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Old 11-09-2016, 05:10 PM   #1
TCX
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Default Borg Warner Turbo Choice For 650-700whp

Okay so I'm down to my final choice of turbo
we decided on borg warner for a journal turbo as far as how reliable they are
now were just trying to decide on which one
with which housing etc

it'll be a twin scroll setup
will be t3 or t4 depending on the choice

setup is an outfront v3 block
cp 8.5:1 pistons
manley I beam rods
ferrea +1mm valves and dual springs
kelford 272 cams
boomba TB
3" IC piping
id2000 injectors

twin scroll headers

aquamist methanol

kind of a simple run down

I doubt an s257 would hit 650whp even with meth but the spool would be nice
weve been looking at s362's

I'm trying to get spool to around 4500 instead of 5000 however I can
we're already considering fabbing a custom uppipe to reposition the turbo so itll shorten IC and Exhaust piping to reduce lag
but also turbo will decide that as well

so lets hear opinions
thank you
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Old 11-09-2016, 05:27 PM   #2
STiSomeday
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S257sx-e can be cranked up into the mid-30's according to BW, I bet you could get close to 650 with meth. I'd want to get there with less stress on a bigger frame though.

S362 would be a logical choice. Being TS, go for a bigger hotside that you think you should, the airwerks turbos are no slouch to spool.

What twinscroll kit are you going with? I'd highly recommend hitting up Moore Performance, their TS kit performs and they have a lot of experience with the journal BW's. My S257sx-e makes full boost around 4100 on 93 only with a 1.22 a/r divided hotside. I chose the hotside based on planning to run e85, but it gets around just fine on 93.

Here's my build, there's a dyno graph with boost curve you can check out to get some data to start comparing:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...2711639&page=6
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Old 11-09-2016, 05:34 PM   #3
TCX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STiSomeday View Post
S257sx-e can be cranked up into the mid-30's according to BW, I bet you could get close to 650 with meth. I'd want to get there with less stress on a bigger frame though.

S362 would be a logical choice. Being TS, go for a bigger hotside that you think you should, the airwerks turbos are no slouch to spool.

What twinscroll kit are you going with? I'd highly recommend hitting up Moore Performance, their TS kit performs and they have a lot of experience with the journal BW's. My S257sx-e makes full boost around 4100 on 93 only with a 1.22 a/r divided hotside. I chose the hotside based on planning to run e85, but it gets around just fine on 93.

Here's my build, there's a dyno graph with boost curve you can check out to get some data to start comparing:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...2711639&page=6
Not bad man, I love your build!
I have lachute twin scroll headers now
but my buddy at parker speed is going to fab the up pipe
were trying to think of the best location to shorten the piping as much as possible
as well we don't want to have to run a scavenger pump if we don't have to

but yes the s362 is looking the best, if i could find a way to make that get full spool around 4500-4600 i'd be extremely happy, just figuring that out may be tough
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Old 11-09-2016, 07:45 PM   #4
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Why not the s300 8375 that full race has good results with? Similar to a gt35r-4088 so should spool by 4500.

Also you want the t4 for TS and like others mentioned go large on hot side.
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Old 11-09-2016, 10:37 PM   #5
TCX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul View Post
Why not the s300 8375 that full race has good results with? Similar to a gt35r-4088 so should spool by 4500.

Also you want the t4 for TS and like others mentioned go large on hot side.
I get discounts on borg warner stuff
So if its a non modified bw turbo that would be pretty sweet
Ill have to check it out
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Old 11-09-2016, 10:39 PM   #6
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SXE s362 will get you there easy and it's a damn REAPONSIVE turbo.

I'm running it with a spool valve and a .83 divided housing.
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Old 11-09-2016, 11:09 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WhatTurboLag? View Post
SXE s362 will get you there easy and it's a damn REAPONSIVE turbo.

I'm running it with a spool valve and a .83 divided housing.
nice when are you seeing full boost?

and the spool valve goes on a non twin scroll manifold correct?
I havent looked into them much, just heard of them
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Old 11-10-2016, 11:04 AM   #8
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I hate to say it but the S257sx-e can't get you there. I had one and was going to be in the mid 400's with E85 @ 27psi. Now, you could boost more than me, but you aren't picking up almost 300whp.

I recommend (as others have and it's the turbo I run) the S362 (or the one bigger).
I make 550/460 on e85 @ 27 psi. With more boost (and the complementary mods) I can hit 650/500 easy. Full boost comes in at 4500 rpm which is nice for driving around town.
My daily tune (93) is very conservative and it's 420/360 @ 20 psi.

So things I didn't do, which you might want to do (and I should have as well). Port the heads, PW intake manifold with FWD facing TB, beast fuel system. That and the fact you can boost more than me, should put you over your 650 on E85 or 93+meth (pending what dyno).

My build is below.
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2788322
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Old 11-10-2016, 11:37 AM   #9
TCX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stags4 View Post
I hate to say it but the S257sx-e can't get you there. I had one and was going to be in the mid 400's with E85 @ 27psi. Now, you could boost more than me, but you aren't picking up almost 300whp.

I recommend (as others have and it's the turbo I run) the S362 (or the one bigger).
I make 550/460 on e85 @ 27 psi. With more boost (and the complementary mods) I can hit 650/500 easy. Full boost comes in at 4500 rpm which is nice for driving around town.
My daily tune (93) is very conservative and it's 420/360 @ 20 psi.

So things I didn't do, which you might want to do (and I should have as well). Port the heads, PW intake manifold with FWD facing TB, beast fuel system. That and the fact you can boost more than me, should put you over your 650 on E85 or 93+meth (pending what dyno).

My build is below.
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2788322
That actually makes me exited to hear
4500rpm full boost on the s362 is perfect with me
im doing a forward facing 2.5i short runner intake ported
boomba 75mmtb with 3" ic piping
ported heads with +1mm valves
id2000 injectors with radium surge tank, fuelab prodigy pump etc
and aquamist meth
so i think im hitting all those things

trying to shorten piping as much as possible too, but i dont want to have to run a scavenge pump

which turbine housing are you using? is it twin scroll?
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Old 11-10-2016, 06:46 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TCX View Post
That actually makes me exited to hear
which turbine housing are you using? is it twin scroll?
Awesome, sounds like you have what you need to make the power.

Yes, I am TwinScroll T4 1.00 A/R

The exact Turbo is S300SX-E 8376 62mm (or what people call the S262) The 8376 at the end of their product name throws people off because it isn't a 83/76.

Also note, If you aren't set on the BW, look into Garrett. Specifically GTX3582R or around there. I am serious. They might not come in T.S. (maybe they do) but they spool faster, and make more power than the BW... just double the cost lol. Had I go back, I would have spent the extra money on that and a CD block
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Old 11-10-2016, 07:16 PM   #11
TCX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stags4 View Post
Awesome, sounds like you have what you need to make the power.

Yes, I am TwinScroll T4 1.00 A/R

The exact Turbo is S300SX-E 8376 62mm (or what people call the S262) The 8376 at the end of their product name throws people off because it isn't a 83/76.

Also note, If you aren't set on the BW, look into Garrett. Specifically GTX3582R or around there. I am serious. They might not come in T.S. (maybe they do) but they spool faster, and make more power than the BW... just double the cost lol. Had I go back, I would have spent the extra money on that and a CD block
I may do that down the road lol we get too good of a deal on borg warner stuff though
So i guess im doing the s362 with .91 ts turbine housing
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Old 11-11-2016, 04:14 PM   #12
WhatTurboLag?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TCX View Post
nice when are you seeing full boost?

and the spool valve goes on a non twin scroll manifold correct?
I havent looked into them much, just heard of them
I don't know exactly yet as I'm pushing coolant, but I see about 15 pounds before 3500 rpm in 4th.


And yes it's a t4 single scroll up pipe, stock manifold stock unopened motor. And a spool valve to a divided turbo.


It also makes the car a LOT quieter at idle and cursing/low boost/no boost situations.
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Old 11-14-2016, 02:59 PM   #13
STiSomeday
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stags4 View Post
I hate to say it but the S257sx-e can't get you there. I had one and was going to be in the mid 400's with E85 @ 27psi. Now, you could boost more than me, but you aren't picking up almost 300whp.

I recommend (as others have and it's the turbo I run) the S362 (or the one bigger).
I make 550/460 on e85 @ 27 psi. With more boost (and the complementary mods) I can hit 650/500 easy. Full boost comes in at 4500 rpm which is nice for driving around town.
My daily tune (93) is very conservative and it's 420/360 @ 20 psi.

So things I didn't do, which you might want to do (and I should have as well). Port the heads, PW intake manifold with FWD facing TB, beast fuel system. That and the fact you can boost more than me, should put you over your 650 on E85 or 93+meth (pending what dyno).

My build is below.
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2788322
Dyno differences always throw off comparisons, my S257 setup made 429whp at 24 psi on Pure's Mustang dyno. 500-600 on e85 is doable on that dyno. I agree that 600+ on aS257 is a stretch, though, and you'd be putting a lot of stress on the turbo and engine to get there. The bigger S362 makes sense all-around.

I also agree on wishing I had done a reverse manifold setup and porting the heads. I also wish I would have gone for a different set of aftermarket cams instead of putting the stock ones back in. Tomei Procams or BC's would have netted a considerable power/torque increase on my setup, all other things being equal.
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