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Old 10-29-2009, 03:52 PM   #1
dieselstation
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Default WRC Rally Car vs. Street Prepped... who would win?

There is an argument on another forum I visit. I say a track/tarmac prepped street car like this one (non professional normal car enthusiast tuner with lots of money):



would definitely give the real WRC car (professional and backed by lots of factory money and expertise) a run for it's money. I contend that it will in fact hand the WRC car it's ass.


Keep in mind that this is a TARMAC Road Course race. Also note that WRC cars are limited to 300hp per their rules and regulations, and that the track prepped cars are given $20K for engine work. 450hp is easily conceivable.

The WRC car must be prepped for standard rally duty, therefore tires and suspension setup for dirt and jumps.

Also.. the WRC car may have a professional driver, while the street car can have a typical roadrace/trackday driver.

So.. what say you? WRC car win? or street car? Even given all the sophisticated WRC car's suspension, transmission, etc?
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Old 10-29-2009, 07:42 PM   #2
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Keep in mind, a tarmac rally car is completely different than a gravel car. I think the street car would win against a gravel car on a tarmac track. But if it was a tarmac car versus a street car it would swing the other way. There is actually an event in the UK every year where a bunch of street cars get to race a WRC car on a tarmac track and they get owned by the WRC car every year.
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Old 10-29-2009, 08:00 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dieselstation View Post
T

Keep in mind that this is a TARMAC Road Course race. Also note that WRC cars are limited to 300hp per their rules and regulations, and that the track prepped cars are given $20K for engine work. 450hp is easily conceivable.

The WRC car must be prepped for standard rally duty, therefore tires and suspension setup for dirt and jumps.

Also.. the WRC car may have a professional driver, while the street car can have a typical roadrace/trackday driver.

So.. what say you? WRC car win? or street car? Even given all the sophisticated WRC car's suspension, transmission, etc?
That's a stupid argument. In Europe tarmac rallies are just as common as gravel rallies, including many WRC events. For tarmac rallies the cars would be set up with a tarmac suspension and tires. Therefore the only difference would be the limits on the HP and the driver ability. Even so, assuming the driver abilities are the same, and the suspensions and tires are the same, the 'street car' would win given the 150hp advantage. Then if you're forcing the WRC car to drive on gravel tires it won't be able to go much over 80mph on tarmac and with a gravel suspension it will be almost uncontrollable in high speed corners.

Maybe you should ask - Which would win: an F1 car or a Jeep YJ on an off-road track?

Last edited by Howl; 10-29-2009 at 09:50 PM.
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Old 10-29-2009, 08:06 PM   #4
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Default I'll take both!!

Doesn't really matter which one would win,I would kill for either of those Imps.
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Old 11-02-2009, 05:00 PM   #5
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Doesn't really matter which one would win,I would kill for either of those Imps.
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Old 11-03-2009, 04:46 PM   #6
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My 1.8 would whip yall fools in reverse!


Goose....
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Old 11-03-2009, 04:48 PM   #7
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WRC car have limitations (restrictors) given to them by the WRC. You could build a faster car.
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Old 11-03-2009, 07:40 PM   #8
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Old 11-04-2009, 06:19 PM   #9
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Street prepped = lack of a navigator = less weight.

Yup, street prepped it is.
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Old 11-06-2009, 10:42 AM   #10
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Hmm silly silly. WRC car does not HAVE to be gravel prepped.

For what it's worth, I saw an article that raced a 996 911 Turbo round a race track vs. a GRAVEL prepped Hyundai WRC car. The WRC won. If the WRC had have been in tarmac prep, it would have been a seriously crushing defeat.

Tarmac prep adds large wheels, low profile race spec tires, MUCH larger brakes etc etc etc.

I'm reasonably sure that of those two pictures you took, the street car would win. However, not only is that WRC in gravel spec, it is also in the spec for one of the desert rallies, hence snorkel, cattle catcher, MASSIVE ride height and quite a lot of beefing up.


Your buddy would, in fact, be racing against something like this. And the above it with the ride height for a pretty rough road course. They could lower and harder it further for a smooth track. The navigator problem is easily solved. He just doesn't get in

Thats before you decide to simply take off the FIA mandated air restrictor and see your HP piss all over any non drag race street prep car.

Last edited by Saj5DJ; 11-06-2009 at 10:49 AM.
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Old 11-12-2009, 09:30 PM   #11
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With more sophisticated parts/tuning techniques, the rally teams are actually squeezing more like 360hp out of their engines with the FIA restrictor plates (though they can't really advertise that fact). The plates just restrict how much air can flow through, and were calculated to restrict to 300hp given the engine capabilities at the time the rules were made. With some ingenuity they've managed to defeat that.

Add to that the way rally cars are tuned, with the ability to provide the 300+ hp and gobs of torque over most of the powerband. Then there's also anti-lag, a feature not common on street prepped cars, and it's a pretty mean beast.

I say even on a road course, a non-professional street prepped car with 150hp more would still have a pretty hard time winning.
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Old 11-12-2009, 11:56 PM   #12
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WRC car no problem.

Last edited by DC16A2; 11-13-2009 at 12:09 AM.
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Old 11-22-2009, 10:50 PM   #13
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I peronally think the WRC prepped. But... I'd take either!
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Old 12-16-2009, 07:25 PM   #14
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a professional rally pilot can won the tuned car whit a stock one....
a professional driver with a WRC car can beat the tuned car driving on reverse gear...LOL

remember than a official Prodrive WRC cost over 500'000£=over 815'000$...and we have a reason for that
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Old 12-17-2009, 02:12 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScoobKing View Post
My 1.8 would whip yall fools in reverse!


Goose....
see their we go again ^ = chump!
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Old 12-25-2009, 04:32 AM   #16
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Depends on if they use the 34mm restrictive plate or not, and even with it on your chances are slim.
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Old 12-28-2009, 02:29 PM   #17
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we might have forgotten that a wrc car doesnt have a restriction on tq. and thats up to about 470ft. lbs. and the gearing is way different. they top out at about 120mph depending on the course. a gravel wrc car does 0-60 in the dirt in about 2.5 seconds because of this, so you can imagine what the tarmac spec does.
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Old 12-28-2009, 08:00 PM   #18
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wrc car with professional driver wins by a mile.
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Old 12-28-2009, 08:04 PM   #19
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I'd take the WRC driver over the street driver.
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Old 01-01-2010, 05:00 AM   #20
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the street car doesnt even have the right tires or suspention setup to be riding.

Last edited by crash60068; 01-15-2010 at 10:51 PM.
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Old 01-15-2010, 09:27 PM   #21
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^ WTF did you just say?

BTD.
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Old 01-17-2010, 12:44 AM   #22
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While both are purpose built cars. The first car is a time attack car with no restrictions. The second shown is, I believe a '97 STi, which is set up for the Kenya ralley. Neither of these would do well on a road course. Both would require suspension changes. Both would require tire changes. Take a course like Nürburgring, both would have their strengths on a course like that. The only edge would be the extra HP of the time attack car. Driver of each would be well skilled. So, that too would be a wash.

The edge would go to the T/A car.

The video shows the prepped car versus a stock off the shelf STi. Not a fair race if they gave him a handicap.
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Old 01-18-2010, 03:15 AM   #23
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Love the rally but I don't know.
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Old 02-07-2010, 12:27 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dieselstation View Post
There is an argument on another forum I visit. I say a track/tarmac prepped street car like this one (non professional normal car enthusiast tuner with lots of money):



would definitely give the real WRC car (professional and backed by lots of factory money and expertise) a run for it's money. I contend that it will in fact hand the WRC car it's ass.


Keep in mind that this is a TARMAC Road Course race. Also note that WRC cars are limited to 300hp per their rules and regulations, and that the track prepped cars are given $20K for engine work. 450hp is easily conceivable.

The WRC car must be prepped for standard rally duty, therefore tires and suspension setup for dirt and jumps.

Also.. the WRC car may have a professional driver, while the street car can have a typical roadrace/trackday driver.

So.. what say you? WRC car win? or street car? Even given all the sophisticated WRC car's suspension, transmission, etc?
The WRC car will win hands down. A modded street car against a purpose built rally car is not a fair fight.

You say set up for rally duty , do you know that they also rally on asphalt , snow and not just dirt?

How about a fair fight?
How about the WRC car be setup for track racing and then the track Subaru be set up for rallying and let us see who will win?

Reason why the WRC car will win is because of the endless possible setups weather it be gearing , damper or anti roll bar setup. Now if you were talking about the oder WRC cars from like 98 -2000 you may stand a chance , but from then the cars were making upwards of 350 hp and over 550 ft/lbs of torque. God help you if you get anything from 2005 and on as the power hiked to about 360 with 700 ft/lbs of torque and they had a wider track along with the active diffs.
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Old 02-28-2010, 11:10 PM   #25
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Ok logic, I have a couple questions:

1) what grants a car 350whp/700wtq. The tq number is outrageous. Especially with a restrictor. Can you note the philosophy being implemented? Is antilag that much of a power maker? I thought it was just for response on the lowend, and didnt necessarily yeild more power.

2) I can has?
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