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Old 02-02-2010, 03:50 PM   #1
johnlattanzi
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Default External Waste Gate install help

Hey i'm new to external waste gates and today i am going to be installing a bunch of stuff as long as i have everything down that i needed. I am putting this in the newbie thread because i am hoping not to get ripped apart like i normally do when i ask dumb questions.

But as of Now I Have GT SPEC Gen 2 Unequal length headers, i have the stock up pipe that comes with the headers with a Flange welded to fit my EWG, I have the Tial 44mm EWG with the ATP Dump Tube. Also i purchased the grimmspeed bracket to run my stock turbo IWG untill i ahve enought money for an upgraded turbo and tune. The Tial ewg which was purchased brand new came with air fittings with a hole for them to be screwed into on the top of the ewg and the side.

I thought i heard somewhere that these air fittings are to attach to a boost controller? I do not have any sort of an aftermarket boost controller, will i still be able to install this? If so what do i do with the holes because on the diagram picture that came with it the waste gate says for the hole on the top to run atmospheric. Can any body help me out with this install? I really am not sure what to do.. Help would be appreciated thanks!

-Tyler
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Old 02-02-2010, 04:24 PM   #2
the suicidal eggroll
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You currently have a boost controller, it's electronic and controlled by the ECU. All you need to do is re-route the vacuum lines from the old IWG to the new EWG (side port) and re-tune your WGDC tables in the ECU. That's the simple way to hook it up, there are more "advanced" ways you can hook it up, with diagrams and such if you care you look it up. A lot of people find that the stock ECU has a difficult time with EWG, and they end up switching to an MBC. You can cross that bridge if/when you reach it.
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Old 02-02-2010, 04:43 PM   #3
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If you aren't getting a tune run a direct line from the turbo to the side port of the ewg (provided your spring isn't like 19psi), or just stay out of boost. I'm pretty sure you need to tune with ewg and the stock solenoid, I'm not sure if it will regulate boost correctly untuned. I know it needs to be tuned for, but what I'm not sure of is if it goes crazy, or just doesn't hold right. It could stay around whatever your tuned for or shoot up to 24, I never researched that part.
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Old 02-03-2010, 01:58 PM   #4
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Currently in the install process I have my turbo out because the up pipe would not slide in with it in so I have the turbo off, new headets in, up pipe in, and external wastegate is In with the dump tube hooked up... I have both air fitting ports hooked in.. Where exactly am I supposed to run a line from each of them? I'm new to this so I really don't have a clue... I have the bracket on the turbo to shut it closed but the turbo is not on yet.. Where do I put these two airport fittings to attach to.. Someone please help
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Old 02-03-2010, 02:17 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnlattanzi View Post
Currently in the install process I have my turbo out because the up pipe would not slide in with it in so I have the turbo off, new headets in, up pipe in, and external wastegate is In with the dump tube hooked up... I have both air fitting ports hooked in.. Where exactly am I supposed to run a line from each of them? I'm new to this so I really don't have a clue... I have the bracket on the turbo to shut it closed but the turbo is not on yet.. Where do I put these two airport fittings to attach to.. Someone please help
You are not doing plug and play cookie cutter modifications any more, you'll need to start making decisions about how it will be run. There are a lot of ways you can run the boost control system, you'll have to decide which one is the best for you. To start off, you can run a vacuum line straight from the compressor to the side port on the wastegate (nothing attached to the top port). This will limit you at spring pressure. To raise the boost above this, you'll need to start looking into boost control setups. You could use your stock solenoid, but you'll need a new restrictor pill to flow enough for the new WG. Alternatively you could switch to a 3-port, there are 3-4 different ways you could hook one up depending on how complicated you want to get. You could also get an MBC, again about 2-3 different ways you can hook it up. Or you can run a 3-port in parallel with an MBC for even more choices. Finally, you could go with a standalone boost control system. It's up to you.
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Old 02-03-2010, 02:18 PM   #6
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Im confused with your first post. Are you going to run the EWG on this turbo? Or are you trying to run the internal gate and just have this installed for the time being since you were in there already?
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Old 03-02-2010, 10:08 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cards2323 View Post
Im confused with your first post. Are you going to run the EWG on this turbo? Or are you trying to run the internal gate and just have this installed for the time being since you were in there already?
im goin to be installing an e3 16g soon. and i have a few questions related to this...

1. with the stock td04 in the car still, with the IWG not welded shut, what is the proper way to install an ewg if the setup is like this...if there even is one

i assume its safe to have both, the only reason i ask is because i plan on having the ewg a few weeks before the turbo goes in

2. when i put my e3 16g in, welded shut, how should i orient the stock BCS to get it to a shop? just plug the correct line into the top air fitting?

Last edited by todeswalzer; 03-02-2010 at 10:14 PM.
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Old 03-02-2010, 11:00 PM   #8
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Why are you installing this now instead of when the 16G goes in?
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Old 03-02-2010, 11:33 PM   #9
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so that im not running an untuned e3 16g for weeks

im just trying to get the most installed as i can as soon as i can, i dont have agarage and time is against me
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Old 03-02-2010, 11:45 PM   #10
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So is the plan to drive around for weeks with an untuned ewg instead?
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Old 03-02-2010, 11:49 PM   #11
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It'll probably save your more time doing this whole install when you have all your components. You have to unbolt everthing from your Turbo to do your manifold, uppipe, and downpipe etc.

And order a tactrix too and start reading on how to tune. You can quickly blow your motor by installing all these parts and not having them tuned properly. Your probably installing a walbro fuel pump too.
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Old 03-02-2010, 11:50 PM   #12
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So is the plan to drive around for weeks with an untuned ewg instead?


the plan is to ask questions and wait for someone to answer them

i might be ignorant
but thanks to you im still ignorant

by dumping some air before the turbo as well as having it go through the IWG i dont see what the harm would be. but im not willing to just go and find out the hard way that it isnt safe.
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Old 03-02-2010, 11:52 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAtwal View Post
It'll probably save your more time doing this whole install when you have all your components. You have to unbolt everthing from your Turbo to do your manifold, uppipe, and downpipe etc.

And order a tactrix too and start reading on how to tune. You can quickly blow your motor by installing all these parts and not having them tuned properly. Your probably installing a walbro fuel pump too.
my car is ready to drop in the e3 and drive to the shop, install injectors there and hand it to the tuner. everything else is taken care of


im just complicating things now
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Old 03-02-2010, 11:53 PM   #14
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You're fine if you stay completely out of boost.
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Old 03-02-2010, 11:55 PM   #15
todeswalzer
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basically i meant to ask is there a way to hook an EWG up so that its bypassed and never opens up
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Old 03-03-2010, 12:03 AM   #16
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yea just don't hook any vacuum lines up to the wastegate, simple
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Old 03-03-2010, 12:03 AM   #17
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I have an untuned ewg currently with no issues.... Yet but there really shouldn't be an issue run an mbc to control your own boost levels untill you are ready for your tune. I'm a firm believer in tuning for big mods (injs, turbos, head/motor work) I just don't see how bleeding air is any more likely to blow up my car than bleeding air out of a different port. As long as boost levels are controlled then I don't see what is going to effect the motor at all. Now you will not see the full potential of any mod without proper tuning but I think the subie community is a little tune happy.


Now if someone can explain to me how this would be a problem I would really like to hear it. I honestly don't see how this could be that serious of an issue.



OP what spring is in the ewg? As long as it's <15 lbs you should be ok till you are tuned. If you run spring pressure only I believe you hook it to the (EDIT) side nipple I'm sure tial has a install guide on thier website

Last edited by neversummer489; 03-03-2010 at 10:03 AM. Reason: Wrong nipple ;)
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Old 03-03-2010, 12:05 AM   #18
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no the bottom nipple is for wg spring pressure, top nipple is for when u have a boost controller hooked up
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Old 03-03-2010, 12:15 AM   #19
todeswalzer
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Originally Posted by MENU View Post
yea just don't hook any vacuum lines up to the wastegate, simple
thank you, thats all i wanted

Quote:
Originally Posted by neversummer489 View Post
I have an untuned ewg no issues.... Yet but there really shouldn't be an issue run an mbc to control your own boost levels untill you are ready for your tune. I'm a firm believer in tuning for big mods (injs, turbos, head/motor work) I just don't see how bleeding air is any more likely to blow up my car than bleeding air out of a different port. As long as boost levels are controlled then I don't see what is going to effect the motor at all. Now you will not see the full potential of any mod without proper tuning but I think the subie community is a little tune happy.


Now if someone can explain to me how this would be a problem I would really like to hear it. I honestly don't see how this could be that serious of an issue.
thats what i was thinking of doing, i was reading earlier about running both an EBCS and MBC in line and was toying with doing that myself. Id have just the MBC in for now and install my grimmspeed EBCS in the shop before tune


does it matter having both iwg and ewg if there is a mbc installed?
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Old 03-03-2010, 09:54 AM   #20
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wow good luck with this install man. I had a tial 44 in my 06 and it sounded fawking sickkkkk... made crazy power too. u will be more than satisfied!
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Old 03-03-2010, 10:08 AM   #21
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I wouldn't think there would be any catastrophic damage running both wastegates. I haven't done that myself but I would expect the lighter of the 2 springs would end up controling boost. But make sure both the springs aren't tiptop close in the spring rate or both wgs will try to control boost and that will sound super weird
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Old 03-03-2010, 02:00 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neversummer489 View Post
I wouldn't think there would be any catastrophic damage running both wastegates. I haven't done that myself but I would expect the lighter of the 2 springs would end up controling boost. But make sure both the springs aren't tiptop close in the spring rate or both wgs will try to control boost and that will sound super weird
you're not understanding how a wastegate works, exhaust gases don't open the wastegate, the positive pressure created by the compressor opens the wastegate via vacuum lines, you have no vacuum lines hooked up to the wastegate it will not open at all
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Old 03-17-2010, 12:06 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MENU View Post
you're not understanding how a wastegate works, exhaust gases don't open the wastegate, the positive pressure created by the compressor opens the wastegate via vacuum lines, you have no vacuum lines hooked up to the wastegate it will not open at all

So If you had both wastegates on the car, only the one with a vacuum line attached to it would operate? Is that what your trying to say?
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Old 03-17-2010, 10:05 AM   #24
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So If you had both wastegates on the car, only the one with a vacuum line attached to it would operate? Is that what your trying to say?
Yes..
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