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Old 09-30-2009, 12:48 PM   #1
Chiketkd
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Default October Fastrack

Solo/SEB Minutes: http://www.scca.org/documents/Fastra...k-oct-solo.pdf

Nothing ground-breaking this month...
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Old 09-30-2009, 03:23 PM   #2
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The biggest news is that STR is a go for 2010!
Quote:
Based on positive member feedback, the updated STR rules published in the August Fastrack are considered final, and are effective 1/1/2010
Looks like "piggybacks" are out for member feedback in ST:
Quote:
The STAC would like feedback on opening up 14.10.F to allow ECU “piggybacks” that directly control or modify engine functions such as fuel injectors and ignition timing (ignitor, coil, etc). Current allowances restrict piggybacks to acting only as “signal modifiers” on the ECU inputs. Direct control would be restricted to fuel, ignition, and VTEC switchover points. Sensors must be OE. Emissions legality as defined in Appendix F and 14.10 would still need to be maintained, which means that OBDII systems must be intact and operating as the manufacturer intended. NOTE: The goal with this proposal is to allow an alternative, cost-effective method of performing the same functions allowed by current rules. This is not final rules language. This proposal would be effective 1/2011.
Another anti-awd fanboi shot down?
Quote:
The STAC believes that the Street Touring classes have accounted for AWD versus 2WD differences by properly classing cars and using restrictions such as tire sizes. Currently there are no issues which would suggest a change. (ref. 09-413)
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Old 09-30-2009, 03:45 PM   #3
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What would qualify as a "piggyback" that directly controls injectors/coils/etc? MS? That will free up a fair amount of power on cars w/o good ECU support (old 2.5RS for example).

Quote:
The following previously-published (October ’08) class change proposal has been recommended by the SPAC and is published
here for further comment: Move from DSP to FSP, Saturn 16V models as follows (ref. 09-532):
Saturn
S-series(’91-’95)
S-series (’96-’02)
Why they listed those on 2 different lines is beyond me.
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Old 09-30-2009, 04:42 PM   #4
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Quote:
Street Touring: Per the STAC, OE bumper covers may be modified as part of the “Body Kit” allowance (14.2.F), including cutting
holes for the passage of air. NOTE: The STAC is looking to rework or remove 14.2.F for 2011, since its original “Sport Compact” cosmetic intent is no longer relevant and it is being primarily used instead for performance benefit.
Thanks Cy (sarcastic) , now I can't get the C West Shogun style front bumper. I could have gotten made performance benefits from it... JK.

Seriously though, as is, the "passage of air" language is confusing, especially as it could apply to intake air.
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Old 09-30-2009, 07:37 PM   #5
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Now that STR is an official provisional class, it'll be interesting to see what PAX number Rick Ruth comes up with for it in a couple of weeks...

It'll also be cool to see this class run locally!
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Old 09-30-2009, 07:58 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProDarwin View Post
What would qualify as a "piggyback" that directly controls injectors/coils/etc? MS?
The UTEC, I think. I believe the reason it was illegal in the past was that it directly controlled timing (...?).
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Old 09-30-2009, 10:16 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ButtDyno View Post
The UTEC, I think. I believe the reason it was illegal in the past was that it directly controlled timing (...?).
it directly controlled boost, bypassing the functionality of the ECU. Timing and fuel changes are legal.
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Old 09-30-2009, 10:17 PM   #8
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Ah, right. I remember people discussing modifying it (cutting/disconnecting wires) in order to make it legal, except that it still wasn't legal then.
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Old 10-01-2009, 09:39 AM   #9
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Quote:
The Solo Safety Committee meeting minutes appear elsewhere in this issue of Fastrack.
Anyone find this anywhere?
-N
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Old 10-01-2009, 09:53 AM   #10
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Don't forget about the Emanage Ultimate, which directly controls the injectors. I would have used this on the Spec V when I had it so that I could bump up the redline and adjust timing to gain extra benefits. But as the rules were, I could only use and SAFC for A/F only. I'm okay with this change, allows cars without much support to actually utilize the ruleset for cheap.

As for the AWD/2WD deal, I would like to see them allow STX to use 9" wide wheels, but keep the tire rules at 245mm. I think that would be fair now that the WRX has been slayed.
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Old 10-01-2009, 10:15 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by piknockout View Post
I think that would be fair now that the WRX has been slayed.
This unamuses me.
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Old 10-01-2009, 10:34 AM   #12
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Don't they usually post the Protests & Appeals in the month following Nationals? Have we still not heard about the results? I really want to know how I did in D-Stock
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Old 10-01-2009, 11:00 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by piknockout View Post
As for the AWD/2WD deal, I would like to see them allow STX to use 9" wide wheels, but keep the tire rules at 245mm. I think that would be fair now that the WRX has been slayed.
Obviously I'm on the 2wd Wankel side of this argument, but I disagree...respectfully.

Not to take anything away from Bauer or Coleman, but if Fenter/McCance/Brooks was still in a STX WRX this year, I'm pretty sure we would have seen one at the top. If anything, awd cars should petition a wheel width increase to 8.5" to better utilize the 245 sized tire they've been given. 9" is just not going to happen.

FWIW, if I owned a 2.0L WRX (as opposed to the RX-8), I'd still build it for the class. I think the WRX, BMWs and RX-8's all have a very fair shot at winning the class as it currently sits.
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Originally Posted by mccanixx View Post
This unamuses me.
+12345
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Old 10-01-2009, 11:26 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by piknockout View Post
Don't forget about the Emanage Ultimate, which directly controls the injectors. I would have used this on the Spec V when I had it so that I could bump up the redline and adjust timing to gain extra benefits. But as the rules were, I could only use and SAFC for A/F only. I'm okay with this change, allows cars without much support to actually utilize the ruleset for cheap.
Would the Megasquirt qualify? Not sure how they are calling any of this "piggyback" other than OBD2 systems need to remain intact.
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Old 10-01-2009, 12:30 PM   #15
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Yeah, what happens when it rains? If the AWD cars are only tenths back in the dry (if that), then I'd rather have that security when it does get wet. And for ProSolos. IMO.
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Old 10-01-2009, 01:07 PM   #16
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Sorry, I guess "slayed" was too aggressive of a word.


But you have to admit, the RX-8 or BMW look to be better "cars to have" in Lincoln. As long as it's dry of course.
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Old 10-01-2009, 01:43 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by piknockout View Post
But you have to admit, the RX-8 or BMW look to be better "cars to have" in Lincoln. As long as it's dry of course.
I personally don't see it that way. I think Meredith and Isley drove better in Lincoln than Coleman and Bauer. Weather definitely would play a major factor, but I don't see the WRXs out of the equation even in the dry.

Imho, b/c WRXs don't have the fancy diffs of the STi's & Evos in STU, you have to set them up to be loose and know how to drive them sideways. That's what McCance is really good at doing all day long. I've personally seen Greg go into a sweeper really hot, have his back-end step out 'significantly', and use this to excute a perfect diamond line through the turn, and come haulin' out of the corner on-boost! They don't teach that kinda driving at autocross school...but that's the level car control it takes to win in an STX WRX.

My $0.02... (I've been know to be wrong more times than I'm right. )
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Old 10-01-2009, 03:41 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by piknockout View Post
As for the AWD/2WD deal, I would like to see them allow STX to use 9" wide wheels, but keep the tire rules at 245mm.
I would also agree with this. You gave me the tire, now give me the wheel to use it.
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Old 10-01-2009, 05:39 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiketkd View Post
I personally don't see it that way. I think Meredith and Isley drove better in Lincoln than Coleman and Bauer. Weather definitely would play a major factor, but I don't see the WRXs out of the equation even in the dry.

Imho, b/c WRXs don't have the fancy diffs of the STi's & Evos in STU, you have to set them up to be loose and know how to drive them sideways. That's what McCance is really good at doing all day long. I've personally seen Greg go into a sweeper really hot, have his back-end step out 'significantly', and use this to excute a perfect diamond line through the turn, and come haulin' out of the corner on-boost! They don't teach that kinda driving at autocross school...but that's the level car control it takes to win in an STX WRX.

My $0.02... (I've been know to be wrong more times than I'm right. )
You'll have to get some seat time in a well setup STX WRX. I'll bet you'll be faster in a the RX8. A few people I know have had similar experiences when jumping from their STX WRX to a STX RX8. Until you've had decent seat time in either cars, it's difficult to form an opinion.

Not saying you are wrong, just some food for thought.

Rob
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Old 10-01-2009, 06:05 PM   #20
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Quote:
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You'll have to get some seat time in a well setup STX WRX. I'll bet you'll be faster in a the RX8. A few people I know have had similar experiences when jumping from their STX WRX to a STX RX8. Until you've had decent seat time in either cars, it's difficult to form an opinion.

Not saying you are wrong, just some food for thought.

Rob
Where did you/they find a well set up one to compare with? So far they seem pretty rare.

STX as a whole was slow, right now a Honda looks like the best car.

And wait till the BMW's get developed. Your 2009 STX champ was on stock brakes, and had a stock header.
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Old 10-01-2009, 06:19 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by piknockout View Post

As for the AWD/2WD deal, I would like to see them allow STX to use 9" wide wheels, but keep the tire rules at 245mm. I think that would be fair now that the WRX has been slayed.
I don't see a problem with that. You are talking about a minimal change. The only downside being the cost of new wheels, for such a small gain.
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Old 10-01-2009, 06:49 PM   #22
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didn't see the Safety stuff either and the Safety Belt is still from August. More than likely its a reiteration of keeeping people out of trailers when in motion and possible looking at "racetracks" used as autoX sites.

Did FT actually say that SS brakeline are a no-go in *SP?
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Old 10-01-2009, 07:38 PM   #23
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Where did you/they find a well set up one to compare with? So far they seem pretty rare.
Coleman and Bauer spent a day switching between the WRX and George Hudetz's RX8. 16 runs each, so lots of time to be familiar with the course. Enough runs in the RX8 to be comfortable.
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Old 10-01-2009, 07:47 PM   #24
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Coleman and Bauer spent a day switching between the WRX and George Hudetz's RX8. 16 runs each, so lots of time to be familiar with the course. Enough runs in the RX8 to be comfortable.
Right. I asked where they found a well set up RX-8, not a BSTX car. Coleman was so convinced the RX-8 was going to kill the class he was over before he got started. Meanwhile he ignored the car that has always been there - you know, the one with TQ - just waiting for a proper size tire.
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Old 10-01-2009, 08:29 PM   #25
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I seem to remember BMW's winning STX a few years ago... concrete, something, something...
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