Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Saturday July 12, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
Click here to visit TireRack
Brakes & Suspension Forum sponsored by The Tire Rack

Losing traction? Need new tires?
Click here to visit the NASIOC Upgrade Garage...
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Brakes, Steering & Suspension

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-09-2009, 11:13 AM   #1
J Ritt
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 3738
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Charlotte, NC
Vehicle:
2003 Corvette Z06
Yellow

Default Article: How to Choose Street and Track Brake Pads

Hi Guys,
I wanted to post a link to an article I recently wrote about how to choose street and track brake pads. I know this has always been a popular topic on this forum, and one that creates a lot of confusion.

This is NOT an article promoting a specific brand or brands. It is intended to lay out the thought processes and variables that go into choosing a pad for any street or track condition.

As a representative for some of the top brake manufacturers in the aftermarket for the past 7 years, I’ve had the chance to address this topic in countless conversations with customers online, over the phone, or in person. Until now though, I’ve never had the time to pull my thoughts together and present them in a cohesive manner.

My hope is that this article will prevent some of the repetitive “what are the best brake pads?” questions we’ve all seen a million times. With a fundamental understanding of this topic in hand, we can hopefully elevate future conversations on this topic to a higher, more productive level.

I’d post the article here in its entirety, but it would probably take me 20 posts!

Thanks and enjoy: CLICK HERE TO READ THE ARTICLE
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

Last edited by Scooby921; 11-12-2009 at 04:42 PM.
J Ritt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2009, 02:02 PM   #2
Scooby921
Thanks Sir Alex!
Moderator
 
Member#: 88606
Join Date: Jun 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Clarkston
Vehicle:
2011 GMC Sierra
'13 JCW

Default

Fantastic article!!! I read through the article pretty quickly...its pretty much everything we all try to explain whenever anyone asks about brake pads.

Will this article be hosted on that website long-term? If not I'd love to get a copy of it to host elsewhere so its always available to the members of this forum who are looking for brake and pad information. Or if you don't mind me copying and pasting I'll just create its own thread and take care of those 20 or so posts necessary to post it all...and sticky it at the top of the page for all to see.
Scooby921 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2009, 03:49 PM   #3
J Ritt
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 3738
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Charlotte, NC
Vehicle:
2003 Corvette Z06
Yellow

Default

Thanks Scooby921. I appreciate the feedback. I put some hours in writing that thing, so I'm really glad it will be of assistance to forum members.

The article will remain on the Essex site, so no worries. Also, I'm working on some other brake-related material as well...stay tuned. Thanks again.
J Ritt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2009, 04:05 PM   #4
ProDarwin
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 134943
Join Date: Dec 2006
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Oakton
Vehicle:
94 SW2, 95 SW2
9(?) Lemons Car

Default

Good read.

Somewhat on topic: When a pad manufacturer lists the material as "composite" (i.e. Hawk HPS on Tire Rack), what are they referring to?
ProDarwin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2009, 05:54 PM   #5
cucamelsmd15
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 122980
Join Date: Aug 2006
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Raleigh, NC
Vehicle:
2010 F150, 2013 CX-5
92 Miata 15 TTF/PTF/E3

Default

This is a damn fantastic article. Thank you '921 or whoever stuck this. Definitely worth the read.
cucamelsmd15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2009, 08:14 PM   #6
MNGman
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 218964
Join Date: Jul 2009
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Minneapolis Metro
Vehicle:
2009 WRX
Rally Blue

Default

Great Article, just started autocrossing. Answered many questions I've been asking in my head...
MNGman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2009, 09:58 PM   #7
ronemus
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 124146
Join Date: Aug 2006
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Vehicle:
'02 Legacy GT 5MT
Titanium

Default

Thanks for the writeup. I've worked through many of the same points by considering information from a variety of threads on several forums, and it's good to see it put together coherently in one place.

I've come across what may come close to being the universal pad we'd almost all like to have. I'm now running PosiQuiet semi-metallics, and they're flat amazing. They're quiet (squeaked once during initial break-in) and dust moderately (black, but wipes off easily), have good hot and cold bite and a relatively constant coefficient of friction. They do require conditioning; the maker "scorches" them, but I got a lot of smoke during the first few hard stops; however, the bite was good out of the box. They may not stand up to full-on track use, but there was no detectable fade after six back-to-back 65-5 mph stops. Best of all, they're inexpensive - not much more than OEM-replacement organic pads. I'm happy with them to say the least.
ronemus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2009, 11:02 PM   #8
[27]
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 9731
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Parkin Harder than Jewpac can.
Vehicle:
2k2 wrx '13 Audi S4
Midnight Gray

Default

awesome dictation
[27] is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-11-2009, 02:35 PM   #9
J Ritt
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 3738
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Charlotte, NC
Vehicle:
2003 Corvette Z06
Yellow

Default

Thanks for the positive feedback guys...glad you're enjoying it!
J Ritt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-11-2009, 04:55 PM   #10
SUBIESKI
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 203783
Join Date: Feb 2009
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Vehicle:
2005 Forester X
RIP 04 WRX Wagon

Default

Sweet Write up!!
SUBIESKI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2009, 12:00 AM   #11
Joynt93
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 173738
Join Date: Mar 2008
Chapter/Region: VIC
Location: The Ballpark
Vehicle:
STG2 93' Legacy SS
Can't thouch This

Default

Thanks, i am now more educated.

Quick Question... as a spirited non track driver, i recently, as in tonite upgraded my 93 leg turbo to 04 wrx stock fronts with 04 wrx stoptech slotted rears with hawk hps pads.
i'm thinking of new pads all around. do hawk pads have good cold bite, hp or hps?

i'd hate to hit the brakes hard on the highway on some semi metallic pads with no cold bite.

I'm also wanting a bit more rear bias, maybe i want different pads front and rear?

Thanks, much appreciated.
Joynt93 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2009, 01:46 AM   #12
chimchimm5
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 88501
Join Date: Jun 2005
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: NorCal
Vehicle:
2006 WRX Wagon
CGM

Default

Nice article... we really need the next step though... categorizing the pads available on the market with the categories listed in the article. Otherwise, we just have to decifer the brake pad manufacturer's marketing.
chimchimm5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2009, 09:29 AM   #13
J Ritt
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 3738
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Charlotte, NC
Vehicle:
2003 Corvette Z06
Yellow

Default

Joynt93,

HP+ on the front of your car will give you substantially more bite than HPS. That said, you'll also have a lot more noise and dust with the HP+. If you're looking at these two compounds, you need to decide which of these traits are more important to you. Do you want less noise, less dust, and less bite...or do you want more noise, more dust, and more bite. That's the situation with those two pads.

As for front and rear bias, why do you want more rear bias if you're only driving on the street? Usually you would only want more rear bias if you were trail braking into corners and trying to get the car to rotate.

If you really do like the feel of more rear brake, I'd suggest going with the same pad compound front and rear (in this case, HP+ both front and rear). If you like a slightly more stable feel under braking, go with a more aggressive compound in the front (HP+), and a slightly less aggressive compound in the rear (HPS).

You definitely do not want too much bias shifted to the rear, which puts the car in an unstable situation...which means that the rear end can swap ends with the front (spin). The back end will dance all over the place under heavy braking. On your car you could get away with HPS front/HP+ rear without any major issues (car will still be front biased overall under braking due to drivetrain/engine layout/brake rotor diameters & piston sizes), but for what you're doing, I don't think that's the setup you'll enjoy.

Stick with the same compound front and rear, or slightly less bite in the back and you'll be happier I think.
J Ritt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-17-2009, 10:49 AM   #14
FightingFalcon
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 223299
Join Date: Sep 2009
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: NoVA/DC/NCR
Vehicle:
2009 WRX WRB 4dr
2007 Kawasaki ZX6R

Default

Just wanted to say thank you for the excellent write up.

Very educational...definitely saved me some pain/$$$ in the future.

edit: Let us know when the brake rotor section is completed as well
FightingFalcon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2009, 09:53 AM   #15
n6621u
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 141742
Join Date: Feb 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond VA
Vehicle:
2003 wrx wagon
silver

Default

Great article and perfect timing. Just had my first track event and my brake pads (or lack thereof) were a hot topic. Thanks!
n6621u is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2009, 10:35 AM   #16
ed10
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 198026
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Asheville/Fletcher, NC
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza WRX
Nulla Tenaci Invia EstVia

Default

That article is perfect!!!! Except now I have to weigh in my options and decide what to get....Apparently I fall under the DD & Aggressive Street Driver (probably like most wrx owners) So I should choose sintered or semi-metallic, but they both wear the rotors faster, and sti rotors aren't necessarily cheap

Last edited by ed10; 09-30-2009 at 10:41 AM.
ed10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2009, 04:59 PM   #17
Ducatikid
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 225864
Join Date: Oct 2009
Default

this is a good write up
Ducatikid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2009, 03:59 PM   #18
Scooby921
Thanks Sir Alex!
Moderator
 
Member#: 88606
Join Date: Jun 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Clarkston
Vehicle:
2011 GMC Sierra
'13 JCW

Default

Its been brought to my attention that the link isn't currently working. I'll see what I can do to contact J Ritt and get the link fixed or the article copy and pasted into here.
Scooby921 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2009, 04:35 PM   #19
J Ritt
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 3738
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Charlotte, NC
Vehicle:
2003 Corvette Z06
Yellow

Default

Hi Guys,
We migrated to a new server. I apologize for the inconvenience for those who have tried to view the old link! The article has a new home here:

http://www.essexparts.com/learning-c...ose-brake-pads

Also, I'll be putting out some cool new video content in the next week or two. I think you guys are really going to enjoy it.
J Ritt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-2009, 09:48 AM   #20
joker75
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 168516
Join Date: Jan 2008
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: SLC, UT
Vehicle:
2008 Imprexa 2.5i
Spark silver

Default

Thanks J Ritt. That is a large amount of very helpful information. I hope some day I will actually get to use some of it. As of right now I am sitting on stock everything, but enjoy throwing my car around canyon and other deserted curvy roads. I haven't ever pushed my brakes to the point that I have felt any type of brake fade, but maybe someday I'll sprout big enough balls to push her to a point that I will need better brakes.

Yes, when I get to that point I will make sure that I do it in a controlled environment ie. track day, driving classes.

Hal
joker75 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 06:53 PM   #21
mcdrumrboy
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 105792
Join Date: Jan 2006
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Vehicle:
2006 WRX sti
crystal grey

Default

Awesome article! It gave me a better perspective on what to look for in brakes based on the type of driving I do.
mcdrumrboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-22-2010, 10:53 PM   #22
subie 2.5 STI
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 175933
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Orange County, Ca.
Vehicle:
2008 WRX STI
blue

Default

def awesome article
subie 2.5 STI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2010, 07:02 PM   #23
animator659
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 181376
Join Date: Jun 2008
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: In the mountains, CA
Vehicle:
2008 STI
DGM

Default

Thanks a lot defiantly helpful article.
animator659 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2010, 12:33 PM   #24
ericsson
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 208672
Join Date: Apr 2009
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Houston, TX
Vehicle:
2013 WRX STI Limited
Obsidian Black

Default

It sured helped me! After reading some info, I've decided to try changing my brake pads to ceramic to help the noise issue in my STI. Thanks!
ericsson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2010, 11:29 PM   #25
SubaruWrxNewb
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 236017
Join Date: Jan 2010
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Thomasville, NC
Vehicle:
2004 AW STi
2.5 w/ GTX35R, 500+ whp

Default

Great post! Getting ready to change the brakes on my car for the first time and now I know what I am looking for! Thanks!
SubaruWrxNewb is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
DIY - How to replace Stock STI Brembo brake pads CLR4ILS Brakes, Steering & Suspension 16 06-25-2012 04:38 PM
Article: How To Clean your Exhaust Tips blue-sun Mid West Subaru Owners Club Forum -- MWSOC 20 05-15-2012 02:04 PM
Endless Brake parts for Street and Track dentsport NESIC Vendor Classifieds 4 04-11-2009 12:52 PM
Brake pads for lazy butts who street and track chimchimm5 Brakes, Steering & Suspension 50 12-21-2008 03:51 AM
FS: Carbotech Panther Plus - street/track brake pads - BRAND NEW eclip5e NESIC Private Classifieds 10 04-18-2006 09:54 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:12 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.