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Old 11-14-2009, 08:33 PM   #1
rexblake
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Default ej207 sb, ej205 cam'd heads, hta68: 342hp 300tq

Event: dyno pull
Location: DB Performance, Rogers MN
Ambient Temp: 50
Elevation: 1000?
Weather: cloudy
Tires: Direzza Sport Z1 Star Spec, 215/45-17

Car: 2002 WRX
Tuner: Shane
Dyno Info: Dyno Dynamics
Peak HP at RPM: uncorrected, 245 at 6250
Peak Torque at RPM: uncorrected, 209 at 5540
Baseline hp/tq for a stock on same dyno: 2.0 WRX=150, STI=200
Target Boost: 19 psi
Target AFR: 11:1
Fuel: 91 octane piss
Engine/Power Modifications:
ej207 short block:
JE pistons
Eagle Rods
crank drilled
balanced
nitride coated crank

ej205 heads with BC:
Valves +1mm over
Springs
Retainers
272 Cams

Perrin Big maf, MRT intercooler, grimmspeed everything, tial 38mm ewg, invidia dp, custom magnaflow cat back, zeitronix map, samco turbo inlet, DW 750's, walbro 255, APS 50/50 bov, ATI damper

Driveline Modifications: RA gear set, ACT streetlite flywheel, ACT 6 puck, hd pressure plate
Suspension Modifications: n spec engine bushings, tein coilovers,
Other Modifications: full weight




Compared to 16g stock engine and heads:





Clearly, the numbers suck. This is an issue of gas, we experienced knock issues like you wouldn't believe. Also, my topmount was having some massive heat soak issues, it was almost to hot to the touch AFTER we let it sit for 20 min and sprayed water over it.

I will be going back in a couple weeks, changing some things:

APS fmic
Borla hush catback, no more cat for me and no more crimp bends
1000cc DW
rails, APS if I can find them or Perrin
E85 to deal with the knock issue's
More boooost! (and a lot more timing)

I posted this to show a couple things, one, spool isn't all that bad on a 2.0 with supporting mods imho (before you say anything, check it against the small 16g). Having a full 3in exhaust without a cat should help quite a bit with spool as well. Two, it holds boost with no issues, 19.5 to 8k. We shall see what it can do on E85 and 25psi or so.

Edit: E85 Tune



I found a boost leak after the run. My fault, I forgot to check all my boost lines after the intercooler install. That's why it's spooling a little late. Also, I'm blowing out spark at high rpm. Will be changing the gap shortly. I still think this turbo will hit 350 whp when everything is working correctly.

Edit 1/10/09: Latest e85 balls to the wall. Added Apexi AVCR, the Cobb software wouldn't let us push more boost. Now hitting 29psi, 342hp, 300ft/lbs tq. The bad, it still drops off after 6600 rpms. Not sure why, restriction somewhere? Plugs are regapped to .025.


Car: 2002 WRX
Tuner: Shane
Dyno Info: Dyno Dynamics
Peak HP at RPM: uncorrected, 342
Peak Torque at RPM: uncorrected, 300
Baseline hp/tq for a stock on same dyno: 2.0 WRX=150, STI=200
Target Boost: 29 psi
Target AFR: 11.5:1
Fuel: E85 Winter mix



UPDATE: FOUND SHOOTOUT MODE DYNO

Roughly equivalent to dynojet. Still not a full 1.2 correction factor.

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Last edited by rexblake; 05-15-2011 at 01:31 AM.
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Old 11-14-2009, 09:05 PM   #2
TDagen
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Db performance dyno reads low low fyi....You will get it all figured out seems to be spooling quick for staying 2.0.... How do you like the star spec tires, I got em to they are very very nice, lose traction significantly in the cold though... You will get it all figured out, 2.0 is sweet btw...E85 ftw ....
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Old 11-14-2009, 09:21 PM   #3
Nuke209
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I am not impressed.
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Old 11-14-2009, 09:26 PM   #4
BUILTSTI
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Dood you need to find a new tuner.

I can't believe they let you leave with that first dyno sheet...

Scary........
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Old 11-14-2009, 09:28 PM   #5
TDagen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BUILTSTI View Post
Dood you need to find a new tuner.

I can't believe they let you leave with that first dyno sheet...

Scary........
Nuke you should tune it ! I don't think Db performance really specializes in subaru tuning I think they are more dsm based iirc...
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Old 11-14-2009, 09:35 PM   #6
Nuke209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TDagen View Post
Nuke you should tune it ! I don't think Db performance really specializes in subaru tuning I think they are more dsm based iirc...
That's up to Blake whether he wants to continue to go through DB or find a new shop/tuner.

I know for sure that it's not
16g > hta68
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Old 11-14-2009, 10:13 PM   #7
rexblake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuke209 View Post
I am not impressed.
I'm not impressed either, but I don't think it's a tuner issue, it was a knock issue. Everything Shane tried it just kept knocking. We will see how the E85 tune turns out. Does anyone else tune with the AP in MN?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TDagen View Post
Db performance dyno reads low low fyi....You will get it all figured out seems to be spooling quick for staying 2.0.... How do you like the star spec tires, I got em to they are very very nice, lose traction significantly in the cold though... You will get it all figured out, 2.0 is sweet btw...E85 ftw ....
It does read low, which I've known. I don't care about max numbers on the dyno, I do care that I continue to improve on the dyno from my old setups. I love the star specs, but your right, the traction when it's cold is awful! I was hoping to hold out for another week before throwing my snow tires on just because of how nice it is still, but I lose a ton of traction when it cools down at night. I am looking forward to pushing it on some E85 though... that should be fun.
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Old 11-14-2009, 10:24 PM   #8
Nuke209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rexblake View Post
I'm not impressed either, but I don't think it's a tuner issue, it was a knock issue. Everything Shane tried it just kept knocking. We will see how the E85 tune turns out. Does anyone else tune with the AP in MN?
If that helps you sleep at night, then sure.

I would suggest trying to get your pump tune sorted out first.
Don't rely on the e85 as a band aid over it.

My guys STI on 92 were pushing what you pushed (@ db) on that low reading dyno (and they've gone on different days (different weather) in the same car, and still pushed the same #)
I know your car has more left in it.
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Old 11-14-2009, 10:29 PM   #9
FuJi K
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Get the car running on pump gas well first. If it don't run right on pump, it's not gonna run right on E85. If the car has no leaks.... then it should be good for a tune. Refine the pump map first.
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Old 11-14-2009, 10:56 PM   #10
rexblake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuke209 View Post
If that helps you sleep at night, then sure.

I would suggest trying to get your pump tune sorted out first.
Don't rely on the e85 as a band aid over it.

My guys STI on 92 were pushing what you pushed (@ db) on that low reading dyno (and they've gone on different days (different weather) in the same car, and still pushed the same #)
I know your car has more left in it.
I believe it, but that's the thing, I don't want a 92 map. I travel enough that I need a 91 octane, simply because it's hard enough to find 91 in podunk towns in the middle of no where. Could I have a 91 and 92 map and switch? Yep, but if I'm going to spend the money on another tune, I might as well get e85. The car and turbo have a ton more left in it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by FuJi K View Post
Get the car running on pump gas well first. If it don't run right on pump, it's not gonna run right on E85. If the car has no leaks.... then it should be good for a tune. Refine the pump map first.
Good advise, and it will get straightened out. Larger injectors, rails, and a new fmic will demand that. I'll do another safe 91 map and a e85 map on the same day.
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Old 11-14-2009, 11:02 PM   #11
Nuke209
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I didn't say to get a 92 map.
I SUGGESTED to get your pump tune sorted out first.
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Old 11-14-2009, 11:17 PM   #12
rexblake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuke209 View Post
I didn't say to get a 92 map.
I SUGGESTED to get your pump tune sorted out first.
lol, sorry, I didn't mean come across as defensive. But your right, I need to get a pump gas tune sorted out. Hopefully the front mount with help somewhat.
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Old 11-15-2009, 12:18 AM   #13
TDagen
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Do you know of any subaru's who are tuned by shane, that are happy with there tunes? I know Juks ended up going elsewhere...
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Old 11-15-2009, 02:52 AM   #14
CKxx
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Your BOV sounds lame
93 RX7+09 Forester

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Go buy some ID1000's if you want big injectors. You'll thank me later.
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Old 11-15-2009, 08:03 PM   #15
rexblake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TDagen View Post
Do you know of any subaru's who are tuned by shane, that are happy with there tunes? I know Juks ended up going elsewhere...
Juks is the only other guy I know that got tuned there. Regardless, I like Shane as a tuner, he does very safe maps. He could have pushed my old 16g set up on e85 but he didn't, he knew bearings are an issue on the 2.0 and wanted it to be safe. Specifically detuning the tq quite a bit. Ironically, he was right, I had my oil checked by blackstone and my bearings where shot.

I'm sure there are other people that have more experience tuning Subaru's, but he seems to do more than people realize. I found out he tuned an xgames sti a couple years ago. Regardless, I can't diss Shane for providing me with a safe map on aweful gas. The car is capable of more and it will get ironed out. I'll only switch if someone can solve my cold start issue with e85, apparently cobb hasn't released stuff yet in order to provide fuel maps during cranking.
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Old 11-16-2009, 08:42 AM   #16
BUILTSTI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rexblake View Post
Juks is the only other guy I know that got tuned there. Regardless, I like Shane as a tuner, he does very safe maps. He could have pushed my old 16g set up on e85 but he didn't, he knew bearings are an issue on the 2.0 and wanted it to be safe. Specifically detuning the tq quite a bit. Ironically, he was right, I had my oil checked by blackstone and my bearings where shot.

I'm sure there are other people that have more experience tuning Subaru's, but he seems to do more than people realize. I found out he tuned an xgames sti a couple years ago. Regardless, I can't diss Shane for providing me with a safe map on aweful gas. The car is capable of more and it will get ironed out. I'll only switch if someone can solve my cold start issue with e85, apparently cobb hasn't released stuff yet in order to provide fuel maps during cranking.

Take your blinders off and get a real tuner.

Your dynosheet is a joke....

I suggest you log your car and make sure its safe to drive !

bad gas, right.....
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Old 11-16-2009, 10:25 AM   #17
STi Mikey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BUILTSTI View Post
Take your blinders off and get a real tuner.

Your dynosheet is a joke....

I suggest you log your car and make sure its safe to drive !

bad gas, right.....
Harsh....

In all reality, bang for buck, this is the best street turbo for the 2.0.

Massive numbers have been achieved and the spool is identical to vf series turbo's. I think you guys just need to sort things out. Sorting things out doesnt necessarily mean spending more money. My Spearco did an ok job with this turbo, it would heat up after a pass or twp at the track though.
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Old 11-16-2009, 05:52 PM   #18
rexblake
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Originally Posted by STi Mikey View Post
Harsh....

In all reality, bang for buck, this is the best street turbo for the 2.0.

Massive numbers have been achieved and the spool is identical to vf series turbo's. I think you guys just need to sort things out. Sorting things out doesnt necessarily mean spending more money. My Spearco did an ok job with this turbo, it would heat up after a pass or twp at the track though.
This. The issues will get worked out, plus the next run will be on a conservative 91 octane map (again) and a balls out winter mix e85 map. Then we shall see what it can do.
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Old 12-15-2009, 12:56 PM   #19
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I don't think the gas has entirely to much to do with that... I mean dude cobb made 378awhp on an EJ205 bone stock block, stock heads, stock tmic, w/ an hta 68. 248awhp is pathetic for what you have invested. Drop what your doing now and just go get tuned by ANYONE ELSE... ANYONE at all! Good luck btw tho... Car should be really fun when tuned!
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Old 12-15-2009, 12:59 PM   #20
TDagen
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If it helps I think z06 vetted put down 400whp flat on this dyno the op rode....
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Old 12-15-2009, 01:02 PM   #21
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why would you go with oversized valves? you didnt even put down 250whp

and a 6 puck clutch? you should have invested your money elsewhere
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Old 12-15-2009, 01:12 PM   #22
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HAHAHA wow i cant believe you left with this piece of **** tune. you left with less horsepower after spending allll that money. **** it, carmax that hoe ASAP!!!
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Old 12-15-2009, 01:22 PM   #23
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AFR plots?

i'd target a richer AFR on 91......

And your tuner continuing to do pulls out to 7500 rpm with continuous knocking issues is no good.

any idea what ur CR is now?
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Old 12-15-2009, 01:51 PM   #24
STi Mikey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TDagen View Post
If it helps I think z06 vetted put down 400whp flat on this dyno the op rode....
That indicates no corrction factor. On 1.0 my hta on the stock motor made 294whp = 115 traps.

I think the head work was not necessary. Just look at what MAPerformance has done with thier 2.0 and this turbo.

Aside, I wish him luck. It took me a bit of time to get my set up dialed in on 93 pump, and its still only 95% done after months.
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Old 12-15-2009, 02:08 PM   #25
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comparing your graphs the HTA68 seems to have a higher slope heading to 6200 rpm.....it looks like it wants to keep shooting up to ~270-275whp at redline.

What EM are you tuned on?

I bet your tuner left your per cylinder timing compensations on.....they start around 5100 rpm and end at 6200rpm. 6200rpm is right where your problem starts......if the tuner doesnt realize this then the base+advance+pcc (IE total timing) probably isnt smooth. The PCC takes out 1-3* in that range. So if he doesnt know its there and is only looking at base+advance, then the base+advance may be 3* too high when the compensation turns off and stops pulling timing.
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