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Old 05-08-2002, 10:20 PM   #1
XDariusX
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Default Harness Questions

Greetings all,

I am looking to install a harness on the drivers seat. I am new to the motorsports world and would like some suggestions on brands/models that work well with the WRX? Are snap on harnesses safe? Should i spend the extra dough for camlock? Can i fit a harness to the existing bolts or do i have to modify something to attach it?

This car is my daily driver, but the harness will only be used on raceday. Any help would be great.
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Old 05-08-2002, 11:15 PM   #2
Drexel
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Default harness

Most important would be comply with your track and/or racing org's rules..

That said, i use the Schroth Rally 4 with the clip. I run the track once a week and its been great. Definitely get the shoulder pads too, i paid for that mistake!

Drexel

www.midamericamotorplex.com
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Old 05-09-2002, 08:27 AM   #3
Snowphun
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I've had M&R harnesses in my 944 for many years, and have been very happy with them. Cam lock is well worth the extra $30 or so, I can put mine on in seconds as oppsoed to the passenger setup which I didn't buy a cam for. This is a six point belt, which is nice as the lower two belts can mount to the existing lower seat belt points.

But as Drexel said, make sure you're in compliance with your local groups. I imagine you'll need a harness bar in a WRX just like most cars?

Paul
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Old 05-09-2002, 12:02 PM   #4
Drexel
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Mine mount to lower rear seat belt anchors, i know its not the best. They sit at about 45deg, which is the most you should have from my reading. Made for an very easy install, about 1hr.
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Old 05-10-2002, 07:35 PM   #5
Brett555
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XDariusX:

Just an FYI, I have the Rallye 4's in stock, in blue, which would look cool in your blue WRX. The Rallye 3 or 4 is probably the best belt for autocrossing, where 5 and 6 point belts are probably overkill.

Go here for more info: http://www.soloracer.com/schroth.html

If you have any questions, let me know.

PS - for street driving and high speed track events, I dont recommend using an aftermarket harness belt, unless you have rollover protection.
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Old 05-10-2002, 11:03 PM   #6
Dussander
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A Tech in my local AutoX tech inspection said I needed longer then stock bolts to attach my harness into because the bolts need to be at the same depth for safety reasons. Anyone have anything to say about that. Where would I find bolts that were just slightly longer then normal.
High speed track? What is considered high speed? I consider the psuedo roll bar in the WRX pretty good for <100mph tracks. Any thoughts?
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Old 05-10-2002, 11:41 PM   #7
Snowphun
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Many kits come with hardware that will be longer than stock. Mine for example had eyelets for the fast clips, so only the stock belts need to be held on by the bolts.

As Brett said, harnesses are not a good idea without either a roll bar or cage. The idea being that the harness will keep you in an upright position, and in the event of a rollover you will not be able to slump forward and can get your spine compressed when your head is pushed against the roof. A cage keeps the roof from collapsing in.

Paul
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Old 05-11-2002, 06:19 AM   #8
Brett555
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Personally, I only use a harness for autocrossing. Without rollover protection, I wont use them on the track or street. I did a ton of track time in my Type R, but just used my factory belts. Thinking back on that, I should have really got a rollbar/harness setup...and in my next car, I will definitely look into a rollbar before doing any serious track time. Ever see the pics of that flattened Mustang?

At any rate, autocrossing is different. The likelihood of a rollover is very small, and if it were to happen, the roof is probably not going to collapse since the speeds are slow. I have heard of rollovers in autocross, but its usually certain cars (VW's, etc). A guy in our local club rolled his VW at Nationals a few years ago. He was fine, and as a matter of fact, he had a Schroth Rallye 4 on and he said it helped alot.

I recommend the Schroth Rallye harnesses for autocross, and they are definitely the most popular. I've tried/sold alot of the others (Sabelt Clubman, etc) and nothing really compares to the Schroth. It costs more, but you get what you pay for ;-)
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Old 05-11-2002, 08:20 PM   #9
jamz
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They are coming out with nice roll bars too, so for the $500 or so you would pay for a harness and harnessbar, you can have actual rollover protection that you can mount a harness on.
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Old 05-12-2002, 04:44 PM   #10
WRSport
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Track time is one thing.

Street is another.

Roll bar/cage in a street car when not wearing a helmet is more dangerous than any protection you think it gives you.
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Old 05-12-2002, 05:18 PM   #11
Thug
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Quote:
Originally posted by WRSport
Track time is one thing.

Street is another.

Roll bar/cage in a street car when not wearing a helmet is more dangerous than any protection you think it gives you.

If you put sufficient roll bar padding on the cage it wont be a problem.
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Old 05-12-2002, 06:16 PM   #12
WRSport
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That roll bar padding makes a roll bar safe enough?

I was under the impression that severe head injuries can and have still resulted in even padded roll bars.

I really want a cage for the track but have been scared off given information I've read here and elsewhere.

My brother's track Jetta has a full cage, expensive padding etc and I just don't see how my head without a helmet is safe.

I honestly hope my info is dated. I would really appreciate other views on this topic.

Cheers,

Chris

Last edited by WRSport; 05-12-2002 at 08:03 PM.
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Old 05-12-2002, 08:39 PM   #13
Snowphun
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Chris, AFAIK you're spot on with your info. Best bet in that situation is to consider a harness bar. Cheaper too.

Keep in mind that all cars are different, so roll bars are not an issue in some. Such is the case in a 944 for example; a roll bar or harness bar ends behind the B pillar, way out of reach.

Paul
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Old 05-12-2002, 08:52 PM   #14
WRSport
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For Track use.

But am I any safer with a Harness and Harness Bar vs stock belts? It seems without a cage I'm not doing my spine any favors as you posted above with a Harness(no cage).

ARGH, maybe I just just buy a 944 and keep that on the track only. I'm trying to do too much with one car. There just is no safe way to compromise between track duty and driving to work.

The more I look into this it seems, its either keep stock belts, or take additional risks unless theres a helmet on your head.
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Old 05-12-2002, 11:26 PM   #15
Dussander
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I'm pretty sure a roll bar would be behind my head (I'm short) in my WRX if it follows the same path as the stock bar. If it's behind my head I can't figure out how it's going to be dangerous. If I can hit the bar I can hit the roof anyway.
My current plan is for a roll bar in my daily driver without a helmet. Add harness for AutoX and track. That may eliminate passangers though...hum.

I have a Schroth Rallye 4 but it didn't come with longer bolts so I just used the existing hardware.
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Old 05-13-2002, 03:41 PM   #16
Gozzi
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There's some good advice in this thread but a few seriously missing things:
1. Most drivers education events INSIST that you have equal safety protection for driver and passenger. Consider an instructor climbing in with a little 3-point while you're buckled into a full 6-point system!

2. Clearly 5- or 6- point harnesses are safety equipment but you will quickly notice the fact that they hold you in place allows you to drive with a better touch of the wheel. You aren't hanging on to the wheel through the turns, you're held in place by the belts. Even with stock seats the harnesses will be way superior on the track. On the street the harnesses look a little pretensious.

3. Be careful to check between pull-ups and pull-downs. If you have a team ready to send you out onto the track you may want the pull downs; otherwise go with the pull-ups.

4. You can have both factory 3-points and a 5-point harness system in the same car.

5. The belts that come over your shoulders need to have a metal anchor or pivot at shoulder height behind you. this could be a harness bar or an anchor to the rear deck or anchor to a roll bar or through a racing designed seat. This prevents compression fractures of the spine if you are in an accident.
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