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Old 05-18-2010, 02:24 AM   #1
SueBaroo
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2002 WRX Wagon
03WRX/06STi/07FOZ/08LEG

Default Trying to learn how to edit ROM's / how to tune

Since I'm new, I will not be tuning my car as of yet. I am getting a new tune from CAMtuning. I just want to learn myself.

I've been reading and reading all I can about tuning. I even bought NSFW's book recommendations (haven't read the whole thing yet).

I'm having problem w/ my tune. It's a stage 2 Tim Bailey tune w/ EcuteK. I'm currently working on getting a new ecu so I don't need to use EcuteK.

My logs are below. Really horrible. (Bought the car with this tune.)
3rd gear pull 1
3rd gear pull 2
3rd gear pull 3

Mods:
Stock TD04
APS FMIC 525
APS CAI 65mm
APS recirc valve
Cusco Headers
Vishnu Uppipe
HKS TBE

My IAM is at 9 and have been reading it should be at 16. I should have zero FBKC and FLKC.

What should I do about the tune? I really want to learn and understand the logic behind where to start.

I was on Rom Raiders and I just found out that I should set WGDC by zeroing the tables in Max Wastegate duty and Initial-off Wastegate Duty. After I do a log of this change, what am I really looking for?

This is what was advised on RR to me:
Quote:
Originally Posted by mickeyd2005
Step 1: Make sure car is driving right in the low load/low rprm range.
Usually, this is only fueling since stock timing is usually okay. Sometimes 2 degrees less than stock timing is better. You can actually use AFR learning to scale your low load MAF by adjusting the MAF scales until you get the whole picture.
Step 2: Do WOT logs with zero WGDC and check fueling and timing.
Step 3: Increase boost slowly and check fueling and timing.
Step 4: Fine tune boost control.
Can anyone guide me on how to do these suggestions?
1.) What kind of numbers for load am I looking for in step 1?
2.) What kind of number am I looking for when checking fueling and timing? Am I looking for 0 FLKC & FBKC?
3.)How many PSi should I start with.
4.) How do you "fine tune" the boost control?

What else can I do to diagnose and correct this problem? Steps on how tuners diagnose and troubleshoot problems will be greatly appreciated.

I have a stock ROM I can reference as well.


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Last edited by SueBaroo; 05-18-2010 at 02:33 AM.
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Old 05-18-2010, 02:36 AM   #2
scoobystas
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i'm gonna guess its fuel related.

is it possible you have a vacuum leak somewhere? i'm gonna guess the car is running lean and thus knocking because it looks like you peak torque timing target is about 14 which is not too aggressive at all.

your wastegate is maxing out too. maybe something mechanical, it shouldn't take 100 percent duty cycles to run 10lbs of boost at redline.
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Old 05-18-2010, 11:40 AM   #3
SueBaroo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobystas View Post
i'm gonna guess its fuel related.

is it possible you have a vacuum leak somewhere? i'm gonna guess the car is running lean and thus knocking because it looks like you peak torque timing target is about 14 which is not too aggressive at all.

your wastegate is maxing out too. maybe something mechanical, it shouldn't take 100 percent duty cycles to run 10lbs of boost at redline.
The boost can be explained. It's not running full boost at redline so it won't blow up the engine! Lol. I looked at the stock ROM as well, and it should taper lower boost near redline. My 06 STi did the same w/ a COBB Stage 2 map.

Is the WGDC really maxing out? I see it at 80% +/- at the most. Not 100%.

Yes it is running lean thus knocking. Question, where are you reading the peak torque timing?

I can't find any vacuum leak. The car idle's fine ad when I spray carb cleaner or soapy water, I don't find anything.

Should I be concerned about A/F Learning #1? From what I learned is that optimal power through open loop should be 11-12.5 during WOT. I see it tapers down to 6....what does that mean?
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Old 05-18-2010, 12:06 PM   #4
scoobystas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SueBaroo View Post
The boost can be explained. It's not running full boost at redline so it won't blow up the engine!
TD04 can't run full boost at redline because its small and mechanically limited.


Quote:
Is the WGDC really maxing out? I see it at 80% +/- at the most. Not 100%.
yes around your spool up at 3k and around 6k

Quote:
Yes it is running lean thus knocking. Question, where are you reading the peak torque timing?
peak torque happens a few hundred rpms just after peak boost. so you hit 18lbs at 3300 to 3500rpm. The 2nd run your total ign timing is at 9 and it doesn't knock. Then the map calls for it to go to 12 and it knocks and removes 2.11 of timing, bring it down to 9.5*.

Quote:
Should I be concerned about A/F Learning #1? From what I learned is that optimal power through open loop should be 11-12.5 during WOT. I see it tapers down to 6....what does that mean?
a/f learning #1 shows you the learning your car has done in order to compensate the a/f at idle and hit your map's target of 14.7ish (usually). Your learning there should be minimal.

Since you can log, download software called learning view from romraider and run it on your car. It will pull all the learned knock your car currently has stored on the ecu and show you your closed loop fueling compensations.

You should pull timing from your map and make it safer. don't do any wot runs until you either have it tuned or get a wideband 02. not a good idea to keep it knocking and have 6* of timing pulled.

as a matter of fact, its good that your iam is at 9 because your car is not safe. if you do enough reading, you can self tune it, then you'll need a wideband o2 thats gonna cost you 200 bucks. you can install it yourself, i did and i'm not too mechanically inclined.

or you can pay 500 for a professional dyno tune. Some tuners are better than others and when i say better, i mean actually care about your tune, vs getting out the door.

Last edited by scoobystas; 05-18-2010 at 12:11 PM.
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Old 05-18-2010, 04:16 PM   #5
SueBaroo
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Aha, I see the Primary WGDC 100%. I was mainly looking at the mid-high RPMS and didn't notice those AND I was looking at injector duty cycle not primary WGDC.


I do have learning view and will post the log here. So should I also set my WGDC to 0 also?
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Old 05-18-2010, 04:44 PM   #6
scoobystas
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if set your wgdc to zero, it will show you the amount of pressure in your wastegate spring, you will only boost to like 8lbs, because past this, the wastegate will just open and flow air around the turbine and so you won't be able to build any more boost.

But, it will also show you the natural spooling of your turbo and at what points you want to start adding wgdc, so that it keeps the wastegate closed and allows you to build boost past wastegate pressue.
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Old 05-18-2010, 04:49 PM   #7
SueBaroo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobystas View Post
if set your wgdc to zero, it will show you the amount of pressure in your wastegate spring, you will only boost to like 8lbs, because past this, the wastegate will just open and flow air around the turbine and so you won't be able to build any more boost.

But, it will also show you the natural spooling of your turbo and at what points you want to start adding wgdc, so that it keeps the wastegate closed and allows you to build boost past wastegate pressue.
Ok so to pull timing, what needs to be done in the ROM and under what table/options. There are three tables I see which are:

Ignition Timing - Advance
Ignition Timing - Compensation
Ignition Timing - Knock Control
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Old 05-18-2010, 07:17 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SueBaroo View Post
Ok so to pull timing, what needs to be done in the ROM and under what table/options. There are three tables I see which are:

Ignition Timing - Advance
Ignition Timing - Compensation
Ignition Timing - Knock Control
None of the above. Pull 3 degrees of timing out of the base ignition timing table in the area where the car pulls timing anyways. You could pull it from the advance, but since you already have a timing issue.... Pull it out of the base timing.

Post up your learning view, I'm curious to see where it's learned to pull timing already.

When you log, don't bother logging the innovate LC-1 and LM-1, since you don't have them... Also, fuel learning and correction, better off not logging it, and use learning view instead. The more parameters you log, the less data you capture.
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Old 05-18-2010, 08:31 PM   #9
SueBaroo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reddoak View Post
None of the above. Pull 3 degrees of timing out of the base ignition timing table in the area where the car pulls timing anyways. You could pull it from the advance, but since you already have a timing issue.... Pull it out of the base timing.

Post up your learning view, I'm curious to see where it's learned to pull timing already.

When you log, don't bother logging the innovate LC-1 and LM-1, since you don't have them... Also, fuel learning and correction, better off not logging it, and use learning view instead. The more parameters you log, the less data you capture.
Yeah I just noticed that today that I don't need the LC-1 and LM-1. I will get some logs of LV
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