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Old 05-01-2002, 03:58 PM   #1
North Ursalia
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Default Gear Ratio Reference Thread

Just an FYI post so we have it. Will be up on the Ravensblade site soon as well, just in case Nasioc.com explodes some day .


Impreza 2.2l L models:

Automatic transmission gear ratios:
1st - 2.785
2nd - 1.545
3rd - 1.000
4th - 0.694
reverse - 2.272
final drive ratio - 4.11

Manual transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.545
2nd - 1.947
3rd - 1.366
4th - 0.972
5th - 0.780
reverse - 3.333
final drive ratio - 3.90


Impreza 2.5RS models:

Automatic transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.027
2nd - 1.619
3rd - 1.000
4th - 0.694
reverse - 2.272
final drive ratio - 4.44

Manual transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.545
2nd - 2.111
3rd - 1.448
4th - 1.088
5th - 0.780
reverse - 3.333
final drive ratio - 4.11


WRX 2.0l models:

Automatic transmission gear ratios:
1st - 2.785
2nd - 1.545
3rd - 1.000
4th - 0.684
reverse - 2.272
final drive ratio - 4.11

Manual transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.454
2nd - 1.947
3rd - 1.366
4th - 0.972
5th - 0.738
reverse - 3.333
final drive ratio - 3.90

2006/2007 WRX 2.5l models:

Automatic transmission gear ratios:
1st - 2.785
2nd - 1.545
3rd - 1.000
4th - 0.684
reverse - 2.272
final drive ratio - 3.90

Manual transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.454
2nd - 1.947
3rd - 1.366
4th - 0.972
5th - 0.738
reverse - 3.333
final drive ratio - 3.70

2008 WRX 2.5l models:

Automatic transmission gear ratios:
1st - 2.785
2nd - 1.545
3rd - 1.000
4th - 0.684
reverse - 2.272
final drive ratio - 3.90

Manual transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.166
2nd - 1.882
3rd - 1.296
4th - 0.972
5th - 0.780
reverse - 3.333
Final drive ratio - 3.900

Impreza WRX STi models:

2004-2006 manual transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.636
2nd - 2.375
3rd - 1.761
4th - 1.346
5th - 0.971
6th - 0.756
reverse - 3.545
final drive ratio - 3.90

2007+ manual transmission gear ratios:

1st: 3.636
2nd: 2.235
3rd: 1.521
4th:1.137
5th:0.971
6th: 0.756
reverse - 3.545
final drive ratio - 3.90

Outback 3.0R/VDC/LL Bean

Automatic transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.540
2nd - 2.264
3rd - 1.471
4th - 1.000
5th - 0.834
reverse - 2.370
final drive ratio - 3.583

2007 Legacy 2.5GT Spec.B

6-speed Manual transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.636
2nd - 2.235
3rd - 1.521
4th - 1.137
5th - 0.891
6th - 0.707
reverse - ???
final drive ratio - 3.454

B-9 Tribeca

Automatic transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.84
2nd - 2.35
3rd - 1.53
4th - 1.00
5th - 0.84
reverse - 2.77
final drive ratio - 3.58

Brian
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Last edited by Unabomber; 09-16-2008 at 11:01 PM. Reason: 2007 changes
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Old 05-02-2002, 02:37 AM   #2
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can we sticky this??
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Old 05-02-2002, 02:56 AM   #3
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Default Re: Gear Ratio Reference Thread

Quote:
Originally posted by North Ursalia
Impreza 2.5RS models:
Manual transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.545
2nd - 2.111
3rd - 1.448
4th - 1.088
5th - 0.780
reverse - 3.333
final drive ratio - 4.11
Interesting to see that I was just using these numbers to calculate the ideal shift points I posted in another thread at the same time this is posted.

Anyway, just want to mention that the above ratios are for 2.5 RS GC6 (MY99 - MY01).

The 5-speed manual ratio for 2002 2.5 RS is as follows (based on Car and Driver, November 2001):

1st - 3.45
2nd - 2.06
3rd - 1.45
4th - 1.09
5th - 0.78
axle ratio - 4.11

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Old 05-02-2002, 02:58 AM   #4
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I wonder what the old 1.8L's ratios were?

At any rate, here's my '94 jspec WRX gear ratios, for comparison's sake. Whether it's true or not, I've read that it's a nice compromise between ideal highway cruising ratios and track ratios, and a good gear box for autoxing:

1st - 3.454
2nd - 2.062
3rd - 1.448
4th - 1.088
5th - 0.825
Reverse - 3.416
final drive ratio - 4.111
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Old 05-02-2002, 11:30 AM   #5
North Ursalia
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Default Re: Re: Gear Ratio Reference Thread

Quote:
Originally posted by gypsymoth
The 5-speed manual ratio for 2002 2.5 RS is as follows (based on Car and Driver, November 2001):

1st - 3.45
2nd - 2.06
3rd - 1.45
4th - 1.09
5th - 0.78
axle ratio - 4.11

Chieh
My information comes directly from the horse's mouth (SOA) so I trust their numbers a bit more than Car and Driver .


Brian
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Old 05-02-2002, 03:30 PM   #6
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Default Re: Re: Re: Gear Ratio Reference Thread

Quote:
Originally posted by North Ursalia


My information comes directly from the horse's mouth (SOA) so I trust their numbers a bit more than Car and Driver .


Brian
What years are the 2.5 RS ratios for? MY98 - MY02? Or MY99 - MY02? or MY00 - MY01? And what SOA publication did it come from? Just trying to figure it out.

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Old 05-02-2002, 04:01 PM   #7
North Ursalia
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MY98-02 RS... it came from a contact inside SOA- I'm not sure of what publication or manual it came out of, but I do trust the manufacturer's data over Car and Driver. I don't see Subaru using a completely different gear ratio setup than they have now for the RS... they'd use the 98-01 or the US '02 WRX gear ratios, but I just don't see them coming up with a new gearset when they already have something that works .


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Old 05-03-2002, 03:46 PM   #8
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ok... so this got me thinking

do you have the info for a RA tranny? STI 4-5-6?
is the final ratio low or is it the differnace the other gears?
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Old 05-03-2002, 11:34 PM   #9
North Ursalia
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Of course I do . They are on the Impreza History page on the Ravensblade site, located hnyarh ...

http://northursalia.com/techdocs/history/history.html

You should be able to find the "base" STi gear ratios as well as Type R/RA ratios... I think I finally found the gear ratios for every special edition listed on that page, including reverse and final drive. Still on the hunt for more all the time however .


Brian
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Last edited by North Ursalia; 04-18-2012 at 01:39 PM.
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Old 05-04-2002, 11:43 PM   #10
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I wonder how the 1/4 mile times on the wrx would change if we lowered our final's to a 4.11. I bet that we would see much quicker times.

How hard is it to swap out the finals?

Andy
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Old 05-04-2002, 11:51 PM   #11
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Default can't use the 4.11s

You can't use the 4.11's in the MT5 WRX, it has
different diff ratios front and rear, and a 1.1:1 reduction ratio in the transfer case to the rear diff. (probably to get the tail happy torque split)

The front diff is 3.90 and the rear diff is 3.545 but the 1.1:1 transfer case reduction gives a final rear ratio of 3.90.

Bummer

Larry
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Old 05-06-2002, 02:48 PM   #12
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intersting...

do any of the other trannys have the 1.1:1 transfer case reduction...
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Old 05-06-2002, 11:04 PM   #13
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Default I think the US WRX is the only one

I think the U.S. WRX is the only one. I'm at work so don't have any ref materials here.

Larry
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Old 05-11-2002, 05:54 PM   #14
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Default

I have been reading about these gear ratios, and sometimes you refer to the final as the axle ratio... or something. Is this a Subaru thing? I have been led to believe that the axle ratio and the final drive are two completely different things. If you look in some Motor Trends they have the trans specs on some cars, and in the article I was looking at, ost cars final drives were in the mid to high 2's like 2.73/1. Then looking at the axle ratios, most were in the high 3's to 4's. Does the final have something to do with the tire diameter and the axle ratio or what? I know this though, my rear end on my old Ford was was a 4.10, meaning in the differential the ratio was 4.1 to 1 for the ring and pinion (or vice versa) So what the heck is a final drive?
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Old 05-11-2002, 07:57 PM   #15
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Default final drive and axle ratio

You are correct. Many peope get lazy and use the term final drive ratio for the axle ratio. It is and should be the product of all gears in use, from flywheel to tire. So the final drive ratio in low gear is the product of the low gear ratio and the rear end ratio.

Part of the problem is that for years in most cars the high gear was always a direct 1:1 hookup, so in this case the final drive (in high gear) is the same as the axle ratio. Over the last couple decades there has been a move to make the top one or two gears overdrive ratios in order to get good gas milage. In cars with those transmissions, there is NO gear where the final drive ratio and the rear axle ratio are identical.

Sometimes we all get a little sloppy technically speaking and as long as everyone in the conversation understands the assumptions being made it works, but can lead to lots of confusion if one party to the conversation is making different assumptions.

You'll note that in formulas where they are computing road speed from engine rpm, gear ratios and tire size you have to use the proper definition of final drive ratio to get proper results. If it is clear that everyone is talking only about rear end ratios I usually let the misuse of the term slide as making the correction only causes hate and discontent unless the distinction is necessary for a valid discussion.

Larry
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Old 05-13-2002, 04:36 PM   #16
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North.. I sent you a PM in regards to gear ratios for 2.2L Outback sports.. wondering if they are different as I thought mine was 4.11.. need to look at the stamp on my rear diff.
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Old 05-14-2002, 01:16 PM   #17
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Comparison of the stock gear ratios and the Chalak synchro set being sold by Larry Ganz

Chalak 4.11         &n bsp;       &nbs p; Stock 4.11
1st gear 3.18 ratio       &nb sp; 1st - 3.545
2nd gear 1.94 ratio       &nb sp;2nd - 2.111
3rd gear 1.35 ratio       &nb sp; 3rd - 1.448
4th gear 0.966 ratio       4th - 1.088
5th gear 0.78 ratio       &nb sp; 5th - 0.780

Chalak 3.90       &nbs p;           Stock 3.90
1st gear 3.18 ratio       &nb sp; 1st - 3.454
2nd gear 1.94 ratio       &nb sp;2nd - 1.947
3rd gear 1.35 ratio       &nb sp; 3rd - 1.366
4th gear 0.966 ratio       4th - 0.972
5th gear 0.825 ratio       5th - 0.738

IIRC higher number equals shorter gear so as stated that the 4.11 chalak set is a closer ratio for the first 3 gears appears false, unless the numbers posted in Larry's GB thread are false.
Interesting indeed.
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Old 05-14-2002, 07:53 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by omahasubaru
IIRC higher number equals shorter gear so as stated that the 4.11 chalak set is a closer ratio for the first 3 gears appears false, unless the numbers posted in Larry's GB thread are false.
Interesting indeed.
I might be miss reading what you are saying, but from the numbers you posted the Chalak 4.11 does have closer gearing than the stock 4.11. The stock setup has a shorter gearing, but a bigger gap in gearing between the gears. I think you are getting "short" and "close" confused. Or maybe I am
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Old 06-03-2002, 07:40 PM   #19
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Default Re: can't use the 4.11s

Quote:
Originally posted by hotrod
You can't use the 4.11's in the MT5 WRX, it has
different diff ratios front and rear, and a 1.1:1 reduction ratio in the transfer case to the rear diff. (probably to get the tail happy torque split)

The front diff is 3.90 and the rear diff is 3.545 but the 1.1:1 transfer case reduction gives a final rear ratio of 3.90.

Bummer

Larry
hmm.... I am running 2002 USDM wrx motor w/ stock RS tranny right now. the car runs fine..
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Old 06-03-2002, 08:11 PM   #20
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Default Re: Gear Ratio Reference Thread

Quote:
Originally posted by North Ursalia
Impreza 2.5RS models:

Automatic transmission gear ratios:
1st - 3.027
2nd - 1.619
3rd - 1.000
4th - 0.694
reverse - 2.272
final drive ratio - 4.44

WRX 2.0l models:

Automatic transmission gear ratios:
1st - 2.785
2nd - 1.545
3rd - 1.000
4th - 0.694
reverse - 2.272
final drive ratio - 4.11
Question for the experts: can the RS gears on the 4EAT (1st and 2nd) be transplanted into the WRX 4EAT? I'm not talking about differentials or final drive ratio, just 1st and 2nd gear.

I'm wondering because they may be better for drag racing. Any benefits/drawbacks? Any TCU issues?

Just curious to know my options if/when I ever blow up my tranny.

Padre
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Old 06-03-2002, 08:19 PM   #21
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Default good info

Thats good to know. I was refering to putting the RS ring and pinions in a WRX tranny. According to the Subaru specs it (the RS) has a different gear split front to rear ( no 1.1:1 transfer case step) than the WRX so does not use different ring and pinions in the front diff and rear like the WRX does.

Its nice to know the stock RS tranny will work with the US 2002 WRX, Is that in a WRX chassis, or did you put the WRX motor in a differnet model Subaru. The stock RS tranny as a unit would not have the 1.1 - 1 gear step down to the rear, so its diff ratio would be the same front and rear.

The issue is if your in a 2002 WRX chassis, did you put the tranny in with out changing the rear diff ratio to match. I would expect that is not possible, as you would have a 3.545 rear diff and the RS front diff at 4.11.

If you can put the RS rear diff ring and pinion in the WRX rear diff, and swap out the entire transmission to the RS transmission, you would get the 4.11 front diff of the RS and that should work, just a lot more expense and trouble than I had in mind.

There may still be a path to sensible gearing here, just a lot more expensive than swapping out a couple ring gears and pinions.

Larry
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Old 06-03-2002, 08:25 PM   #22
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actually, the engine is in a GC8 chassis w/ wrx cross member. sorry for not clarifying..
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Old 06-23-2002, 06:25 AM   #23
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Default Re: final drive and axle ratio

Quote:
Originally posted by hotrod
Over the last couple decades there has been a move to make the top one or two gears overdrive ratios in order to get good gas milage.

Larry
A quick correction of terms, hot rod...

To my understanding, an "overdrive" ratio is a top gear (or two) in which the car won't hit top speed, i.e. a fifth gear (or sixth, or both) that yields a lower top speed than fourth gear. The top gear ratio and axle ratio, then, aren't important.
A lot of slushboxes are "overdrive" units to save gas, and the manual tranny Corvette, for example, hits top speed in fourth or fifth gear, but not sixth, it's geared too high.

Using this definition, and what I've read from magazine tests, our Subarus don't actually have "overdrive'' transmissions (at least not the manuals), because top speed is reached in fifth, not fourth gear. Fourth gear is too short for top speed.

Ben
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Old 06-23-2002, 06:47 AM   #24
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Default overdrive

Overdrive is any gear that has a ratio less than 1:1, so the drive line turns faster than the engine does.

The earliest over drives were planetary gear sets that stepped up the effective ratio of the drive shaft. If you look in old car magazines around the late 1970's you can see advertisements for accessory overdrive units to increase the gas milage of the cars of that period. Up until gas prices went sky high following the oil embargo almost all American cars had a high gear in the transmission that was a 1:1 ratio. Prior to that only cars that sold to nich markets like the American Motors Rambler, that pushed good gas milage as part of their marketing strategy, had overdrive transmissions. In the mid 70's when the gas crisis made gas milage a big selling point, manufacturers started putting high gears in the transmissions with ratios less than 1:1. Only in recent years have they had more than one gear with these very long ratios.

The term overdrive has nothing to do with if the car can hit top speed, although that is frequently a side effect of those very tall gears. Over time it became a generic term for any gearing that drastically reduced engine rpm for fuel economy.

Larry

Here's a link showing the original form of the overdrive planetary gear units.

http://www.plymouthbulletin.com/over...overdrive.html

And here's a link to a 1975 press release for overdrive transmissions stressing the economy advantage.

http://www.dodgedart.org/press/press75a.html

Last edited by hotrod; 06-23-2002 at 07:13 AM.
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Old 10-25-2002, 10:45 AM   #25
stimpy
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I just thought I would add a little clarification here about RimRockaz post. The fact that he is using a MY02 WRX engine and an RS tranny is irrelevant because he has NOT mix-n-matched trannies and rear diffs. Whatever the front final drive is set to is irrelevant to this application because the RS rear diff and the RS tranny are still mated together.

Now, if he had an RS tranny in a MY02 WRX chassis with the WRX rear end, then it would be a problem as the front and rear would be different ratios and the center diff would be toast shortly.

For the MY02 WRX transmission, your options are rather limited as to what rear diff you can use ( read: use the MY02 rear diff or else). However, if you use most any of the other transmissions, you can mix and match from a wide variety of transmissions and rear ends.

Just to reiterate, the engine itself is irrelevant to the application as any of the 5mt/auto trannies will bolt right up to any EJ series engine. In bolting up a new tranny, you change all the gearing in the front of the car. From there you must make sure you have a corresponding rear end.

-Jon
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