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Old 02-10-2011, 12:15 AM   #26
phread
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Originally Posted by smdandb2 View Post
If you want to use pro lenses on your cheap body -> Canon (not so much an opinion as it is fact)
I'm guessing you're basing this on the newer low end cameras not supporting the old style AF/AF-D focusing. But all the pro lenses introduced since 1996 (and many since 1992) are AF-I/AF-S and do work just fine with the lower end cameras. Nikon hasn't introduced a new non AF-S in close to 10 years.

You can mount up and use any F mount lens that Nikon has made since 1959 on a low end Nikon DSLR (minus a few old exotic fisheye lenses that require mirror lockup)

No canon lens made before 1987 will mount on any canon DSLR.
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Old 02-10-2011, 01:34 AM   #27
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this is laughable... please explain to me what it leads nikon in? The only thing I can think of is 60fps in video and swivel screens....

If you want better image quality -> Nikon
If you want better autofocus -> Nikon

If you want a swivel screen -> Canon
If you want 60 fps in video -> Canon

Nikon makes the highest MP camera, D3x... Nikon makes the best high ISO camera, D3s.... Nikon has a lot of the functions of the D3 in its two smaller bodies (D700 and D300 (which includes the same autofocus)).... There are many things nikon cameras have have had as far as functions that are JUST starting to be put in canon cameras (time lapse, auto-iso in manual mode, multiple exposures, virtual horizon inside the viewfinder, etc)...

Nikon has had a huge advantage over canon with gadgets, functionality, ergo, settings, and ease of use, while canon kept upping their MP. The sad thing for nikon is that their new cameras dont seem to be very inovative, while canon has caught up to them with the functionality, nikon hasnt been doing much to stay in front. It is a back and forth battle, and I am sure canon will do things in the next couple years to put them ahead of nikon.... and in a couple more years nikon will go ahead again.
Yeah, my 7D has many of the same features as the camera's you mentioned, even the auto focus system of my 7d is comparable with a separate processor just for focusing. I payed $1600 for my camera new.... Thats thousands less than other camera's with the same features... Again, the 7D isn't full frame. But combined with my canon EF-S 15-85mm lens, I am completely satisfied with the images I can capture with the crop sensor.

It does come to personal opinion. And my opinion is yes, canon will lead again when they release 5D MarkIII this year. It will have an upgraded version of the auto focus of the 7d with a 28MP full frame sensor. That will be my next Camera.

I like both brands, but I chose Canon.

Yay for pissing wars...

And on me for commenting again
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Old 02-10-2011, 03:48 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by smdandb2 View Post
What you speak of is 99% personal opinion.

If you want a better lenses -> Canon
If you want to use pro lenses on your cheap body -> Canon (not so much an opinion as it is fact)
Quote:
Originally Posted by phread View Post
I'm guessing you're basing this on the newer low end cameras not supporting the old style AF/AF-D focusing. But all the pro lenses introduced since 1996 (and many since 1992) are AF-I/AF-S and do work just fine with the lower end cameras. Nikon hasn't introduced a new non AF-S in close to 10 years.

You can mount up and use any F mount lens that Nikon has made since 1959 on a low end Nikon DSLR (minus a few old exotic fisheye lenses that require mirror lockup)

No canon lens made before 1987 will mount on any canon DSLR.
What he said...

And also, canon has better lenses? Which lenses are you talking about? I would say they are almost all comparable at this stage. Nikon released updated fast primes this year, which was really their only hole in their lineup....

if you want to talk about "pro" lenses that are better.... how about the 24-70 that destroy's canon's counterpart.... then there are the legendary 14-24 and 200-400 that many canon users use adapters because canon doesnt offer them (200-400 f4 is coming out this year though). all the other pro lenses (minus the 800mm which nikon doesnt offer) are quite comparable, and it is a toss up as to which ones are better.


I am more curious about what "fact" that you are talking about with the lenses is... Virtually all of the lenses can be used on the cheapest nikon camera! More specifically, you wont find any pro lenses without an autofocus motor in the lens! it is only extremely outdated lenses that do not have a motor in the lens that cannot be used on the 2 cheapest nikon bodies. Maybe what you meant to say was "You cannot use the autofocus feature on lenses from the 1980's with the 2 cheapest nikon bodies"

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Originally Posted by roloc31 View Post
Yeah, my 7D has many of the same features as the camera's you mentioned, even the auto focus system of my 7d is comparable with a separate processor just for focusing. I payed $1600 for my camera new.... Thats thousands less than other camera's with the same features... Again, the 7D isn't full frame. But combined with my canon EF-S 15-85mm lens, I am completely satisfied with the images I can capture with the crop sensor.

It does come to personal opinion. And my opinion is yes, canon will lead again when they release 5D MarkIII this year. It will have an upgraded version of the auto focus of the 7d with a 28MP full frame sensor. That will be my next Camera.

I like both brands, but I chose Canon.

Yay for pissing wars...

And on me for commenting again
I bought a used D700 (which came out 3 years ago) for 1800 last fall, and it has as all the features (and much more) of your 7d. my D300 cost 1500 new when I bought that which was 2.5 years ago. So in fact, the cameras that I have cost roughly the same as yours..... hardly thousands more expensive (and in one case, cheaper!).

We will check back at years end to see how the new cameras are, but Canon needs to have something better than the 7d autofocus in their 5dmrk3.... the 7d isnt as good as the d700 and d300 autofocus, and the new nikon replacements will have a better autofocus than those.
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Old 02-10-2011, 05:04 PM   #29
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Ill let you know what I think when it arrives next week....
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Old 02-11-2011, 02:27 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by Dragicon View Post
What he said...

And also, canon has better lenses? Which lenses are you talking about? I would say they are almost all comparable at this stage. Nikon released updated fast primes this year, which was really their only hole in their lineup....

if you want to talk about "pro" lenses that are better.... how about the 24-70 that destroy's canon's counterpart.... then there are the legendary 14-24 and 200-400 that many canon users use adapters because canon doesnt offer them (200-400 f4 is coming out this year though). all the other pro lenses (minus the 800mm which nikon doesnt offer) are quite comparable, and it is a toss up as to which ones are better.


I am more curious about what "fact" that you are talking about with the lenses is... Virtually all of the lenses can be used on the cheapest nikon camera! More specifically, you wont find any pro lenses without an autofocus motor in the lens! it is only extremely outdated lenses that do not have a motor in the lens that cannot be used on the 2 cheapest nikon bodies. Maybe what you meant to say was "You cannot use the autofocus feature on lenses from the 1980's with the 2 cheapest nikon bodies"



I bought a used D700 (which came out 3 years ago) for 1800 last fall, and it has as all the features (and much more) of your 7d. my D300 cost 1500 new when I bought that which was 2.5 years ago. So in fact, the cameras that I have cost roughly the same as yours..... hardly thousands more expensive (and in one case, cheaper!).

We will check back at years end to see how the new cameras are, but Canon needs to have something better than the 7d autofocus in their 5dmrk3.... the 7d isnt as good as the d700 and d300 autofocus, and the new nikon replacements will have a better autofocus than those.
I was referring to the camera's you mentioned in your post. the D700 competes with the 5dmarkII, because it is full frame. The d300 is more in the same field as the 7D. And if you compare apple to apples, the 7D comes out on top. http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon_EOS_7D-vs-Nikon_D300

And just for fun: http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon_EO...-vs-Nikon_D700

70% more res on the 5d markII over the d700 is pretty important in my book. Although the AF sucks on the 5d compared to the nikon, the 5D does awesome as a portrait camera. Plus its a pretty sweet bragging spot that the 5D MarkII shot the last season of 24 and the entire last episode of House last year. For a camera, thats pretty impressive.

Yes, Nikon has a great auto focusing system, but according to all reviews I've read to date, the 7d 19 point AF system out performs the d300's 51 point AF.

But it still comes down to opinion. And you obviously are very Nikon Bias and don't know much about Canon, as I found out in the few PM's we shared last year when I asked a few canon questions. I chose the 7D after renting the d300s and the 7D because I liked the way it handled better than the d300s and the speed and AF was more what I was looking for. Plus 18MP with very similar low light noise performance as the 12mp on the Nikon was very impressive to me. I used both back to back for 2 days each and shot about 2000 pictures each while I was testing them.

I liked both cameras. 7d just worked better for me. Don't take it so personal. Both brands have their strengths and work better for different people. People pay me good money for my pictures because they like them, and that is the result I wanted. I am less concerned about the route that gets me there, as long as I get there.
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Old 02-11-2011, 03:34 AM   #31
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I was referring to the camera's you mentioned in your post. the D700 competes with the 5dmarkII, because it is full frame. The d300 is more in the same field as the 7D. And if you compare apple to apples, the 7D comes out on top. http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon_EOS_7D-vs-Nikon_D300

And just for fun: http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon_EO...-vs-Nikon_D700

70% more res on the 5d markII over the d700 is pretty important in my book. Although the AF sucks on the 5d compared to the nikon, the 5D does awesome as a portrait camera. Plus its a pretty sweet bragging spot that the 5D MarkII shot the last season of 24 and the entire last episode of House last year. For a camera, thats pretty impressive.

Yes, Nikon has a great auto focusing system, but according to all reviews I've read to date, the 7d 19 point AF system out performs the d300's 51 point AF.

But it still comes down to opinion. And you obviously are very Nikon Bias and don't know much about Canon, as I found out in the few PM's we shared last year when I asked a few canon questions. I chose the 7D after renting the d300s and the 7D because I liked the way it handled better than the d300s and the speed and AF was more what I was looking for. Plus 18MP with very similar low light noise performance as the 12mp on the Nikon was very impressive to me. I used both back to back for 2 days each and shot about 2000 pictures each while I was testing them.

I liked both cameras. 7d just worked better for me. Don't take it so personal. Both brands have their strengths and work better for different people. People pay me good money for my pictures because they like them, and that is the result I wanted. I am less concerned about the route that gets me there, as long as I get there.
links to said reviews about the better autofocus? Your links are comparing a 1 year old camera to a 3 year old camera... which was one of my points in the first place. Nikon has had the features that Canon has JUST put in their DSLRs. The links you provided for the d300 show that image quality is a toss up, and that really, the whole camera in general is a toss up between the two. The d7000 has similar features and performance to the 7d, and comes in at $1100....

I'm not taking it personal... My dad shoots canon, and so do my friends. But to say that "canon beats nikon in features" is probably the worst argument or least accurate statement you could ever say. Nikon was lagging a lot in camera optics before the d3, d700, d300, so one of Nikon's selling points was to have features and cool things built into the camera. Once they stepped it up with their sensors, that really put everything to rest. Nikon will be completing its camera line this year (new d5000, new d400, new d3, new d700), and it will be interesting to see what they come out with.

out of curiousity, what do you shoot professionally? weddings?
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Old 02-11-2011, 03:50 AM   #32
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70% more res on the 5d markII over the d700 is pretty important in my book. Although the AF sucks on the 5d compared to the nikon, the 5D does awesome as a portrait camera. Plus its a pretty sweet bragging spot that the 5D MarkII shot the last season of 24 and the entire last episode of House last year. For a camera, thats pretty impressive.

But it still comes down to opinion. And you obviously are very Nikon Bias and don't know much about Canon, as I found out in the few PM's we shared last year when I asked a few canon questions.
So if I am reading your post correctly... resolution is the important camera feature. Image quality, low noise, high iso, and autofocus are all not so important features.

for a portrait camera, you want tack sharp autofocusing... something that the 5dmrk2 doesnt offer.

You mean when you PM'd me and I said I couldnt recommend a canon lens to for you to buy? I assumed you wanted opinions based on somebody who has actually used the lenses.... which I dont have a lot of experience with. To say that "i dont know much about canon" is far from the truth. My dad uses a 5dmrk2, and one of my "mentors (for a lack of a better word)" uses the 5dmrk2... I have a lot of experience with the camera.
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Old 02-11-2011, 03:51 AM   #33
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^ 28 weeks last year dude, mainly PROC, but time in Singas, Japan, Taiwan blah blah,,, I just moved departments so I can stay at home with the 4 kids,, been heavily on the road for 10+ years.
Fair enough, but if you ever make it out to hong kong or anywhere in China, shoot me a PM!
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Old 02-11-2011, 02:42 PM   #34
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I suppose I am a bit out of the Nikon loop. I use a friends Nikon gear a lot (just to play with) and he has a lot of the older pro lenses that require the focus motor in the body.

As for lenses, I still think Canon has a more complete line up, especially in the primes.

My 70-200 F/2.8 is farking great, as is my 24-70 and 17-40. All of them are incredibly sharp with great colors. The 50 1.2 on my 7D was possibly my favorite combo ever... I wish I didnt have to give the lens back.

Hell, my bodies work great too. In the end features don't mean ****... its all about the shooter and what you are shooting. I still bust out badass pictures with my old 5D.

Getting suckered into the whole features/mp game is stupid. I would say a good majority of people buying cameras these days still have no idea how to use 90% of the features.

This is kind of like the whole nVidia/ATI debate. You have fanbois on both sides, but in the end a new consumer can't go wrong going either direction. At any point in time one company will be one up on the other. In a few months(years), it all changes. And this cycle keeps going back and forth. Canon had a few years of dominance, and now it is Nikons turn. It's just a cycle...

As I said before, if I didnt have so much invested in all my camera gear I would not be loyal to Canon or any other brand.
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Old 02-11-2011, 02:46 PM   #35
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So if I am reading your post correctly... resolution is the important camera feature. Image quality, low noise, high iso, and autofocus are all not so important features.

for a portrait camera, you want tack sharp autofocusing... something that the 5dmrk2 doesnt offer.

You mean when you PM'd me and I said I couldnt recommend a canon lens to for you to buy? I assumed you wanted opinions based on somebody who has actually used the lenses.... which I dont have a lot of experience with. To say that "i dont know much about canon" is far from the truth. My dad uses a 5dmrk2, and one of my "mentors (for a lack of a better word)" uses the 5dmrk2... I have a lot of experience with the camera.
I think raw resolution is only important to a small market share.

I share your sentiments... give me quality over size.

From the day Canon released the specs of the MKII I knew I would never buy one. To me it is a joke of a camera. The autofocus system on the original 5D sucked horrible... and it just appauls me they used it in the MKII. I think that was entirely a decision by bean counters. They did not want the 5DMKII to touch 1D sales, so they intentionally crippled it big time.

Sure it had high resolution and primative video, but that just was not that huge of a deal to me.
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