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Old 07-27-2010, 10:51 PM   #351
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Could. There is no rule mentioning height. Any ideas on how?

Tony
i'll email clint some ideArs.

or really mess with them and make a sucker car like the GRM challenge vette a few years ago.
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Old 07-27-2010, 11:25 PM   #352
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i'll email clint some ideArs.

or really mess with them and make a sucker car like the GRM challenge vette a few years ago.
No sucker cars. Specific in the rules on that one.
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Old 07-28-2010, 03:53 PM   #353
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^ Welp, I'm not going to Sebring now... I was really looking forward to seeing the beast and all the progress and changes you guys made.

Since Cobb's GTR won't be present next month, I'm thinking you will have a sure chance at being crowned Mod AWD Champions. (I'm not saying had they been there you wouldn't be crowned, I'm just saying since they won't be there, you will pass them in points). Hopefully you'll be able to make it back out west for the finale again! (I'll spare another radiator hose if needed )
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Old 07-28-2010, 06:30 PM   #354
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We'll see what happens. Would be nice to have an Eastern Title two years in a row.
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Old 07-29-2010, 05:43 PM   #355
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Flat bottom is finished. Small pic is on purpose.

Did you guys actually notice a difference?

On my car I had "T" plate up front and everything from the gas tank back flat but I can't say I noticed much difference. Then again I was only running 2:06 in traffic instead of my NASA trim 1:59.

I had lots of other changes so it's hard for me to gauge but I always felt as if all the extra weight to do this offset much of the gains.

I'll also warn you I had some transmission issues that seemed to pop up after blocking off most of the transmission and I believe it was due to a lack of cooling.
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Old 07-29-2010, 07:40 PM   #356
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Did you guys actually notice a difference?

On my car I had "T" plate up front and everything from the gas tank back flat but I can't say I noticed much difference. Then again I was only running 2:06 in traffic instead of my NASA trim 1:59.

I had lots of other changes so it's hard for me to gauge but I always felt as if all the extra weight to do this offset much of the gains.

I'll also warn you I had some transmission issues that seemed to pop up after blocking off most of the transmission and I believe it was due to a lack of cooling.
We did! Tony W was telling me that it was the most planted the car has ever felt.

Sadly, no rear diffuser or side skirts but those should be done by saturday night.

I know what you're saying about the tranny. Thankfully it's the older style with the internal pump so I need to see about rigging up an in-line cooler for it.

Our biggest problem right now is cooling. I'm not sure how much of it is due to pushing 31 psi through it and how much is due to blocking air from escaping out the bottom of the engine bay due to the bottom. Either way, we're addressing both right now so we should see some nice improvements for sebring.
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Old 07-30-2010, 11:50 AM   #357
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We did! Tony W was telling me that it was the most planted the car has ever felt.

Sadly, no rear diffuser or side skirts but those should be done by saturday night.

I know what you're saying about the tranny. Thankfully it's the older style with the internal pump so I need to see about rigging up an in-line cooler for it.

Our biggest problem right now is cooling. I'm not sure how much of it is due to pushing 31 psi through it and how much is due to blocking air from escaping out the bottom of the engine bay due to the bottom. Either way, we're addressing both right now so we should see some nice improvements for sebring.
That's good to hear. I think my new Fulcrum Aeroworks wing has so much more downforce than my APR/flat rear under panel I'm not currently feeling the loss of it.

The cooling issue is just likely the extra power. It's tough and I've yet to find a complete solution to our cooling issues at high power.
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Old 07-30-2010, 12:15 PM   #358
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That's good to hear. I think my new Fulcrum Aeroworks wing has so much more downforce than my APR/flat rear under panel I'm not currently feeling the loss of it.

The cooling issue is just likely the extra power. It's tough and I've yet to find a complete solution to our cooling issues at high power.
Our hood vents helped a ton last year, but we've outgrown them. We're going to vent the hood more, and make an internal scoop to promote air out from behind the radiator to out the vents. I'll post pics when it's done.

I also have a couple of things I want to do on the radiator and IC. Right now I cannot find anyone who has done this.

I want to acid dip them to etch the surface to increase surface area.
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Old 07-30-2010, 01:28 PM   #359
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I'm working with IAG on a radiator/intercooler setup that should be pretty slick assuming we are able to package it how I have envisioned it. It's pretty tight with the engine mounted so far forward but I think we can make it happen. I'll let you know how it works out, but it should provide a very significant cooling advantage.
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Old 07-30-2010, 01:30 PM   #360
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not to jack but we came up with a really good rad/oil cooler combo (fitment is 02-07 WRX/STi)

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=611

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=616

we have ZERO cooling issues

-Noah
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Old 07-30-2010, 01:37 PM   #361
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No offense but I have little cooling issues when it's 75 degrees and dry like such as your climate in northern California. LOL! Try and east coast 103F and 80% humidity running in a pack of 65 cars!
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Old 07-30-2010, 01:43 PM   #362
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yep you got me...maybe it would suck, I'll stick to what I know best NorCal but we do race in the Nevada desert in 100-115 degree temps?...ahh maybe its not the same, oh well. You might be right.

*our car never runs in NorCal, redline has yet to come up here (but we do in Oct, we'll see how it goes)

-Noah
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Old 07-30-2010, 01:54 PM   #363
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Share your before and after results and I may think differently.

From my testing it really seems like it's a flow out the radiator issue. Just like Turn In we kept increasing flow from the engine bay out the hood with increasingly better results up to about 500 whp.

Ideally I would love to be able to duct the radiator properly but it's just so tight we would either have to move the radiator in front of the IC decreasing it's size (which we really don't want to do) or we would have to make a custom front end to allow for more room but still have good aerodynamics.

I'm sure there's a fabrication compromise in there somewhere. We might try adding vents into fenders as maybe some of the high pressure from the wheel wells is reducing the flow from the inner fender well vents and maybe trying an electric water pump.
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Old 07-30-2010, 05:20 PM   #364
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Part of the thing that I think everyone is forgetting is our setup.

04 WRX heads - no porting, stock valves, sti cams
Stock 04 WRX header
Stock 04 WRX intake manifold

We can run all day long at 26-27 psi on that turbo, but pop it up to 31 like we did this past weekend, and it really starts to get things heated up MUCH faster.

Hey Noah - I saw your setup. I REALLY like it. In fact, I was going to try and hop on tonight and shoot you a pm on how to integrate a power steering cooler so you can get the trifecta on it.
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Old 07-30-2010, 05:36 PM   #365
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Originally Posted by Turn in Concepts View Post
Part of the thing that I think everyone is forgetting is our setup.

04 WRX heads - no porting, stock valves, sti cams
Stock 04 WRX header
Stock 04 WRX intake manifold

We can run all day long at 26-27 psi on that turbo, but pop it up to 31 like we did this past weekend, and it really starts to get things heated up MUCH faster.

Hey Noah - I saw your setup. I REALLY like it. In fact, I was going to try and hop on tonight and shoot you a pm on how to integrate a power steering cooler so you can get the trifecta on it.
I can already visualize the awesomeness of that combo (and know exactly where it could go) but would need to run it by the ones who do all the fabrication on these for us (for pricing), let me know if you want me to make that call

are you running into pump/heat issues on the steering currently or just being proactive? Taking the car a different route, aside from TA? I only ask b/c we will do 8-10 hot laps in a row (all the fuel we can carry @ 2.5mpg on e85) and have never had any steering heat related issues...as of yet

I know in endurance racing its for sure an issue and needs to be dealt with. I've never seen any as of yet with issues on the TA circuit, unless nobody has said anything yet (which would make more sense, most people aren't as open as you and I are with our builds and trials and tribulations, lol).

Makes sense on the heat at 31psi, the system is out of its efficiency range given your setup. Needs more airflow and valves with port work, as well as manifold will work wonders...but you don't need me to tell you this

-Noah
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Old 07-30-2010, 06:13 PM   #366
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I can already visualize the awesomeness of that combo (and know exactly where it could go) but would need to run it by the ones who do all the fabrication on these for us (for pricing), let me know if you want me to make that call

are you running into pump/heat issues on the steering currently or just being proactive? Taking the car a different route, aside from TA? I only ask b/c we will do 8-10 hot laps in a row (all the fuel we can carry @ 2.5mpg on e85) and have never had any steering heat related issues...as of yet

I know in endurance racing its for sure an issue and needs to be dealt with. I've never seen any as of yet with issues on the TA circuit, unless nobody has said anything yet (which would make more sense, most people aren't as open as you and I are with our builds and trials and tribulations, lol).

Makes sense on the heat at 31psi, the system is out of its efficiency range given your setup. Needs more airflow and valves with port work, as well as manifold will work wonders...but you don't need me to tell you this

-Noah
Actually, the trifecta setup wouldn't just be for the race car. I was thinking about something like this a long time ago after some of our florida customers who autocross. They were complaining about oil temp and the PS overheating.

Since you're 2/3's of the way there make a stainless line loop with brackets, swagged ends, and new hose from the PS pump tank that will work with your setup (I'm thinking loop along the bottom of the radiator). Then you'll have a nice upgrade option.

We tried to bump up to STi heads for the flow and AVCS, but it just wasn't in the budget for this year. As it is I have a set of WRX heads from LAST season sitting here that I was supposed to send out to Endyne so they could do an analysis on them. They're still sitting here.
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Old 07-30-2010, 06:21 PM   #367
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why subaru ran power steering lines right next to up-pipe I have no idea but I agree its an easy thing to do on our setup...shoot our Dodge truck has one like you and I are thinking

-Noah
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Old 07-30-2010, 07:04 PM   #368
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For the no air to cool the trans issue maybe you guys could incorporate a NACA duct into your flat bottom to get some air up there.
Maybe something similar to this


-Anthony

Last edited by Vaughn Performance; 07-30-2010 at 07:14 PM.
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Old 07-30-2010, 09:37 PM   #369
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I like those ducts. Definitely s good idea.

Phil. Overall net effect on weight after adding the flat bottom was 0. The stock front subframe was removed at that time (made a new one) which offset the flat both
Car is getting pretty light now.
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Old 07-30-2010, 09:38 PM   #370
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I like those ducts. Definitely s good idea.

Phil. Overall net effect on weight after adding the flat bottom was 0. The stock front subframe was removed at that time (made a new one) which offset the flat both
Car is getting pretty light now.
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Old 07-31-2010, 01:37 AM   #371
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turn in Concepts View Post
integrate a power steering cooler so you can get the trifecta on it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LICmotorsports View Post
I can already visualize the awesomeness of that combo
I'm visualising its awesomeness too. Please build then package said item and ship to me in Australia for testing in truly horrid conditions.

Chris.
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Old 08-02-2010, 10:59 AM   #372
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We're going to vent the hood more, and make an internal scoop to promote air out from behind the radiator to out the vents. I'll post pics when it's done.
That should help a great deal. If you haven't already done it, duct/close off the IC, radiator, oil cooler, etc...


Quote:
Originally Posted by LICmotorsports View Post
not to jack but we came up with a really good rad/oil cooler combo (fitment is 02-07 WRX/STi)

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=611

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=616

we have ZERO cooling issues

-Noah
Glad to see someone finally doing this for a subie radiator.

TIC, have you guys thought of simply ducting a trans cooler through the undertray? I've seen this done on a few cars that came through the windtunnel. It is also
done a lot with Formula SAE too. You could always say screw it and just use a water to air cooler and just use laminova or similar cores to cool oil, trans and ps. Balancing temps would be setup through surface area if having them in parallel.
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Old 03-21-2012, 10:48 PM   #373
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I know your car is super fast and nice...

BUT PLEASE BAKE YOUR HEADLIGHTS!

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