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Old 07-29-2011, 02:32 PM   #2276
30 psi
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Just saw it on IWSTI

As expected no major changes for 2012


Now lets move on to 2013\14 and 15 lol
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Old 07-29-2011, 02:56 PM   #2277
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Credeur01 View Post
That seems more reasonable than just calling the car an "STI". You don't see Benz making a car just called "AMG". It's (for all practical purposes) a trim level.
SLS-AMG.

It is ONLY an AMG, and there is no non-AMG model. Without the historic nod to the SLS class moniker, it would just be called AMG.
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Old 07-29-2011, 03:06 PM   #2278
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Originally Posted by HipToBeSquare View Post
SLS-AMG.

It is ONLY an AMG, and there is no non-AMG model. Without the historic nod to the SLS class moniker, it would just be called AMG.
You realize you just proved his point. He said WRX STI is better than just STI.

The Mercedes is an SLS that only comes in AMG trim. It'd be the same as if the WRX only came in STI trim.
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Old 07-29-2011, 03:23 PM   #2279
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Default 2012 Official

For those who don't like searching:

http://www.iwsti.com/forums/subaru-n...-official.html
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Old 07-29-2011, 03:57 PM   #2280
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geddesk2 View Post
For those who don't like searching:

http://www.iwsti.com/forums/subaru-n...-official.html
That looks like it's from Subaru of Canada, not SOA (which is why Subarunet.com doesn't have it up yet). Check the spelling of "colored."

Bob
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Old 07-29-2011, 04:01 PM   #2281
30 psi
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Yep Canada
Google Ted Lalka and youll see hes from the Bacon country.
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Old 07-29-2011, 04:03 PM   #2282
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Originally Posted by 30 psi View Post
Yep Canada
Google Ted Lalka and youll see hes from the Bacon country.
HAM!!
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Old 07-29-2011, 04:19 PM   #2283
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Light bezels are subject to regulations?

And Facebook on dashboard? Oh Lord. Mind you it will be the most useful post-crash piece of evidence ever.

"status update: Pulling strong at 121mph! Woohoo! Oh sh.."
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Old 07-29-2011, 04:28 PM   #2284
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lol ha ha
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Old 07-29-2011, 04:58 PM   #2285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rsholland View Post
That looks like it's from Subaru of Canada, not SOA (which is why Subarunet.com doesn't have it up yet). Check the spelling of "colored."

Bob
Oh your right! I thought it was strange that it mentioned the sport tech option as that has been an available trim in Canada for quite sometime.
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Old 07-29-2011, 07:53 PM   #2286
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Cool

That was a pretty good episode!
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Old 07-30-2011, 10:04 AM   #2287
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefoton View Post
Light bezels are subject to regulations?

And Facebook on dashboard? Oh Lord. Mind you it will be the most useful post-crash piece of evidence ever.

"status update: Pulling strong at 121mph! Woohoo! Oh sh.."
Ha...
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Old 07-30-2011, 10:19 AM   #2288
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Probably old news for this thread but it's on topic at least... Really don't feel like reading back any further. http://www.roadandtrack.com/future-c...subaru-wrx-sti
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Old 07-30-2011, 11:38 AM   #2289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geddesk2 View Post
For those who don't like searching:

http://www.iwsti.com/forums/subaru-n...-official.html
Nowhere in my manual does it mention that the bluetooth handsfree voice dialing doesn't work with the Pioneer AVIC unit in my 2011 - I can only hope the new unit does.
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Old 07-31-2011, 09:43 AM   #2290
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Subaru is going downhill faster than the Obama administration. After driving subies for 10+ years, I think I'm bowing out before they hit bottom.
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Old 07-31-2011, 09:54 AM   #2291
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Originally Posted by rubelcon View Post
Subaru is going downhill faster than the Obama administration. After driving subies for 10+ years, I think I'm bowing out before they hit bottom.
This really deserves its own thread, so much information that needs to be disseminated to the public.
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Old 07-31-2011, 02:51 PM   #2292
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Originally Posted by rubelcon View Post
Subaru is going downhill faster than the Obama administration. After driving subies for 10+ years, I think I'm bowing out before they hit bottom.
They're on a strong push uphill actually. They are selling more cars then ever, and the fuel economy penalty of AWD is now becoming a thing of the past.
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Old 08-01-2011, 12:36 AM   #2293
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Mainstreaming and primary focus on fuel economy is not the direction that everyone wants to go.
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Old 08-01-2011, 12:51 AM   #2294
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Mainstreaming and primary focus on fuel economy is not the direction that everyone wants to go.
Isn't that why your getting a separate WRX from the Impreza? Subaru knows to actually make money they have to be mainstream, the third generation proved that. So did Subaru say lets make a great car that attracts the mass and **** the small demographic that buys WRXs? No they are going to give you a standalone WRX which I'm pretty sure will be the most pure sports car of any other WRX ever built. But still you guys are slinging your bs. What do you want exactly? For Subaru to make only bugeyed, funky, gas guzzling cars and go out of business in a few years so that you can reminisce on forums about how it was the best car company ever?
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Old 08-01-2011, 01:27 AM   #2295
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Maybe so.

But we haven't seen what the WRX and STI will become.

The only rumored subaru performance car that is coming is not going to be AWD-efficient, it is going to be RWD-efficient, and not turbocharged, evidently. That used to be the purview of other brands to bring to market. In terms of performance, doing what everyone else in the performance realm does, is it's own kind of mainstreaming.

WRX isn't a sports car, and never has been. It isn't a Miata or a Corvette. Higher performance doesn't change the format principles.

Nobody said anything about
Quote:
For Subaru to make only bugeyed, funky, gas guzzling cars and go out of business in a few years
Nobody said ONLY anything, other than perhaps ONLY AWD, and leave 2WD to others, where Subaru has staked it's claim for a long time, and built it's existing reputation.

Some of the enthusiasts are saying that we don't want Subaru to go the opposite direction, and go ALL mainstream, without the independent performance streak that has made Subaru a name that all enthusiasts recognize, even if they use something else.

We don't know where the future is going... but there has been a whole lot of mainstreaming going on... and not a lot of new performance developments lately. STI hasn't had a significant core mechanical upgrade since it's 04 introduction.

Now there are rumors that it might go back to WRC homologation as a sub-compact with a 1.6 liter engine, more like a Fiesta competitor.

Legacy GT is all but gone. Outback XT is gone, and Forester XT is a shadow of it's potential.

The line of demarcation between WRX and STI got a lot thinner in 2011, and it might signal a unification into one model in the future, take it or leave it.

Is that what you want, brettjr? A Subaru lineup with a miata-sized RWD coupe that it shares with Scion and Toyota as well, and a 1.6L STI sub-compact, and otherwise basically soccer-mom-grade mainstream CUVs, an also-ran midsize-sedan-class Legacy, and a watered-down Impreza econo-box?

Nobody has been saying that Subaru needs to be ONLY this, or ONLY that... but c'mon. You have to be blind to not see a mainstreaming trend, and Subaru following the Toyota method of going more beige to move more appliances to up the sales stats.

What have those increased appliance sales stats for the last several years generated for the Subaru enthusiasts so far? status quo WRX and STI, and otherwise dwindling choices?
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Old 08-01-2011, 11:06 AM   #2296
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So...

Mid-size sedan, SUV, compact sedan, rwd sports car, light awd sports car (in 3- and 5-door trim), and CUV.

I'm not sure how -adding- two true sports car models to your line is a bad thing, ever.

Apart from your "sky is falling"-esque predictions that Subaru is going mainstream (selling cars is now mainstream? Where is the Delorean when you need one...), it looks like Subaru is filling out its line quite nicely and at the same time not forgetting to pay it's respects to enthusiasts.

Without making huge assumptions on what you think future models will come to represent, it seems sort of silly to assume Subaru is at risk of becoming Toyota-ized.

Again, you miss the entirely obvious - car manufacturers need MONEY from cheap product lines to experiment in expensive, niche model lines. Go buy a Porsche - they offer everything you want in a carmaker: H6, mid-engine, high-powered SUVs, awd models everywhere. When you're done crying over the sticker price you might finally realize that selling the car you want is always a compromise and not just some evil beancounter.

Last edited by manticus; 08-01-2011 at 11:13 AM.
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Old 08-01-2011, 11:51 AM   #2297
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WRX and STI are not sports cars, and so far, they are not 3 and 5 door body-styles, they are 4 and 5 door bodies...

Sports cars are 2-door, 2 seat cars. Technically the RWD car doesn't meet the 2 seat requirement, but it is so small, I'll even grant you that one.

if they replace the WRX/STI they aren't ADDING anything. They are re-designing a current product, and possibly changing it's focus.

YET AGAIN YOU MISSED MY POINT.

nobody said that SOME mainstream models are a bad thing. Of course companies need revenue.

nobody said that SOME performance options are a bad thing. Without some of that, a car company gets VERY boring.

NOBODY SAID that a good balance isn't a good thing.

I am not making assumptions, I am reciting rumors that are going around here, from auto magazines, and other typical rumor-mill sources that are suggesting that WRX/STI may be changing significantly with this separation from the Impreza model.

If I could afford TWO Porsches, I would buy one. Happily. If you want to contribute, I'll send you a link to my paypal account.

And when I have one, I'll join Rennlist, or Planet9, and talk about cars with people who actually want to talk about cars, instead of sniping at people who's opinions differ.

My question still stands.

With the near-demise of the Legacy GT, the actual demise of the Outback XT, while NOT being met with a manual gearbox option with the H6 models of those vehicles...

With the complete under-delivery on the Forester XT not having the WRX's drivetrain, and being 4EAT only, while Kia Sportage Turbo is arriving to eat Forester's lunch...

Now Impreza is no longer the same vehicle as the WRX/STI, which has a nebulous future apart from Impreza...

...and Subaru's only announced new performance car has no turbo AND no AWD.

Is that the Subaru lineup that the Subaru enthusiast base wants?

How about answering the question, instead of attacking my perspective on it.
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Old 08-01-2011, 12:08 PM   #2298
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WRX and STI are not sports cars, and so far, they are not 3 and 5 door body-styles, they are 4 and 5 door bodies...
Quote:
if they replace the WRX/STI they aren't ADDING anything. They are re-designing a current product, and possibly changing it's focus.
Did you just disagree with yourself? The new WRX will supposedly be an all-new model, and not a hotted-up econobox. It will be designed from the ground up to be a sports car, which is not what they sell now. Whether they're adding, replacing, reinventing, whatever. Who cares. The new WRX/STI, if it is really designed separately from the Impreza, will be better for it. How could you not want that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HipToBeSquare View Post
...and Subaru's only announced new performance car has no turbo AND no AWD.

Is that the Subaru lineup that the Subaru enthusiast base wants?
Are you ignoring the 2012 WRX and STI? Next year, Subarus lineup will be exactly the same as it was this year, but with one more model. I am not a "Subaru enthusiast." I am, I guess, a sports car enthusiast. Really I'm just someone who likes driving, so I want a RWD car. So I guess, to answer your question, yes I do want Subaru to offer a RWD car.
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Old 08-01-2011, 12:26 PM   #2299
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You may want to quote more of my comments, to get the CONTEXT.

A Sports car is a very specific thing. A performance car is more generalized.

A sports car is 2 seats, with 2 doors, and is clean-sheet designed for handling performance with bare minimum practical consideration. Miata is a sports car. Corvette is a sports car. Subaru has NEVER built a sports car, not even their coupes, which were economy cars or grand touring coupes. Subaru does build performance cars.

There is no hard rumor, let alone official news, that WRX/STI will become a sports car. It will likely continue to be a performance car, but it is also likely to have more than two doors, and two seats, but who knows what size class, or what engine it will have.

But it is highly likely NOT to be a true sports car. A performance car can be of any body type. It will be a performance car, but we don't know what that means for the '13 WRX/STI yet, or even if there will be a differentiation. Maybe it will be ONE model, rather than two.

2012 WRX and STI haven't changed a bit from 2011. They are hold-overs, and '12 will be their last year, by all likelyhood. If you want one, buy one now, before it all changes.

But my question was about the forward-looking trend of Subaru's decision making. The last hold-over year of the current WRX/STI isn't forward looking, and has nothing to do with the trend of the Subaru brand.

If the future WRX/STI does follow the MotorTrend prediction of going to a sub-compact rally homologation, with a 1.6 liter engine... the WRX STI that we currently know could end up as dead as the Outback XT is.

That is fine, if you want a RWD car. I have a RWD TRUE sports car myself, and I understand why people want them... but I have to ask a second question, then.

Why Subaru? If Toyota and Scion are going to offer the same car, with the same configuration, why do you want Subaru to offer it?

You say that you are NOT a Subaru enthusiast, but a sports car/performance car enthusiast, who likes driving. As am I.

But if you are not blindly brand-loyal, why do you want SUBARU to offer you a RWD car, rather than Toyota/Scion offering you the exact same vehicle?

And BTW, what you answered... wasn't what I asked. I asked if the whole LINEUP was something that Subaru enthusiasts were in favor of, not just one RWD product, but the whole brand's shifting focus, as a trend into the future.
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Old 08-01-2011, 12:35 PM   #2300
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I am not blindly brand-loyal. I will buy whichever company's version is better. But I also don't think there's anything wrong with Subaru offering a RWD car, either. That was my point. You asked, am I ok with Subaru's lineup or whatever. My answer is that I don't give 2 *****s about Subaru's lineup. I just want a RWD car that is fun to drive, inexpensive, and doesn't have a top made out of a sheet. Whatever company offers one, I will buy it. It would make no sense for Subaru to develop that car, and then not sell it because they are worried about what people will think of their lineup. They sell cars, not lineups.
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