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Old 01-19-2010, 09:19 AM   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scotty144 View Post
Unfortunately, that video doesn't tell us much
Here's the graph for that tuning session:



- Pete@EFI
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Old 01-19-2010, 11:04 AM   #127
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nm.. coffee kicked in and brain began working..
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Old 01-19-2010, 01:27 PM   #128
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click the link for the URL.......it has the whole description there

*nevermind theres the graph ^^*
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Old 01-19-2010, 03:29 PM   #129
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Even the 2.5r doesn't hit full boost until after 4k RPM?? Seems like the 10cm hotside is a bit of a miss-match for this turbo.

-- Ed
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Old 01-19-2010, 05:54 PM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaus View Post
Even the 2.5r doesn't hit full boost until after 4k RPM?? Seems like the 10cm hotside is a bit of a miss-match for this turbo.

-- Ed
that turbo isnt a 2.5R its a dom 2.5 with a 10cm hotside. no ball bearings, no billet wheel. unless im reading it incorrectly .
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Old 01-19-2010, 06:39 PM   #131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jnorth85 View Post
that turbo isnt a 2.5R its a dom 2.5 with a 10cm hotside. no ball bearings, no billet wheel. unless im reading it incorrectly .
The description on the dyno chart lists it as a Blouch 2.5R 10cm.

-- Ed
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Old 01-19-2010, 07:01 PM   #132
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Isn't there only one kind of Blouch 2.5 turbo? They are all BB garrett CHRA's and the options between, 8cm-10cm, and 2.5R or 2.5XTR...ok so technically two

Last edited by chlnOrSlpn?; 01-19-2010 at 07:11 PM.
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Old 01-19-2010, 08:25 PM   #133
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can anyone overnight me a dom4 xtr?
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Old 01-19-2010, 08:55 PM   #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaus View Post
Even the 2.5r doesn't hit full boost until after 4k RPM?? Seems like the 10cm hotside is a bit of a miss-match for this turbo.

-- Ed
People get hung up on boost, others will tell you larger hotside will 'make more power on less boost' and even with a larger hotside will give better power during spool. The truth is a mixture of these two. You need boost to make power, but flow helps too. I look at the torque charts and make my decisions that way.

EFI should overlay:
DOM3 from post 51 (normal Dom3 8cm, not XTR)
dom2.5r with 10cm
& a representative 20G chart.

I say this because I think the Dom2.5 (and all variants) are competing more with the 20G than with the Dom3 due to pricing. Power for $ people will look at the Dom 2.5 turbos and come to the conclusion it's not worth the price or they'll move straight to the Dom 3. The people considering the Dom 2.5s are people looking for something that spools like a 20G and outflows it up top (as Ed says, physics is a bi$@#, and this likely isn't happening.) I really don't think people are looking at the DOM2.5 the way they should (pretty much halfway between a 20G and a DOM3)

In comparing some specific RPM points with the Dom3 graph in post #51, you can see that the 2.5XTR (or makeshift XTR, whatever it was) that EFI tested is basically just a smaller DOM3, which is pretty much what you expect.

Torque is a scoosh left of the DOM3. Peak torque on both is right around 380, 4300ish on the 2.5 and 4400ish on the 3, with the 3 outperforming at >4400 and the 2.5 outperforming at <4300

Calibrated eyeball comparsions
RPM - 2.5r w/10cm Torque - 3.0 torque

3000 - 210 - 205
3500 - 280 - 265
4000 - 360 - 355
4500 - 375 - 380
5000 - 350 - 370
5500 - 340 - 355
6000 - 310 - 340
6500 - 305 - 285
7000 - 260 - 275 (*7k is extrapolated)

So spool is potentially slightly better with a 2.5r + 10cm hotside (or XT-R if that's what it is) vs. the Dom3. There's nothing that indicates that the 10cm really changes the shape of the curve for better or worse compared with the 8cm DOM3. The curves are pretty close in shape, they're just shifted a bit due to the cold side wheel differences. If anything, I think the 8cm shape is slightly better.

Now I can see why the 2.5XTR is delayed. There's not much market for a turbo like this in my opinion. Hopefully EFI's is a frankenstein without the billet wheel and the real 2.5XTR spools better, but I fear this isn't the case.

Last edited by Concillian; 01-20-2010 at 05:41 PM.
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Old 01-19-2010, 10:00 PM   #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EFI Logics View Post
Here's the graph for that tuning session:



- Pete@EFI
What fuel are you running on this? Also, what's up with the boost spike then drop off? I am very curious what this turbo can do, especially on a 2.0 liter. However, I am looking for something that can stay at max boost the whole way to redline.
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Old 01-20-2010, 03:23 PM   #136
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hey EFI, could you maybe show the log for this car if you can remember it?

07 WRX stock internals
Blouch 2.5r
APS 525 FMIC
APS 70mm intake
Deutchwerks (sp) 750 injectors
APS hard turbo inlet
Grimmspeed BCS
Invidia Turbo back
Gruppe S headers
Labonte Meth injection w/3d controller
75% - 25% meth to water ratio
APS Recirc BOV
Car was tuned at 22psi.
398Wtq
395 WHP

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Old 01-20-2010, 03:23 PM   #137
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also was that the OG polka pickle?
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:00 AM   #138
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Old 01-21-2010, 02:05 PM   #139
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thats an interesting log....11.0-7's all the way thru from 2900rpm on.....impressive.
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Old 01-21-2010, 03:23 PM   #140
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I love how quickly the 2.5 spools but it just seems to tank up top. I wonder if it's an issue of stock cams or if the turbo just can't push enough air. How's it feel on the street GDAryder?
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Old 01-21-2010, 04:37 PM   #141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rexblake View Post
What fuel are you running on this? Also, what's up with the boost spike then drop off? I am very curious what this turbo can do, especially on a 2.0 liter. However, I am looking for something that can stay at max boost the whole way to redline.
the boost spike then dropoff is simply a from the EBCS and turbo dynamics in the stock ecu. ur 68hta isnt doing that because ur maxing the damn thing across the entire rpm range. if you try and make the turbo dynamics aggressive to help spool you will get oscillations......if you leave the td's conservative it will be laggier.....you're always walking that fine line unless you're simply maxing the turbo.

and how is it tanking? the power only drops like 5-10 hp from peak to redline. you're looking too much at the boost instead of the power. i'd much rather have this curve and powerband at 21 psi and 355whp than yours at 29psi and 340whp. isnt ur powerband the one that tanks like 80whp from peak to redline?

its gotta be on pump gas or a conservative tune.....a 49 lb/min turbo will do 26-28 psi peak and hold 23-25 at redline.....this one will probably hold more with the 10cm housing.

if i were you i wouldnt upgrade to anything less than the dom3xtr. the 2.5 or 2.5xtr or even the regular dom3 arent gonna add that much power.....30-50whp max........whereas the dom3xtr would add 50-80whp
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Old 01-21-2010, 08:41 PM   #142
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I guess that makes sense for the initial spike. It just seems some better boost control would be in order then, unless it is designed specifically to do that. Which could be, since the tq curve is following the boost curve almost exactly.

Looking at the log link, GDAryder is dropping 20hp by redline, and it's only going to 6700rpm. Now, this could simply be and issue of something else on the car, not necessarily the turbo itself.

I agree with the pump gas, that's my guess. But I'd still like to know for sure.

Lol, yeah, my turbo does tank. Hence why I would like something more. However, I'd like to keep it spooling as quickly as possible, which is why I like the 2.5 over the 3.0. If I could add another 30-50whp max that's fine, as long as it can hold the whole way to redline. I'd love to have almost a 4k power band!
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:00 PM   #143
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edit: n/m made a mistake.
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Old 01-22-2010, 01:09 AM   #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rexblake View Post
I love how quickly the 2.5 spools but it just seems to tank up top. I wonder if it's an issue of stock cams or if the turbo just can't push enough air. How's it feel on the street GDAryder?

lol i dont have the 2.5xtr.....yet......
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Old 01-22-2010, 07:43 PM   #145
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Got any DOM 4.0 XT-R EJ207 (2.0L) results?
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Old 01-22-2010, 09:44 PM   #146
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Well I got my dom3 xtr installed on my car and waiting to get tuned. I will post results when I get them guys.
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Old 01-23-2010, 11:53 AM   #147
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i love these turbos.. Either Dom4 or Dom3 xtr will be my summer Mod.....I cant wait...
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Old 01-25-2010, 11:04 PM   #148
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just got my dom 3 xtr retuned tonight.
the tune was on 91+ 75/25 meth
car made 468whp/491wtq at 27psi
thats all i know right now,ill post graph tommorrow.
was a little more psi than i was looking for,but its not a dd.
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Old 01-26-2010, 10:57 PM   #149
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jazmak24 View Post
just got my dom 3 xtr retuned tonight.
the tune was on 91+ 75/25 meth
car made 468whp/491wtq at 27psi
thats all i know right now,ill post graph tommorrow.
was a little more psi than i was looking for,but its not a dd.
Impressive.

At what RPM did you hit 300wtq?

Did you do any runs without meth?

Full list of mods?

Please post the dyno graph.
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Old 01-26-2010, 11:14 PM   #150
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here you go.

crappy camera,sorry for bad pics.


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