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Old 04-14-2013, 08:19 PM   #2626
MRF582
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bettner12 View Post
Because both a -8 and a -10 fitting can use the same threads on the other side of the fittings.
Sure, but the fitting on the can, can only be of one size. If a male fitting on the can is -8AN, you can only connect a -8AN female fitting to it. If a male fitting on the can is -10AN, you can only connect a -10AN female fitting to it. The other end of both of these fittings can be whatever. 1/2" 3/4" etc. But your flow is limited by the smaller of the Inner Diameters. So if the fitting on the can is -8AN then it doesn't matter if the other side is bigger. You're restricted to the flow characteristics of a -8AN port aka 1/2" hose ID. -12AN is equivalent to 3/4" hose ID.

So, what is the size of the smaller male fitting on the Element can? Is it -8AN or -10AN?
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Last edited by MRF582; 04-14-2013 at 08:27 PM.
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Old 04-14-2013, 08:53 PM   #2627
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If I had to guess, the element can is designed around ideal operation under boost for the type of cars element builds / tunes.

Most of element's customers are running large rotated turbos with shorty 4" intakes. Because of that, there's no vacuum source when you're under boost.

Why risk ingesting oil into the intake tract? If your goal is to build a separator that works perfect at high boost and has no points of failure, then venting to atmo is a good way to go.
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Old 04-14-2013, 09:26 PM   #2628
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Originally Posted by MRF582 View Post
So, what is the size of the smaller male fitting on the Element can? Is it -8AN or -10AN?

The element can is -12 and -10. You can place an adapter on the -10 to connect a -8 hose.
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Old 04-14-2013, 09:28 PM   #2629
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I sure do love me a smoke and mirrors show.

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Old 04-14-2013, 09:35 PM   #2630
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I took this picture tonight of the contents of my Element can. I placed this gunk in a jar a few years ago and kept it in the garage to compare how much liquid was collected during future oil changes. This represents 3000 miles of driving on my STOCK motor. The scary thing here is that the salsa that was originally in that jar was purchased in 2009 and the label says "best buy Jan 12, 2017" !!!

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Old 04-14-2013, 09:44 PM   #2631
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I did the same with mine. But with the new element tuning motor. Drained it once after break in and now I do the same after every oil change but its empty every time and oil is exactly the same amount that I put in it.
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Old 04-14-2013, 09:48 PM   #2632
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You didn't eat that ****....did you? LOL That's just scary, the salsa I mean!

In all seriousness, that's why I like the heated design of the Crawford, it minimizes the condensation so that it can get pulled back through the intake and not lay in the can and clog it up! No PVC and some vacuum draw from the intake!
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Old 04-14-2013, 09:51 PM   #2633
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I think the can is baffled so one could put a 90 fitting on the top and recirc it to the intake. I could be wrong though. From what I remember it is baffled. It's not as though the cans are that complex. You could also get the benefit of using the coolant for evaporation if you do a drainback by simply bolting it to the coolant reservoir or closer or as close to the turbo as possible.

Mrf you crack me up. I got your point from your first question, but you really like to make sure that it is clear lol
I feel that the Crawford can is overpriced, but I see your point about repackaging.
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Old 04-14-2013, 09:53 PM   #2634
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You didn't eat that ****....did you? LOL That's just scary, the salsa I mean!!
I did.
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Old 04-14-2013, 09:57 PM   #2635
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Originally Posted by bboylocob View Post
I did the same with mine. But with the new element tuning motor. Drained it once after break in and now I do the same after every oil change but its empty every time and oil is exactly the same amount that I put in it.

Thats exactly my experience as well. Every time I have drained the can I have gotten a thimble full of liquid, a table spool maybe. I assume that means there's far less blow by on these motors. Its strange that a small two man shop in Maryland can assemble a motor with forged pistons and so little blow by yet a massive international company cant come close with cast pistons.
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Old 04-14-2013, 11:23 PM   #2636
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dexterous View Post

Thats exactly my experience as well. Every time I have drained the can I have gotten a thimble full of liquid, a table spool maybe. I assume that means there's far less blow by on these motors. Its strange that a small two man shop in Maryland can assemble a motor with forged pistons and so little blow by yet a massive international company cant come close with cast pistons.
Yeap.


Its funny how people on here will talk big but can't back it up . But when a company like element tuning comes in and states stuff people try to rip it apart. But get shut up when facts are put up. And then u hear there excesses as to why they stated there opinions as facts or as to why they stated what they said.
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Old 04-14-2013, 11:27 PM   #2637
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Originally Posted by reid-o View Post
Mrf you crack me up. I got your point from your first question, but you really like to make sure that it is clear lol
First they said the Peterson can isn't -12. That was proven to be wrong.
Then Phil, himself, contradicts his own website while talking the Peterson can down. Again, disproven.

I wouldn't have posted about this so much if misinformation wasn't spewed out in an attempt to make the Element can look superior. If they had just stuck to 'yeah, we rebadged/resold but added value by including everything in one box etc.' I would've let it go. But hey, if people want to pay double for -10 vs -8, then it's their money not mine. Just don't play the smoke and mirrors game.

But since I'm a skeptic, I'd like verification the Element can's smaller port is -10 and not -8. So Tom, at the next meet, I'll bring my calipers and you bring your Element can (bring your car too! ).

Also Tom, you collected that much water because you aren't pulling a vacuum nor returning the oil to the sump. If you really think that 'gunk' would've ended up in your oil and stayed there then you are forgetting that oil temps get high enough to burn the water off. Also, you should call up BMW and Porsche and tell them they're doing it wrong...
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Old 04-14-2013, 11:42 PM   #2638
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Originally Posted by MRF582 View Post
First they said the Peterson can isn't -12. That was proven to be wrong.
Then Phil, himself, contradicts his own website while talking the Peterson can down. Again, disproven.

I wouldn't have posted about this so much if misinformation wasn't spewed out in an attempt to make the Element can look superior. If they had just stuck to 'yeah, we rebadged/resold but added value by including everything in one box etc.' I would've let it go. But hey, if people want to pay double for -10 vs -8, then it's their money not mine. Just don't play the smoke and mirrors game.

But since I'm a skeptic, I'd like verification the Element can's smaller port is -10 and not -8. So Tom, at the next meet, I'll bring my calipers and you bring your Element can (bring your car too! ).

Also Tom, you collected that much water because you aren't pulling a vacuum nor returning the oil to the sump. If you really think that 'gunk' would've ended up in your oil and stayed there then you are forgetting that oil temps get high enough to burn the water off. Also, you should call up BMW and Porsche and tell them they're doing it wrong...
We don't care about the marketing if a can after the creator says they are custom made. Straight from the horses mouth, why wouldn't we believe him?

What I'm trying to get at, is pulling vacuum post catch can...

Buy one and measure it.
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Old 04-15-2013, 01:31 AM   #2639
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Originally Posted by bettner12 View Post
We don't care about the marketing if a can after the creator says they are custom made. Straight from the horses mouth, why wouldn't we believe him?

What I'm trying to get at, is pulling vacuum post catch can...

Buy one and measure it.
Because they were wrong on two counts on this very topic, that's why. Phil saying his can is 3.5" in diameter and the Peterson can is 2.5" in diameter when they are BOTH 3" in diameter. And then Tom saying the bigger port on the Peterson can is -10AN as compared to Element's can -12AN while in fact, the Peterson can has the same -12AN port. So 0 for 2.

But you're right, I should totally call up Phil and order a $300 can to take a measurement.
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Old 04-15-2013, 06:24 AM   #2640
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Originally Posted by MRF582 View Post
Because they were wrong on two counts on this very topic, that's why. Phil saying his can is 3.5" in diameter and the Peterson can is 2.5" in diameter when they are BOTH 3" in diameter. And then Tom saying the bigger port on the Peterson can is -10AN as compared to Element's can -12AN while in fact, the Peterson can has the same -12AN port. So 0 for 2.

But you're right, I should totally call up Phil and order a $300 can to take a measurement.
OH NO, SOMEONE ON THE INTERNET MIGHT BE WRONG!!!!! Stop then presses, post on twitter about it, call everyone you know!!!

It doesn't matter if some Gaelic speaking Irishmen extruded the catch can out of his butt, and sells it to both peterson and element, that's not what matters at all! I could care less if its the same diameter or not, that's not what matters AT ALL, and you know it. The Internet doesn't have a police force, and they are not hiring.

Does it work? Would it be better with vacuum applied? Those are the questions that are relevant to this discussion. If you want to make a big deal out of if Phil's can is really custom made or not, start your own thread about it, then back it up with empirical data.
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Old 04-15-2013, 09:46 AM   #2641
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I already backed it up with data. From Phil's own website even!

If you think a Vendor blowing smoke up someone's ass is not worthy of discussion, then that's fine. Go about your day and I'll go about mine. But don't tell me what's relevant to me and the discussion I want to have.

About your vacuum question, you need to step outside the Subaru world and see how others do it so you're not locked into thinking inside this box. That should answer your questions fairly well...
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Old 04-15-2013, 11:10 AM   #2642
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Just measured my element can the circumference is 11.35 inches which gives it a diameter of a lil over 3.5 inches
Or 3.6128 inches to be exact.

If u would like I can take a pick and show the math for u and post it up here
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Old 04-15-2013, 03:42 PM   #2643
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dexterous View Post
Thats exactly my experience as well. Every time I have drained the can I have gotten a thimble full of liquid, a table spool maybe. I assume that means there's far less blow by on these motors. Its strange that a small two man shop in Maryland can assemble a motor with forged pistons and so little blow by yet a massive international company cant come close with cast pistons.
I love reading this about Element while I sit here waiting for them to build my motor.

Subaru sell oil changes (through their stealerships)... blow by boosts sales.
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Old 04-15-2013, 04:19 PM   #2644
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Originally Posted by bboylocob View Post
Just measured my element can the circumference is 11.35 inches which gives it a diameter of a lil over 3.5 inches
Or 3.6128 inches to be exact.

If u would like I can take a pick and show the math for u and post it up here
Interesting. Wonder why his website says otherwise.
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Old 04-15-2013, 05:34 PM   #2645
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As I was saying in a previous post, so long as the can is adequately baffled, I don't see why the drain can't be connected as a drainback and the top filter be replaced with a fitting like this

To get the evaporative properties, you just need to mount it closer to the turbo or on the expansion tank. The aluminum will absorb the heat fairly quickly.
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Old 04-15-2013, 06:49 PM   #2646
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Can we focus on something besides a effing catch can / breather / vacuum bull****? People have beef with Element, they have a phone number, Phil is a user plenty of ways to contact phil to tell him how dumb him / element is if you feel that is right.

Tom chose them, trusts them and is appearingly happy with them. Lets just move onto the fact Tom is about to be ready to be ripping again.

good luck tom
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Old 04-15-2013, 06:56 PM   #2647
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Amen brother!!

Wishing you a successful completion and tuning with your build!
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Old 04-15-2013, 06:59 PM   #2648
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Interesting. Wonder why his website says otherwise.
Maybe an older design he had and upgraded to the 3.5 but didn't update site.
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Old 04-15-2013, 10:00 PM   #2649
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Maybe an older design he had and upgraded to the 3.5 but didn't update site.
Yes, this seems likely. Maybe he used to use the Peterson can but then made his own after he got a lot of flak back in 09.
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Old 04-17-2013, 08:35 PM   #2650
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I was actually with Phil (in person) while he was working on the kit for the 3.5" inch can. Its a newer rev as the older ones were 3". Looks like the website never got updated.
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