track tires

[winkie711]

I'm having a hard time deciding on R compounds or just a nice street/track set...although right now I only have one set of rims. Recommendations? What size have people ran tires on the stock BBS's? stuck with the 225's or gone 235?

I'm looking at:

Bridgestone RE 011's or RE070's
Yokohama ADVAN Neova AD07's
BFGoodrich g-Force R1's
Kumho Ecsta V710's
Michelin Pilot Sport Cups
Nitto Invos

I've only tracked with the stock RE070's, which I was actually pretty impressed with for a stock tire. It didn't grip as good as these others listed (especially the R compounds) but it offered a lot of predictability. Will I lose predictability with R compounds? I've heard that R compounds tend to be all or none, meaning all grip and then no grip. Sorry I'm so naive, but I'm trying to be an educated consumer, so I appreciate your insight.

I have zero experience with any of these...so any of your opinions/experience is appreciated!

* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

[van_dutch]

Running R comps is not recommended on the street. You really need a second set of wheels if you intend to run R comps. What is your experience level when it comes to tracking?

[REX8]

Why aren't NT-01's on your list? Or R888's? Or A048's?

You're on the fence about sticky street tires or R comps, yet you don't look at the popular, long-lasting R's?

I is confused.

[mav1c]

If you're running R-Comps for the first time, you need to do a few things.

1.) Take these off your list:

BFGoodrich g-Force R1's
Kumho Ecsta V710's

2.) Put these on your list:

Nitto NT-01
Toyo R888

3.) Buy a separate set of wheels for the r-comps.

If you won't buy a separate set of wheels, stick with a grippy street tire. Take the Invo off your list.

[nickrice20]

Yokohama ADVAN Neova AD07's

Huge fan of these tires they are great all around. If you are looking for a tire that will handle the street for 10-12k miles with the occasional track use these are the tires for you. I have run them on track temps of up to 150 degree and they only got greasy at the end of the session. They are also great in the rain with full tread and I am now using them primarily for that purpose as I have finally went to true R-compunds for the dry. These tires kept me from hydroplaning at 145-155 mph on the front stretch at Portland International with some pretty heavy rain falling. Just my .02 good luck. Oh and I am using stock BBS with 235/40 or 45/17 can't remember the sidewall size.

Nick

[mosc]

R comps don't make sense unless your car will see more track duty than street. A 30 second low speed autocross doesn't count either. They won't even heat up.

I agree with the Neova recommendation. Those are already pretty excessive for a street tire. They won't disappoint at the track either. The new AD08s look really nice.

[winkie711]

Originally Posted by van_dutch

Running R comps is not recommended on the street. You really need a second set of wheels if you intend to run R comps. What is your experience level when it comes to tracking?

Yeah, I realize that you can't really run R comps on the street...I wasn't planning on that. I guess I don't know if I should get a different wheel size if I go with R comps, or if I should just get another set of BBS's.

As far as my experience goes, I have gone to several track days, none of which were time sanctioned. I rode shotgun in several cars with R comps and track dedicated brake pads and saw how they completely transform a car...hence my interest in R comps.

[winkie711]

Originally Posted by REX8

Why aren't NT-01's on your list? Or R888's? Or A048's?

You're on the fence about sticky street tires or R comps, yet you don't look at the popular, long-lasting R's?

I is confused.

I is also confused, hence the reason I'm posting for help. Thanks for the recommendations on the NT 01's and R888's. I'm checking out reviews now.

[winkie711]

Originally Posted by mav1c

If you're running R-Comps for the first time, you need to do afew things.

1.) Take these off your list:

BFGoodrich g-Force R1's
Kumho Ecsta V710's

2.) Put these on your list:

Nitto NT-01
Toyo R888

3.) But a separate set of wheels for the r-comps.

If you won't buy a separate set of wheels, stick with a grippy street tire. Take the Invo off your list.

Do the g-Force R1's and Kumho's really suck that bad?

Thanks for more recommendations on the Nittos and Toyos.

[winkie711]

Originally Posted by nickrice20

Yokohama ADVAN Neova AD07's

Huge fan of these tires they are great all around. If you are looking for a tire that will handle the street for 10-12k miles with the occasional track use these are the tires for you. I have run them on track temps of up to 150 degree and they only got greasy at the end of the session. They are also great in the rain with full tread and I am now using them primarily for that purpose as I have finally went to true R-compunds for the dry. These tires kept me from hydroplaning at 145-155 mph on the front stretch at Portland International with some pretty heavy rain falling. Just my .02 good luck. Oh and I am using stock BBS with 235/40 or 45/17 can't remember the sidewall size.

Nick

Originally Posted by mosc

R comps don't make sense unless your car will see more track duty than street. A 30 second low speed autocross doesn't count either. They won't even heat up.

I agree with the Neova recommendation. Those are already pretty excessive for a street tire. They won't disappoint at the track either. The new AD08s look really nice.

Thanks for the Neova recommendations...and no, I'm not planning on using R comps for 30 second auto X runs.

[mosc]

If you're interested in R comps, what's with that crappy list you put togeather? Most of the tires on there aren't R comps or even close! Nito Invos?? They make the NT05 (or NT555) which is a lot closer to a track tire and that's not even their R comp, it's the NT01.

Extreme Tires:
Bridgestone RE-11 (RE070 is not really comparable)
Yokohama AD08 (AD07 is older version)
Kumho XS
Dunlop Star Specs
Nitto NT05 (Invo is not really comparable)
etc...

Better than that is an R comp:
Toyo R888
Yokohama A048
Nitto NT01
etc...

The next tier you get into all out dry comp tires you really don't want to drive on roads:
BFG g-Force R1
Hoosier A6
Kumho V710s
etc...

You seem to be mixing up tires that are in totally different classes. What type of tire you can run is going to be mostly determined by the event.

[winkie711]

Originally Posted by mosc

If you're interested in R comps, what's with that crappy list you put togeather? Most of the tires on there aren't R comps or even close! Nito Invos?? They make the NT05 (or NT555) which is a lot closer to a track tire and that's not even their R comp, it's the NT01.

Extreme Tires:
Bridgestone RE-11 (RE070 is not really comparable)
Yokohama AD08 (AD07 is older version)
Kumho XS
Dunlop Star Specs
Nitto NT05 (Invo is not really comparable)
etc...

Better than that is an R comp:
Toyo R888
Yokohama A048
Nitto NT01
etc...

The next tier you get into all out dry comp tires you really don't want to drive on roads:
BFG g-Force R1
Hoosier A6
Kumho V710s
etc...

You seem to be mixing up tires that are in totally different classes. What type of tire you can run is going to be mostly determined by the event.

Yeah, I realize that my list is a mish-mash of different categories of tires. I also didn't clearly state that I am trying to decide if it's worth while to get a dedicated track set, or to simply find a good street tire that can handle a couple track days without totally wearing out the whole tire. I was thinking that it made the most sense to keep street tires and track tires separate as opposed to trying to make one tire do both...

[nickrice20]

It all depends on how much time you really plan on spending at the track. If you plan on doing HPDE's three or four time a year I would stick with an all around tire. If you plan on getting into time trials and spending a lot of time at the track than I would go for an R-comp tire and a street tire. It also really depends on what you want to spend. If you have money laying around that you want to spend than R-comps are a great investment. Just beware that with the R-comps you will be wanting to change brake pad compounds to something a little more harsh because your brake temps will go up drastically.

This can also get expensive because wheel bearings will go a lot faster with R-comps as well. Just little things to think about before stepping in that direction. I chose a second set of stock BBS wheels for my track wheels because it is easy to pick a set up cheap as dirt and they are forged and not that heavy so they are great for the track.

By the sound of things you have not even upgraded your stock braking system yet? If I were you I would do that before even thinking about stepping into a R-comps. I upgraded to EBC rotors, EBC yellows soon to be Raybestos ST-43, braided lines, Super blue fluid, and removed my heat shield on the front brakes. Also what suspension are you running if stock then I would also think about an upgrade there as well before making the tire change. Some more advice from what I have learned so far in my quest for the best track/street car setup.

Nick

[Luke@tirerack]

As many have already said the tires you have listed do not seem to go together.

The BFG G-Force R1 and the Kumho V710 are not tires you want to drive on the street as they are slicks which pick up everything and thus are prone to punctures. R-compound are not as progessive in their break away characteristics as a really aggressive street tire. The Sport Cup you mention is a great choice if you want a R-COmpound tre which is very streetable and also progressive when puched past the limits ( but watch out for rain).

Most will find the top contenders in the Extreme Performance catagory to be more than enough tire to enjoy the occassional track day or AutoX while still being compliant enough for comfortable daily driving.

and the Invo shouldn't even be in this discussion ... the NT01 would be Nitto's entry

[winkie711]

Originally Posted by nickrice20

It all depends on how much time you really plan on spending at the track. If you plan on doing HPDE's three or four time a year I would stick with an all around tire. If you plan on getting into time trials and spending a lot of time at the track than I would go for an R-comp tire and a street tire. It also really depends on what you want to spend. If you have money laying around that you want to spend than R-comps are a great investment. Just beware that with the R-comps you will be wanting to change brake pad compounds to something a little more harsh because your brake temps will go up drastically.

This can also get expensive because wheel bearings will go a lot faster with R-comps as well. Just little things to think about before stepping in that direction. I chose a second set of stock BBS wheels for my track wheels because it is easy to pick a set up cheap as dirt and they are forged and not that heavy so they are great for the track.

By the sound of things you have not even upgraded your stock braking system yet? If I were you I would do that before even thinking about stepping into a R-comps. I upgraded to EBC rotors, EBC yellows soon to be Raybestos ST-43, braided lines, Super blue fluid, and removed my heat shield on the front brakes. Also what suspension are you running if stock then I would also think about an upgrade there as well before making the tire change. Some more advice from what I have learned so far in my quest for the best track/street car setup.

Nick

Thank you. This post was very helpful. I was prepared to upgrade pads and suspension, however I hadn't given much thought to rotors, brake lines and bearings.

[mosc]

Originally Posted by winkie711

Yeah, I realize that my list is a mish-mash of different categories of tires. I also didn't clearly state that I am trying to decide if it's worth while to get a dedicated track set, or to simply find a good street tire that can handle a couple track days without totally wearing out the whole tire. I was thinking that it made the most sense to keep street tires and track tires separate as opposed to trying to make one tire do both...

This is a really good question but one that can't be answered without SOME information on specifically what kind of events you're going to be doing.

[winkie711]

Originally Posted by mosc

This is a really good question but one that can't be answered without SOME information on specifically what kind of events you're going to be doing.

I'm averaging 3-4 track days/yr. The rest is just spirited street driving. No auto X plans, I just like lapping at the track in unsanctioned events with my friends. I may eventually get into some timed races, after a lot more practice though.

[mosc]

Definately look at the extreme summer tire performance category. Neova AD08's being the grippiest on the track (and the most expensive). Star Specs are very grippy, a lot cheaper, and very popular. Other good choices in that category too.

[Luke@tirerack]

Originally Posted by winkie711

I'm averaging 3-4 track days/yr. The rest is just spirited street driving. No auto X plans, I just like lapping at the track in unsanctioned events with my friends. I may eventually get into some timed races, after a lot more practice though.

With that type of use you would be better served by an extreme performance tire ...

the top four are

Bridgestone Potenza RE11
Yokohama Advan Neova AD08
Kumho Ecsta XS
Dunlop Direzza Sport Z1 Star Spec

here's a link to our head to head testing of them

[mav1c]

Originally Posted by winkie711

Do the g-Force R1's and Kumho's really suck that bad?

Thanks for more recommendations on the Nittos and Toyos.

The R1's and V710's don't suck at all. They're just too grippy for a first time R-Comp. Those are tires you want to run if you're getting into time trials or racing.

Really, I think a good set of tires like the ones Luke listed would be your best bet. I didn't switch to R-Comps until like my 20th event. I started on crappy street tires, moved to grippy street tires, then went to R-Comps.

[aclver1]

I would say for that amount of track time you are better off buying an ultra high performance street tire and a set of winter tires and skip the race tires. If you are in Boston or SLC. If you are not racing, it's an expensive tire just for fun and you need a second set of wheels. But then again I have different tires for every occasion. summer, winter and track. My Hoosier r6's are fun on the track but I drive an RS so every little bit helps.

[boost junkie]

Street tires are getting good enough now that they really aren't that far off of r-comps. In your situation, I'd get a set of RE11's, AD08's, or Star Specs. If you have to have r-comps, the Toyo R888 is probably the best option as far as wear and predictability, but they will wear about twice as fast as the ones mentioned above. You will also notice that their grip level will fall off a lot about halfway through their life.

[winkie711]

Originally Posted by boost junkie

Street tires are getting good enough now that they really aren't that far off of r-comps. In your situation, I'd get a set of RE11's, AD08's, or Star Specs. If you have to have r-comps, the Toyo R888 is probably the best option as far as wear and predictability, but they will wear about twice as fast as the ones mentioned above. You will also notice that their grip level will fall off a lot about halfway through their life.

Thank you!

[bcblues]

Another thing to consider is that if you only doa couple track days a year, if you have a second set of rims, with track-specific tires, you will likely end up swapping out half-used tires because they had gotten "hard". I agree that the latest ultra street tires are freaking awesome in terms of grip and predictability. I think that the latest, greatest ultra street tires would beat up on the top track tires of even 10 years ago. Especially given their half life.

[No.11]

Originally Posted by Luke@tirerack

With that type of use you would be better served by an extreme performance tire ...

the top four are

Bridgestone Potenza RE11
Yokohama Advan Neova AD08
Kumho Ecsta XS
Dunlop Direzza Sport Z1 Star Spec

here's a link to our head to head testing of them

So between the 4 tires tested, what is the most recommendable for a DD STi in Southern California who will maybe see 1 maybe 2 track days a year if at all?