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Old 04-21-2010, 11:09 AM   #1
mick_the_ginge
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Default Mick's Cage Build

As I am pretty much taking the year off from driving my track car I decided to have a full cage built and installed. I'll do my best to document the build which will be from 4130 Chromoly.

For those who do not know the car sort of looks like this (Yellow Wagon):-





This cage build is not for SCCA, Time Attack or any other "real racing" events. I just like to do track lapping days and feel the need for some more safety.

Starting off with the draft picture that we created to plan out the cage. It does not cover all aspects, this draft was designed to show the install shop what I expected as a minimum. They build frames/cages for funny cars, GTR's, Mustangs so know what they are doing.



The cage goal, protect me as best as possible inthe event of a side impact or roll.

Comments welcome
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Old 04-21-2010, 11:34 AM   #2
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if you want raised roof bars, leave them triangulated on 2 planes, much like the door bars you have...i.e. take out that solid straight bar.

if you wanna cage the rear, go for it but it's extra weight and for what?...if you roll the chassis, it's gonna be toast. no point in trying to reduce the damage to the rear, unless you're racing with passengers in the back

other than that the geometry seems fairly basic. Double x bracing to the rear struts leaves dead links/added weight however.


see how the rear is done here..save some feet in tubing.

or


although I don't think nasa or scca would let the crossbars at the b-pillar fly.

Last edited by Homemade WRX; 04-21-2010 at 11:40 AM.
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Old 04-21-2010, 01:52 PM   #3
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Great input (as usual), thanks.

The thinking behind the rear caging was the fact that it's where my oil dry sump tank lives. So in effect I am treating the tank as my passenger and I want to protect them.

Quote:
although I don't think nasa or scca would let the crossbars at the b-pillar fly.
Not that I really care (as I am not planning to competative race) but at least for SCCA I know that other cars done like this have passed inspection. Crossbars were welded back into the b-pillars.

Oh, and lets face it, with all the stuff I have done to my car I pretty much threw out the weight goal a long time ago. While I love my dry sump the tank with 12-16 quarts of oil, the steel braided hose, the accusump are just so heavy. I'll just need to make even more power and have even bigger brakes.
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Old 04-21-2010, 03:23 PM   #4
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I think it would be worth the time to research some of the NASA, SCCA, and Rally America requirements and try to build the cage to those specs.

I know you aren't planning on running any competitive events. BUT in the future if you ever wanted to sell the car, that's the first thing that someone interested in a car like yours is going to ask.
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Old 04-21-2010, 04:16 PM   #5
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http://www.customcages.co.uk/Rollcag...acturer=Subaru

you can poke on there for various FIA styled subaru cages. Nice pics from multiple angles of each cage.
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Old 04-21-2010, 04:17 PM   #6
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http://www.customcages.co.uk/Rollcag...acturer=Subaru

you can poke on there for various FIA styled subaru cages. Nice pics from multiple angles of each cage.
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Old 04-21-2010, 04:29 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
http://www.customcages.co.uk/Rollcag...acturer=Subaru

you can poke on there for various FIA styled subaru cages. Nice pics from multiple angles of each cage.
Interesting link.
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Old 04-21-2010, 07:03 PM   #8
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I can answer any questions you have about this design... as it is what is in my car. (The current cage drawings differ from the ones posted.) The first drawing is close (the rear strut bar is no longer low... it is now placed at lower rear cross).

total weight was 42kgs. And that is with the HANS bar.. Full Spec step3 for RR.
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Old 04-22-2010, 08:42 AM   #9
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Even if you don't care about being legal for any road race series, I would still use a design that is approved by the FIA, SCCA, or NASA. There is a reason those rules exist, because they are the safest ways to build cages.
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Old 04-22-2010, 09:12 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boost junkie View Post
Even if you don't care about being legal for any road race series, I would still use a design that is approved by the FIA, SCCA, or NASA. There is a reason those rules exist, because they are the safest ways to build cages.
+1 - if you're going to spend the money and/or the time. Do it right the first time. Might be a little more $$ upfront but it's worth it.
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Old 04-22-2010, 11:10 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boost junkie View Post
Even if you don't care about being legal for any road race series, I would still use a design that is approved by the FIA, SCCA, or NASA. There is a reason those rules exist, because they are the safest ways to build cages.
I only said that I did not care about SCCA/NASA/FIA racing. The guys who are building the actual cage know the rules.
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Old 04-22-2010, 03:06 PM   #12
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from what I've noticed, NASA and SCCA are very stingy, like the NHRA, and want a cage built their way. FIA seems to allow more engineering for improved rigidity, reduced weight, better load pathing, etc...much like FSAE and allow a submission of your cage for legality.

Eh, you can stick with the tried and true and you won't have an issue.
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Old 04-22-2010, 04:19 PM   #13
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I'd like to see a scca/nasa cage survive this....

Not to get into this again.. FIA>Cage shops (unless they employ the engineer types and can provide a correct CAD/stress test)

While I was at out a willow years ago 90% of club folks thought they had a good cage just on what the shop told them... you can almost always find a problem with a custom cage.

you will have zero issues with a FIA cert'd cage... as it should be allowed in all classes of racing in the world.
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Old 04-22-2010, 04:21 PM   #14
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Quote:
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I only said that I did not care about SCCA/NASA/FIA racing. The guys who are building the actual cage know the rules.
cool, please provide the before and after weights..
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Old 04-22-2010, 04:47 PM   #15
mick_the_ginge
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Quote:
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cool, please provide the before and after weights..
That will be hard as I have never put the car on the scales. I'll do it after the install so you can all have a good laugh at how heavy my car is.
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Old 04-22-2010, 05:03 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viperguy324 View Post
YouTube- Petter Solberg destroys his Subaru Impreza STI WRC crash

I'd like to see a scca/nasa cage survive this....

Not to get into this again.. FIA>Cage shops (unless they employ the engineer types and can provide a correct CAD/stress test)

While I was at out a willow years ago 90% of club folks thought they had a good cage just on what the shop told them... you can almost always find a problem with a custom cage.

you will have zero issues with a FIA cert'd cage... as it should be allowed in all classes of racing in the world.
I'd post in-car video from when I wrecked but nasa asked me not to. When I looked at the data, the car initially snapped sideways and started rolling at around 145mph. It rolled 3 times, and the only thing that slowed it down was hitting an unpadded concrete barrier in the middle of the 3rd roll. I got out and walked away, and the passenger compartment remained fully intact. In fact, looking at just the interior you wouldn't even know it was in a wreck except for all the gravel and dirt that made its way inside. That cage was built to the letter of the NASA rule book. Theorize all you want, but that's all the proof I need. For the record, I would trust an FIA certified cage to do the same job...it's just different means to the same end.
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Old 04-22-2010, 05:52 PM   #17
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I'd post in-car video from when I wrecked but nasa asked me not to. When I looked at the data, the car initially snapped sideways and started rolling at around 145mph. It rolled 3 times, and the only thing that slowed it down was hitting an unpadded concrete barrier in the middle of the 3rd roll. I got out and walked away, and the passenger compartment remained fully intact. In fact, looking at just the interior you wouldn't even know it was in a wreck except for all the gravel and dirt that made its way inside. That cage was built to the letter of the NASA rule book. Theorize all you want, but that's all the proof I need. For the record, I would trust an FIA certified cage to do the same job...it's just different means to the same end.
why does NASA care? was it their fault?
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Old 04-22-2010, 06:12 PM   #18
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Quote:
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why does NASA care? was it their fault?
I'm wondering the same thing. I recall when the wreck happened but wasn't there...

I will however say that it speaks volumes that the cage is being done by the same shop that did the first.
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Old 04-22-2010, 06:16 PM   #19
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why does NASA care? was it their fault?
I think they just don't want the bad publicity scaring away potential newcomers. They didn't forbid me to post it (not that they could) but they nicely asked me not to and I respect their wishes. If anyone wants to see it that badly I can email it to you but I'm not going to post it on youtube or a forum.
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Old 04-22-2010, 06:17 PM   #20
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I'm actually quite curious. Can you shoot it micah.mcmahan at yahoo
Thanks!
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Old 04-22-2010, 06:17 PM   #21
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stupid double posting
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Old 04-22-2010, 10:48 PM   #22
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I'm in for the usual mick pictures, video and build following.
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Old 04-23-2010, 06:49 AM   #23
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send it to john@boxersports(dot)de

I'm also curious ...
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Old 04-23-2010, 12:30 PM   #24
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Build the cage to a particular sanctioning bodies' specs. It'll be worth it in the end (if you don't trash the car) - you can sell it to someone who does complete.

Cutting out and changing a cage is not worth it for most people.
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Old 04-23-2010, 02:35 PM   #25
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May be worth building to a particular spec, so you can get a log book. It may help with future sales of the car, or it may help you get into a particular event that you find appealing later down the road. Specs change over time, so if you don't get the log book now when you have a conforming cage, you might not be able to get it later(as specs change).
You've already commited to doing the hard part of the work. Seems a waste to not bother getting a log book.
Rally america uses a modified version of the FIA rules. The difference is Rally America allows DOM tubing.
http://www.fia.com/resources/documen...pJ_Art_253.pdf
The link shows and awful lot of good info in their cage specs, and is worth looking at, even if you don't build it to that spec. It list certain critical dimensions that are important.
I'm currently doing a cage to these specs, and intend to get a log book. Not so much because I want to run Rally America events(Though I do), but because it transfers across many sanctioning bodies. Many sanctioning bodies will accept a Rally America logged car for their event.

Good luck and post pictures of the progress.
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