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View Poll Results: How much oil goes missing between oil changes?
Less then 1 ltr 15 33.33%
About 1 ltr 15 33.33%
1-2 ltr's 13 28.89%
3 or more ltr's 4 8.89%
I put a ltr or more in every fill-up 2 4.44%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 45. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-14-2013, 01:48 AM   #26
williaty
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The way Subaru advises breaking in the car is basically guaranteed to prevent the rings from ever sealing properly.

Also, I still want to know why the OP thinks it's not leaking.
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Old 04-04-2013, 01:27 AM   #27
smallv
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Default Things to check if you have high oil consumption

Quote:
Originally Posted by The G.O.A.T. View Post
I have a 2007 2.5 wagon and from day one there has been about 1-2lt of missing oil at every change. Just wondering what the average was for these cars.
I've owned subarus since 1995 and I've had a variety of oil consumption problems with each. I currently own a 2008 Forester and a 2008 Outback. The outback oil consumption has been very high since about year 2. I brought it in to the dealership on multiple occasions asking them to examine the oil consumption. On the last occasion, they observed some oil on the lower engine block but no apparent source such as a leaking gasket. Now that the car is out of warranty, I believe my non-dealership mechanic found what's been going wrong for years. I asked the mechanic for a compression test. When his team pulled out the first spark plug wire, they found it was soaked in oil. This was difficult to understand and he had to explain it a few times. The Subaru spark plugs sit in a recessed cavity that looks like a 1" diameter cylinder opening diagonally upwards. The Subaru spark plug wires terminate in a large rubber cylinder also about 1" in diameter and about almost six inches long. There is a seal at the top of the spark plug wire socket that keeps water and debris out of the six inch deep cylindrical cavity. The only way for oil to enter the cavity is through a seal that is close in proximity to the valve cover gasket but it is actually a different seal. If this seal leaks, engine oil can leak into the spark plug cavities. None of this oil reaches the ignition end of the spark plug, it sits between the porcelain of the spark plug and the cylindrical cavity that surrounds the external portion of the spark plug.

If you oil consumption is high, pull out each of the spark plug wires and look for oil. If there is oil there and you are under warrantee then you should be able to get this fixed for free. Itís the kind of thing you want to check as your car nears the end of its warrantee.

I was not there for the repair but I'm told it involved removing the Valve covers. I'm also told it was a very tricky job since the bolts were sized and there is very little room to work. The story goes that it took three mechanics, one with a torch, one pulling on the socket wrench from underneath and a third using a pry bar to pry against the frame of the car to hold the socket square and tight to the top of the bolts. They told me there was a high risk of twisting off the bolts. They ordered new bolts from the dealership due to the stress and rounding inflicted on the original bolts.

Assuming the bolts were not seized, I suspect the repair is as simple as removing several bolts and replacing several gaskets.

One more oil consumption tip is that I have learned not to trust the aluminum crush rings that seal between the oil plan and the oil drain plug. They leak if you over tighten them and they really leak if you get a non-dealership oil change and the mechanic fails to order a new crush ring. Its also a pain if you change your own oil because its easy to forget to order the part until you have already drained the oil.

So my work around is a metal/rubber oil plug gasket that can be ordered from Benson auto parts or from a Chrysler dealership. The Benson part is cheaper ($8 vs. $12). Both are oversized by 1mm. The gap is only a concern if the seal shifts to one side during tightening. To prevent that, I fill the gap by stretching an undersized O-ring around the base of the drain plug. You need to start with a relatively thin O-ring that is about half the diameter of the drain plug. As you stretch the small O-ring around the larger drain plug, the o-ring gets skinnier. A little bit of trial and error with an assorted O-ring set and you'll find the right ring to fill the 1mm gap. I'm not relying on the O-ring for a seal, only as a spacer to keep the rubber/steel seal well centered during the tightening process. The seal might actually be brass/rubber, I'm not sure. In any case, itís like a washer that has rubber a rubber bead bonded to the inner circumference.

The part ordering details are as follows:

Replacement part for 94 - 2001 dodge Ram Diesel
Chrysler Part number:
4882049
http://cgenterprises.com/chrysler_oem_numbers.htm


or:

FMS 2130 as a part number for Benson Automotive.

I suspect the source manufacturer and part number is

Dorman - Autograde Oil Drain Plug Gasket - Metal/Rubber Fits M20

Dorman Part numbers
097-133.1
or

097-133

However I had little luck with those part number unless I wanted to order 100 of them.

The Chrysler Option was convenient because they had the part there to pick up within 24 hours.

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Old 04-04-2013, 02:07 AM   #28
williaty
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Alternately, you could just pay the 92 cents for a Subaru OEM crush washer, torque it properly to 33lbf-ft and it will never, ever leak.
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Old 06-20-2013, 11:31 PM   #29
wdtrotter
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Default Valve Cover Change

Quote:

I was not there for the repair but I'm told it involved removing the Valve covers. I'm also told it was a very tricky job since the bolts were sized and there is very little room to work. The story goes that it took three mechanics, one with a torch, one pulling on the socket wrench from underneath and a third using a pry bar to pry against the frame of the car to hold the socket square and tight to the top of the bolts. They told me there was a high risk of twisting off the bolts. They ordered new bolts from the dealership due to the stress and rounding inflicted on the original bolts.


Assuming the bolts were not seized, I suspect the repair is as simple as removing several bolts and replacing several gaskets.
I replaced my Valve Cover Gaskets in April, it took me about 45 minutes for the passenger side and about 35 minutes for the driver side, to get the cover out from along the wheel well i just lightly jacked up the engine with a 2x4 under the oil pan. It only took about 1/4", also a set of 10mm racheting cresents make a world of difference. You can access the lower bolts by removing the plastic guard that is just inside of each front tire. BTW Wility thanks for all of the advice on the air filter with a snorkus and all, car has been running great. Put new Iridiums in when i did the gaskets and spark plug gaskets.
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Old 06-21-2013, 12:38 AM   #30
mctator
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My 2005 RS uses about 1.25 QT's per 1k miles and is getting worse. I'm preparing to re-ring the engine so we'll see if that helps it any.
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Old 06-21-2013, 01:12 AM   #31
williaty
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mctator View Post
My 2005 RS uses about 1.25 QT's per 1k miles and is getting worse. I'm preparing to re-ring the engine so we'll see if that helps it any.
Just re-ringing it probably won't help much.

The bores wear pretty seriously on the 05 blocks. Every bore I've ever checked past 100,000mi has been both oval and tapered top to bottom. You end up having to have the block re-bored for cylindrical, then measure the bores and order the oversized replacement pistons from Subaru, then have the block finish bored and honed to match the pistons, then put rings on it and break it in right (beat on it). It'll use 0 oil after that.
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Old 06-22-2013, 07:25 PM   #32
bluesubie
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About half a quart between changes at 5-6k mile intervals in my daughter's 2000 RS. Currently has 125k miles on it and purchased it with 60k on it. In the past it got Max Life 5W-30 and now it gets Pennzoil Conventional High Mileage 5W-30.

Wife's previous 99 Outback had similar consumption running the same oils and intervals.

-Dennis
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Old 06-22-2013, 09:15 PM   #33
Back Road Runner
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Oem crush washer...too tight.

Hmm, I must have been over tightening my bolt every time by a rather significant margin. I tend to put my weight into it, lol. I have yet to see any oil leak on several Subarus I've owned. I've never replaced a metal crush washer...ever...on any car I've ever owned.

I'm confused.


Oil consumption varies and leaks can be from many, many things. It's not easy to say why the consumption exists without actually digging into the car and finding the problem. It can leak by the pistons. It can leak by the valves. It can leak through the breather lines. It can leak by seals/gaskets. Some gets burned up. Some drips on the ground. Some even makes it into your coolant system (and visa versa).

As a general rule, a worn engine will burn more. An engine that is used hard will burn more. It kind of depends on how you use the car. I have an engine that can burn a quart in a day that it can burn in 3000 miles simply by how the car is used.

You can often reduce consumption by stepping to a thicker "hot" viscosity. By this I mean stepping from a 5w30 to a 5w40. In my experience consumption about halves per level. As williaty said years ago, it's not the cold weight that matters. A 0w30 is still very thick cold, but it's better than a 5w30 or 10w30 in winter climates because it isn't as thick cold as those other oils despite still being quite thick versus when hot. You can get up to a 0w50 if you want it. You can also get 10w60 if you need it. I have not found a 5w60 yet. Eneos makes a 0w50, great for worn, loose engines, and great for year round use. If your engine is shot, you try to step to a 40 weight and see what happens. Then you step to a 50 weight and see what happens. Eventually consumption gets low enough that it's quite normal and doesn't foul out your air/fuel sensor every month (one of the more expensive aspects of owning an oil burning engine).

I should note that higher viscosity may be good for minimizing consumption, but it also reduced flow volume of oil through the engine. Thick oil is good for shear resistance but not good for cooling. You need flow volume to cool, so thin is good...if you can get away with it. If you can use a 30 weight, use a 30 weight. Step to thicker only based on need. Eventually you do have to rebuild the engine, but these thicker oils can get consumption down low enough to where it's liveable. I should also note that thicker oil helps reduce leaks everywhere, just a note.
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