. It will come on a bit faster and make the same or more power. I am not sure that it would be worth the cost.

The 18G to me is a waste of time. I never liked this turbo and after tuning hundreds I would pass on it.

The 20G is going to have the same boost onset as the 1820 but might make some more top end.

Another thought is to get some equal length headers. This will make a decent difference and give you some more midrange power for sure.

Clark
I love equal length.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve.804 View Post
I think a fat 20G (one with a 8cm^2 turbine housing) would be perfect for the 207. You'll make peak torque at 4000+rpm but that's perfect for a motor that rev's to 8000+ and have some really nice top-end.

IF there is an issue with the set-up as it sits, you may really like the turbo you have once it's sorted out...
If you can get a nice 3" inlet 8cm TD06 20G that would be a perfect match. Or even a Green.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zac5 View Post
I had vf37 twinscroll before, put down 245/251 last year on the same dyno. It's so limited when it comes down to upgrade the twinscroll..For the new turbo in future, I really don't care about the lag as long as it worths.

Im currently running Invidia header which it's a equal length header...any thoughts what happened to my car? or just the turbo itself?

Thanks for your input
I think it's a combination of the turbo and something else which needs to be identified.
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Old 05-27-2009, 12:07 AM   #17
Clark Turner
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The turbos I suggested where because the original poster wanted a wider power band. Not more power.

Another choice is the ATP3071. It works well on the 2.0 and has a pretty wide power band.

Clark
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Old 05-27-2009, 08:49 AM   #18
zeropsi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Turner View Post
The turbos I suggested where because the original poster wanted a wider power band. Not more power.

Another choice is the ATP3071. It works well on the 2.0 and has a pretty wide power band.

Clark
I understand (and agree) with your suggestions...it's someone else's I can't figure out.

The 3071 is one of my favorite 2.0 turbos.
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Old 05-27-2009, 11:19 AM   #19
Clark Turner
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Yeah, On mine, I ran a VF22, PE1820, AVO450, AVO500 and GT3076. I liked the GT3076 the best.

Clark
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Old 05-28-2009, 01:46 AM   #20
zeropsi
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I'm considering a 3076 for the 2.0 we're building.
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Old 10-16-2009, 12:39 AM   #21
zac5
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Found out the problem last week. my bov was leaking like crazy...so I adjusted the pre-load spring to the stiffest setting. Now problem solved, my car runs like a champ! Loving my subie again!

Going back to dyno for a re-tune soon.
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Old 10-22-2010, 05:08 AM   #22
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twinscrool
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