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Old 07-25-2009, 11:51 AM   #1
ejoy1220
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Default Everyone should use this transmission fluid mix

Ok, so I just changed the transmission/front diff fluid with a 50/50 mix of Redline Lightweight Shockproof and Motul Gear 300 75w90. The rear with Valvoline 75w90.

Hooooly ****!

I recommend that anyone having any little niggling problems or annoyances with their Subaru transmission, switch to this fluid mix immediately.

I was having a slight grinding feeling going from 3rd to 4th at anything even resembling a moderate pace, and I usually skipped it all together.Now, under very quick shifts to 4th, nothing, at all. The transmission shifts absolutely butter smooth in every gear.
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Last edited by ejoy1220; 09-15-2009 at 03:30 PM.
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Old 07-25-2009, 11:57 AM   #2
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Sounds good.

although you may have just band-aid'd the problem, it should get you some more time on your transmission.

I have 117K on my trans with just run of the mill valvoline 75W90 in it without issue. I'll eventually switch to 100% Syncrhomesh or a synthetic valvoline and Syncromesh cocktail.
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Old 07-25-2009, 12:03 PM   #3
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YMMV but when I switched to 100% syncromesh in my bugeye at 30k (when Subaru replaced my 2nd and 4th gear syncros under warranty) a lot of my grinding issues went away... for a little while. Then at 50k I needed 2nd, 3rd, and 4th gear syncros replaced. I was also missing teeth on 4th gear.

I wasn't especially easy on that car but I wasn't especially hard either. I was stage II for half of it's life. I traded it in and vowed to never own an '02 or '03 WRX with a stock transmission again. To this day everyone I know brings up that transmission as a reason why "they will never buy a Subaru." On a side note I had 0 problems with my LGT and Saabaru.
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Old 07-25-2009, 01:17 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rabydanimal View Post
YMMV but when I switched to 100% syncromesh in my bugeye at 30k (when Subaru replaced my 2nd and 4th gear syncros under warranty) a lot of my grinding issues went away... for a little while.
Exactly, almost any oil feels good for a short time after the change. Give this 10k miles and if it's still great you're in luck. Extra S did the trick for me, many others sucked. This is another instance where OE parts are better than aftermarket.
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Old 07-25-2009, 01:39 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rabydanimal View Post
YMMV but when I switched to 100% syncromesh in my bugeye at 30k (when Subaru replaced my 2nd and 4th gear syncros under warranty) a lot of my grinding issues went away... for a little while. Then at 50k I needed 2nd, 3rd, and 4th gear syncros replaced. I was also missing teeth on 4th gear.

I wasn't especially easy on that car but I wasn't especially hard either. I was stage II for half of it's life. I traded it in and vowed to never own an '02 or '03 WRX with a stock transmission again. To this day everyone I know brings up that transmission as a reason why "they will never buy a Subaru." On a side note I had 0 problems with my LGT and Saabaru.
Just to be clear... you're blaming the stock transmission for breaking when you put the wrong fluid in on purpose?

I've owned almost a dozen Subies and honestly I really don't get where the transmission complaints come from.

/just saying.
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Old 07-25-2009, 01:50 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowphun View Post
Exactly, almost any oil feels good for a short time after the change. Give this 10k miles and if it's still great you're in luck. Extra S did the trick for me, many others sucked. This is another instance where OE parts are better than aftermarket.
True, this is a possibility, but it didn't grind any when it was cold, which made me think that when the fluid warmed up and thinned out is when it started to grind. If it starts to grind again at some point soon, I think I'll drain it again and go with a 75/25 mix of Redline and Motul.

Quote:
Originally Posted by americanyouth View Post
I've owned almost a dozen Subies and honestly I really don't get where the transmission complaints come from.

/just saying.
This was my experience exactly, I've never had any problems with any Subaru transmissions in the cars I've owned, this is the first time I've had an issue at all (except for regular clutch replacement in my LGT).
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Old 07-25-2009, 03:14 PM   #7
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I'm using butter next tranny oil change.....I expect it to shift like shockproof......


I think the biggest thing to know is to NOT put in super light stuff like MTL or auto tranny oil (not a cocktail fan). Anyone wanna buy 3 bottles of red line MTL? (bought for the Honda tranny)

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Old 07-25-2009, 03:59 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack ffr1846 View Post
I'm using butter next tranny oil change.....I expect it to shift like shockproof......


I think the biggest thing to know is to NOT put in super light stuff like MTL or auto tranny oil (not a cocktail fan). Anyone wanna buy 3 bottles of red line MTL? (bought for the Honda tranny)

jack
there is no auto tranny oil in any 'cocktail' that I know of
_______________________________________

and 100% synchromesh is one of the worst possible things to put in one of these transmissions
__________________________________________________ ___

most of these transmission issues are due to young drivers that want something outa something that is NOT gonna happen and they pound gears and break them and people who dont really know how to drive very well but think they do
and people who put the wrong lube in the trans and then have issues
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Old 07-25-2009, 05:46 PM   #9
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I've run shockproof in all my Subaru transmissions and I've never had a failure or a problem. I'm also not a fan of cocktails.
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Old 07-25-2009, 06:03 PM   #10
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I'm a fan of anything that works. I'm of the personal belief that anything less than 100% Motul 300 or Redline lightweight shockproof and you should be killed. Be that as it may...as much as I love those oils, there are others that have tried them and have had better results with other fluids. These trannies seem to prefer different oils depending, so I always say stick with what you like.
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Old 07-25-2009, 06:09 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Scotty View Post
there is no auto tranny oil in any 'cocktail' that I know of
_______________________________________
Bad choice of words on my part. Since I don't understand interaction between different tranny oils, I'm quite leary of mixing stuff together. That's not to say that there is or is not a problem doing so. It's to say that I overly research and when I cannot come to a conclusion, I stick with one thing.

Before changing my tranny oil a week ago, I did find people mixing MTL and people mixing Delcon II with shockproof. I don't believe it was on this forum....I searched all over the place before choosing my poison.

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Old 07-27-2009, 02:19 AM   #12
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well report back to us after couple thousand miles ...

all oil i tried was all good at the beginning but over time it noticebly gets bad..

so far straight motul 300 front and rear is the best.....
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Old 07-27-2009, 10:29 AM   #13
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The setup we continue to recommend is 3-quarts of Lightweight Shockproof and 1-quart of Motul Gear300.

I do recommend more frequent than factory-recommended fluid changes too. I say ~15,000 to 20,000 miles. It's cheap insurance to ensure a long service life of your transmission.

Phil
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Old 07-27-2009, 10:45 AM   #14
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I run 50/50 lightweight shockproof/ redline 75w 90 in my 6 speed, it shifts real nice.
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Old 07-27-2009, 10:49 AM   #15
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That's not the best of ideas. The 6MT has an internal oil pump that isn't suited to pump a fluid as thick as shockproof.

I'd swap that mix out with straight Motul Gear300. We use that in all of the 6-speeds that roll through and it seems to work QUITE well.

Phil
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Old 07-27-2009, 11:44 AM   #16
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AndrewtechAutomotive - Do you really recommend the mix you mentioned above (3-quarts of Lightweight Shockproof and 1-quart of Motul Gear300) given what Red Line says about their Shockproof product:

"Red Line's lightWeight Shockproof gear oil is designed to lubricate racing transmissions and transaxles that see serious loads (not recommended for most syncro-type transmissions)."

AND the fact that it's 75W-80 instead of 75W-90
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Old 07-27-2009, 12:09 PM   #17
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+1 for Motul Gear 300. Best stuff I have used in my 5-speed and I have previously used Redline 75w90NS and Subaru Extra S.

I also don't like the idea of cocktails and mixing different oils. Each oil has different viscosities and properties, which may or may not mix and could separate.
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Old 07-27-2009, 01:18 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snorekl View Post
AndrewtechAutomotive - Do you really recommend the mix you mentioned above (3-quarts of Lightweight Shockproof and 1-quart of Motul Gear300) given what Red Line says about their Shockproof product:

"Red Line's lightWeight Shockproof gear oil is designed to lubricate racing transmissions and transaxles that see serious loads (not recommended for most syncro-type transmissions)."

AND the fact that it's 75W-80 instead of 75W-90
I absolutely recommend this mix.

Why? I've spoken to the guys at Redline. The reason they don't recommend it for MOST synchro-type transmissions has to do with the amount of friction modifiers present in the fluid.

Typical GL-5 fluid has ~1% friction modifier. Shockproof has 3%.

The reason it's not for most synchro type transmissions is because it's actually to good a lubricant for most synchros to properly function.

As it IS rated for rear differentials, and the Subaru 5MT has what is essentially a rear differential as a front differential, there is no issue with respect to fluid pressures and stress.

The film thickness is what keeps our synchros working. Hydrostatic pressure builds between the balk ring and the synchro cone as pressure is applied. That pressure is what brakes the shaft.

SO, the reason Redline says it's not suitable for MOST (note: it doesn't say ALL) synchronized transmissions, is that it might be too slick for proper synchro function.

As it's been shown, it DOES allow proper function of Subaru synchronizers.

The only downside is the fluid thickness tends to have poor low-temp flow numbers. The solution to that? Mix it with a high quality synthetic fluid. The same thing we've been recommending for years.

The answer to your question is "yes" I still recommend this mix. Redline's warning does not apply to the Subaru 5MT.

Phil
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Old 07-27-2009, 05:25 PM   #19
ejoy1220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewtechAutomotive View Post
The setup we continue to recommend is 3-quarts of Lightweight Shockproof and 1-quart of Motul Gear300.

I do recommend more frequent than factory-recommended fluid changes too. I say ~15,000 to 20,000 miles. It's cheap insurance to ensure a long service life of your transmission.

Phil
Andrewtech Automotive
Thanks again for recommending this setup to me, I think next time I'll do the 75/25 mix, can I order it all from you? I had to order the Motul and Redline separately since I couldn't find a place that sold both, which was annoying as hell.
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Old 07-27-2009, 05:29 PM   #20
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I totally understand. I DO sell both and always have ample supply of each.

Just give me a call anytime you need anything.

Phil
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Old 07-29-2009, 07:22 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndrewtechAutomotive View Post
The setup we continue to recommend is 3-quarts of Lightweight Shockproof and 1-quart of Motul Gear300.

I do recommend more frequent than factory-recommended fluid changes too. I say ~15,000 to 20,000 miles. It's cheap insurance to ensure a long service life of your transmission.

Phil
Andrewtech Automotive
just for clarity is the motul 300 75w- 80 or 90 , you said you have it on hand all the time how much for all 4 qt.
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Old 07-29-2009, 07:42 PM   #22
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just go Extra-S and be done with it :P
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Old 07-29-2009, 08:18 PM   #23
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since this has turned into a discussion about different trans fluids has anyone had any experience with te AmsOil severe gear 75w-90. it is approved for use in GL-5 required applications (also MT-1, MIL-PRF-2105E, Dana SHAES 234, Eaton PS-037, and Mack GO-J, if anyone knows useful info about those specifications). It's compatable with LSD's, too. They make another heavy duty version of this stuff, so i guess this is their regular use stuff. Any first hand testimonials or known problems would be great as I have 6 qt's of this stuff ready to go in my 5MT and rear open diff.

One more ? - does the fluids weight change the VLSD's torque transfer abilities?

I refined my search keywords, tried a few more searches and found a ton of AmsOil info so N/M on the AmsOil info, but any radical 1st had experiences are welcome.

Last edited by GrundleJuice; 07-29-2009 at 08:58 PM.
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Old 07-30-2009, 08:35 AM   #24
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just go Extra-S and be done with it :P
THIS!
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Old 07-30-2009, 09:10 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaggy-with scoobi View Post
just for clarity is the motul 300 75w- 80 or 90 , you said you have it on hand all the time how much for all 4 qt.
The 75W90.

You can PM me for pricing if you'd like.

Phil
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