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View Poll Results: What would you do?
Go hybrid 7 77.78%
Drop in pistons and call it a day 2 22.22%
Voters: 9. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-18-2010, 12:43 PM   #1
Tut4u2
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Default Need hybrid or not advice

After reading through endless threads I'm still no closer to making a decision as to what I should do. My tensioner broke this weekend and my valves high-fived my pistons.

I have already bought new S20 heads with Cower S2 cams, valves, retainers, springs, etc.

I don't know whether I should drop pistons into my current 2.0L (Wiseco pistons that will bump my compression to 8.4) or use an 2.5L block that I have access to. The 2.5L is an EJ251 with STi pistons and rods, and ACL race bearings. It has zero miles on it and its been spec'ed so everything is good with it.

If I re-use my block I would just drop in the pistons and go from there. My block has ~80K on it. I don't feel like taking it apart installing bearings.

What I use my car for: its my DD, I auto-x a couple of times a year, but I do more track days. Car will have a 16G initially, but I might do an 18G later on; turbo will not be larger than an 18G. I plan on revving to 7.5k.

What would you do?
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Old 10-18-2010, 01:41 PM   #2
wrxwhat
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I'd go hybrid.
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Old 10-18-2010, 02:59 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by wrxwhat View Post
I'd go hybrid.

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Old 10-18-2010, 06:45 PM   #4
25rsti
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go hybrid with forged pistons
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Old 10-18-2010, 06:55 PM   #5
kellygnsd
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I'd do the hybrid too. My old hybrid w/ 8cm^2 18G was too fun. Great lowdown torque on demand
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Old 10-18-2010, 07:04 PM   #6
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get an EJ257 block and send the heads to EQ Tuning to have the chambers CNC'd to match the STi chambers. That is the proper way to do a hybrid. More power, more reliability

Any other way is half ass and a ticking time bomb.
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Old 10-18-2010, 07:59 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power

Any other way is half ass and a ticking time bomb.
Well ain't that a bunch of horse ****. There are plenty running around and are just fine. One that we built is over 70k on it an still running fine. Mine has over 20k and runs great
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Old 10-18-2010, 08:02 PM   #8
Tut4u2
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Not planning on sending the heads off for any work; I would drop in pistons before I got the heads re-machined.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kellygnsd View Post
I'd do the hybrid too. My old hybrid w/ 8cm^2 18G was too fun. Great lowdown torque on demand
What kind of power did you put down? Do you have a graph of your curve?
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Old 10-18-2010, 08:05 PM   #9
Maxwell Power
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Originally Posted by sidewayz View Post
Well ain't that a bunch of horse ****.
no.

just because you did it that way doesn't mean it's the best way. There are a mess of issues and limitations by just dropping a big bore on a small combustion chamber. If you don't know or understand it, don't waste time arguing it.

The success rate of hybrids is lower than any other build.
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Old 10-18-2010, 08:08 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tut4u2 View Post
Not planning on sending the heads off for any work; I would drop in pistons before I got the heads re-machined.

suit yourself. half ass is half ass.

Hell, I'm not even telling you to send them to MY shop to get work done. I'm just giving you sound advice. I have nothing to gain by you doing it either way.

There is the right way, the half ass way and the wrong way.

400 dollars for some machine work is the best hp/$ that you'll spend. It deshrouds the valves, raises the hp potential of the heads dramatically, lowers the compression ratio and increases reliability. Why wouldn't someone do it? There are ZERO negatives.
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Old 10-18-2010, 08:36 PM   #11
rexworx
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I agree with Dom 100%, if youdont want to spend the extra money on the cc work, then sell the heads and buy a set of 2.5 heads.
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Old 10-18-2010, 08:39 PM   #12
kellygnsd
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AYour cnc work is only $400 now. I thought it was a grand?
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Old 10-18-2010, 08:46 PM   #13
Jubert39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
suit yourself. half ass is half ass.

Hell, I'm not even telling you to send them to MY shop to get work done. I'm just giving you sound advice. I have nothing to gain by you doing it either way.

There is the right way, the half ass way and the wrong way.

400 dollars for some machine work is the best hp/$ that you'll spend. It deshrouds the valves, raises the hp potential of the heads dramatically, lowers the compression ratio and increases reliability. Why wouldn't someone do it? There are ZERO negatives.
So you do it for 400? Cus I was quoted this (cheapest I found so far)
It's $175 extra for me to chamber reshape during a valve job.
So:
Valve Job $350
Chamber Deshroud $175
Total $525 for the pair.
You will still need to shim your valves afterwards.
I offer valve adjustment during a valve job for an additional $180 but you do not have to buy any shims.
So plug and play would be $705

Thanks
Joe

My question really is, how much will it cost in the end (before shipping), to have my heads done so I can just "bolt on"

you can PM me instead if you'd like
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Old 10-19-2010, 12:15 PM   #14
erikos
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
no.

just because you did it that way doesn't mean it's the best way. If you don't know or understand it, don't waste time arguing it.
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Old 10-19-2010, 12:32 PM   #15
polskaboys
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Im doing a hybrid right now an sent my heads to EQ tuning cause i want to do the build the right way. why put soo much money into something that wont last you over sooo many miles. be on the safe side.
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Old 10-19-2010, 02:15 PM   #16
Maxwell Power
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kellygnsd View Post
AYour cnc work is only $400 now. I thought it was a grand?
CNC Porting was over a grand. EQ Tuning does the combustion chamber work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jubert39 View Post
So you do it for 400? Cus I was quoted this (cheapest I found so far)
It's $175 extra for me to chamber reshape during a valve job.
So:
Valve Job $350
Chamber Deshroud $175
Total $525 for the pair.
You will still need to shim your valves afterwards.
I offer valve adjustment during a valve job for an additional $180 but you do not have to buy any shims.
So plug and play would be $705

Thanks
Joe

My question really is, how much will it cost in the end (before shipping), to have my heads done so I can just "bolt on"

you can PM me instead if you'd like
You can do the chambers without doing a valve job of any sort as the chamber work doesn't affect the valve seats or any valve geometry. If you need a valve job anyway then obviously do them all at the same time.

EQ Tuning does the chamber work. I thought it was 400 but it could be 500. Regardless, it's an additional 400-500 (+shipping) to whatever else you need to do.

I can assure you, even if it cost 1000 for the chamber work, it's worth every penny. The increase in power output AND reliability is substantial.
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Old 10-19-2010, 03:07 PM   #17
Jubert39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
CNC Porting was over a grand. EQ Tuning does the combustion chamber work.



You can do the chambers without doing a valve job of any sort as the chamber work doesn't affect the valve seats or any valve geometry. If you need a valve job anyway then obviously do them all at the same time.

EQ Tuning does the chamber work. I thought it was 400 but it could be 500. Regardless, it's an additional 400-500 (+shipping) to whatever else you need to do.

I can assure you, even if it cost 1000 for the chamber work, it's worth every penny. The increase in power output AND reliability is substantial.
so in the previous post, you said your shop does it. If so, do you charge the $400? If so I might be an interested customer. I DO realize it DOES help, but bottom line is I have little money, and still have to buy all the other parts, aka, water pump, gaskets, t-belt, tstat, etc... all those little bastards add up lol.
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Old 10-19-2010, 03:53 PM   #18
Maxwell Power
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
get an EJ257 block and send the heads to EQ Tuning to have the chambers CNC'd to match the STi chambers. That is the proper way to do a hybrid. More power, more reliability
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power View Post
suit yourself. half ass is half ass.

Hell, I'm not even telling you to send them to MY shop to get work done. I'm just giving you sound advice. I have nothing to gain by you doing it either way.

I think you are mistaken.

I was saying that I'm not trying to sell you anything because I send mine to EQ Tuning too.
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Old 10-19-2010, 07:11 PM   #19
sidewayz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxwell Power

no.

just because you did it that way doesn't mean it's the best way. There are a mess of issues and limitations by just dropping a big bore on a small combustion chamber. If you don't know or understand it, don't waste time arguing it.

The success rate of hybrids is lower than any other build.
I understand there are issues and limitations but I would not consider it half assed.

I see more failures off half assed "regular" builds vs. Hybrids


But agree to disagree. It's the op's choice as to what to do.

Remember I never said not to cnc the heads, I also never said not doing it was stupid. People have been doing it this way for a long long time
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Old 10-20-2010, 08:45 PM   #20
lcjarrett
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Go Hybrid!!! I did!!!
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Old 10-20-2010, 09:36 PM   #21
Tut4u2
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I decided to go the hybrid route..will post up the results and impressions when I dyno the car.
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Old 10-21-2010, 03:05 AM   #22
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I decided to go the hybrid route..will post up the results and impressions when I dyno the car.




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