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Old 07-20-2009, 05:58 PM   #26
CatfaceType-R
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very nice, *cough, I hope you guy's remember who has always advocated the keeping of the stock frame turbo, cough*

that's a nice thing subaru's have over evo's too, truly limitless possibilities with fitment of aftermarket parts on the stock frame setup

spearco tmic(or garett core fmic), 3076 iwg, walbro, ported exhuast mani/crosspipe, cold air intake aps...done! perfect setup, keeping as much oem as possible and SIMPLE!!! 375whp all day long, add meth and boost and go for low 425's
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Old 07-20-2009, 06:26 PM   #27
Steve.804
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It's getting more difficult to decide to go rotated or not with turbos like these coming out for the stock location. Is there another company out there becides ATP that does not use a mitsubishi turbine housing? The biggest thing I like about the ATP is the larger A/R where the Blouch Dom 3 is limited to about .57A/R (8cm^2).
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Old 07-20-2009, 06:56 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve.804 View Post
It's getting more difficult to decide to go rotated or not with turbos like these coming out for the stock location. Is there another company out there becides ATP that does not use a mitsubishi turbine housing? The biggest thing I like about the ATP is the larger A/R where the Blouch Dom 3 is limited to about .57A/R (8cm^2).
AVO turbos use there own hotside too. talking to them at Suby Fest last year they make some pretty big A/R housings in stock location.
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Old 07-20-2009, 07:17 PM   #29
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I do have an AVO overlay.

Blue Line is an AVO 450 on a 2005 Legacy GT with a TMIC. Boost levels are obviously lower due to the heat soak of the smaller intercooler, but you can get an idea of how they compare to each other.

Red line is the 3076 EWG on a stock cammed, 93 Octane, 07 STi with a FMIC.




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Old 07-20-2009, 08:20 PM   #30
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i wonder if fp can modify one of the atp gt35r with their hta compressor wheels. i should call them to see if they can.
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Old 07-20-2009, 11:05 PM   #31
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AVO was my 2nd choice... The main reason I went with ATP is that I couldn't find out which Garrett parts AVO uses in which of their turbos. I think the AVO 500 uses the GT3076R compressor and turbine, but I couldn't confirm that, so I went with ATP.

It would be interesting to see those two compared, but there aren't many AVO 500s in the wild (if there were, I might not have been as concerned with finding out what's inside them).
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Old 07-20-2009, 11:05 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ownnij View Post
i wonder if fp can modify one of the atp gt35r with their hta compressor wheels. i should call them to see if they can.
I've been wondering the same thing...there's really no reason why they shouldn't be able to. A stock location HTA 3076R would be nice too.
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Old 07-21-2009, 11:18 AM   #33
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thing is they don't want to put their name on other people's turbo's, even though it isn't badged..i think that's why they do the garett stuff as it's pretty much the benchmark in turbo performance...idk if they are willing to touch other company like blouch/atp's stuff because they can make their own turbo that can do it as good/better...but who knows, i don't, just guessing
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Old 07-21-2009, 12:45 PM   #34
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you have a very good point but screw that. i would love my atp turbo to have a hta wheel. money is money damnit haha
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Old 07-21-2009, 07:25 PM   #35
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That would make sense...the HTA68 and HTA Green are Mistu based...

One can only hope. I think they'd do an HTA Red before an ATP 35R, since FP technically already makes their own stock location 65lb/min turbo.
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Old 07-21-2009, 07:31 PM   #36
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^yeah, they just need to ditch the mitsu turbine housing for something larger! If FP keeps up with these massive stock location turbos and paring them with a tiny 8cm^2 hotside they're going to be left behind!

An FP Red with an HTA wheel and custom back housing would be a serious turbo.
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Old 07-22-2009, 12:07 AM   #37
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Just tuned a pretty bad car from My friends at Turbo Time in Cary NC it has an atp30r in it 403whp/357tq @ 21psi. mustang dyno pull slike a champ. full boost by 3700rpms. I generally like the blouch turbos more But atp is a great turbo
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Old 08-02-2009, 10:35 PM   #38
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Here is one more test, on an equal car.

We decided to swap out the 35R for the 3076 since the driver was complaining of lag in the short course. As you can see, the difference between the 35R and 3076 is very noticeable. Although this car was fast in the long straight, he would get killed on the infield.. Now we have an evenly matched pair of STi's racing out there. Now, it's obvious that if we didn't force the taper on the 35R, the power output would have been significantly higher.

Red Line: ATP 35R IWG Stock fit turbo, EFI Logics Custom Front mount, APS 3.5 inch exhaust, DW 900cc Injectors, Custom Swirl pot with EFI Logics fuel system, Invidia EL Header, Cosworth 272 Cams, tune with Cobb Accessport - ST2 Class restricted power 20psi only

Blue Line: ATP 3076 IWG Stock fit turbo, EFI Logics Custom Front mount, APS 3.5 inch exhaust, DW 900cc Injectors, Custom Swirl pot with EFI Logics fuel system, Invidia EL Header, Cosworth 272 Cams, tune with Cobb Accessport - ST2 Class restricted power 20psi only



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Old 08-04-2009, 12:28 AM   #39
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Im planning on building a 2.5 hybrid and am curious to see an atp 3076 with meth...
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Old 08-04-2009, 12:10 PM   #40
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^^^^look up kellygnsd's thread on his build. it's exactly what you need.
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Old 08-04-2009, 04:28 PM   #41
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I have what he needs minus the meth
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Old 08-04-2009, 10:33 PM   #42
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Lots of info. Thanks!!!

I find it interesting that this yet again shows the suby's just won't flow more than ~300lbft of torque at 7K, even w/ cams.
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Old 08-04-2009, 11:00 PM   #43
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300 ft/lb @ 7k RPM is about 400hp. There aren't a lot of Subarus doing that, but I don't think you'd have to look too hard to find a few in the PPB forum. Within the first 2-3 pages, even.
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Old 08-05-2009, 12:44 AM   #44
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nice write up mate - definately has to be helpful to ppl looking at making over 350whp and not sure what turbo to look at or if they have to go rotated or not.

What I found interesting of all the comparisons was the ATP3076 (edit: @0.75 AR) with ewg vs rotated GT3076R with 0.82 AR and ewg:



If I understand what you said, then these results are both on stock cammed 2.5L running pump 93 - which makes this the best bolt-in vs rotated comparison on NASIOC bar none

It shows that there is no worthwhile advantage of going rotated over a bolt-in ATP of the same size (at least at lowish boost levels) and that both rotated and bolt-in are almost identical in power, torque and spool




It's also worth highlighting that you don't have to go rotated if you want to make 450whp, and infact the bolt-in ATP3582 is prolly a better choice if you want to make 450whp, with more power and torque earlier and much better spool then a UR rotated GT3582R kit:


Although I suspect the smaller hotside and the different cams and fuel used in your comparion also assisted the bolt-in ATP3582

Cheers for the effort and the comparisons, they were definately needed and greatly appreciated.

Leslie.
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Old 08-05-2009, 09:16 AM   #45
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These ATP turbos definitely hold their own when put up against a rotated 30R. Only thing I want to mention is that the ATP turbo car above is utiliizing ~2-3lb's more boost. Still great pump gas turbos....
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Old 08-05-2009, 12:05 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NSFW View Post
300 ft/lb @ 7k RPM is about 400hp. There aren't a lot of Subarus doing that, but I don't think you'd have to look too hard to find a few in the PPB forum. Within the first 2-3 pages, even.
Oh, I agree there are some pushing more at the 7K range, but...and I hate to over generalize...that even still you're talking 350 at most, and that's running E85, race gas, or a blend of alki mix.

On the flip side, some motors that have had some head work done and cammed, which seems far less common, can make some impressive numbers up top w/ pump gas even.

So my point is that bigger and bigger turbo's running massive boost make HUGE torque in the 4K range but it tapers down to right around 300~350 by redline. If you could uncork the top, these things would make huge HP numbers.

Anyway, I'm muddying this thread now. Impressive for these turbo's and I own an ATP on my other vehicle and have been pleased with it as well.
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Old 08-05-2009, 09:08 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrxsti.l View Post

Although I suspect the smaller hotside and the different cams and fuel used in your comparion also assisted the bolt-in ATP3582

Cheers for the effort and the comparisons, they were definately needed and greatly appreciated.

Leslie.
You are correct, the 35R graph was done with a 272 Cammed vehicle on 100 Octane.

Thank you for the compliments from down under

- Chris
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Old 08-06-2009, 11:42 PM   #48
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Very interesting, thank you for posting.
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Old 08-26-2009, 01:49 PM   #49
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I just received an email from ATP, stating they are on target to release the stock location twin-scroll turbo by the end of 2009 for Subaru's.
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Old 08-26-2009, 02:21 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soon2bblackongold View Post
very nice, *cough, I hope you guy's remember who has always advocated the keeping of the stock frame turbo, cough*

that's a nice thing subaru's have over evo's too, truly limitless possibilities with fitment of aftermarket parts on the stock frame setup

spearco tmic(or garett core fmic), 3076 iwg, walbro, ported exhuast mani/crosspipe, cold air intake aps...done! perfect setup, keeping as much oem as possible and SIMPLE!!! 375whp all day long, add meth and boost and go for low 425's

WHAT??? When it comes to turbo selection we got nothing on the EVOs manifold that takes correctly flanged turbos from the get go with many more hotside options.
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