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Old 10-20-2012, 09:47 PM   #1076
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I bet the hoop shown is just for show.

For those complaining about the front overhang... go check out some side shots of mid-engined sports cars. Plenty of front overhang.

And no.. It isn't "rear-engined".
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:24 PM   #1077
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus View Post
I bet the hoop shown is just for show.


That's the 818R's roll hoop, as integrated into its cage. It is certainly not for show. That's the actual chassis for the 818R .pictured

The street version doesn't have its NASA/SCCA legal cage. Less side impact, less roll hoop, from what we've seen so far. However, you're looking at what will be the production 818R cage/hoop.
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Old 10-20-2012, 10:28 PM   #1078
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That hoop is part of the tube chassis, it's a critical design piece. I suspect FFR could change it or offer different heights, but I doubt they will. Here's a picture I took about 18 months ago, apart from the high side bars on the track car the design is very similar. Remember their intention is for this car to use the stock WRX seats which are very tall compared to a fiberglass bucket sitting on the floorboard.

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Old 10-20-2012, 10:38 PM   #1079
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowphun View Post
That hoop is part of the tube chassis, it's a critical design piece. I suspect FFR could change it or offer different heights, but I doubt they will. Here's a picture I took about 18 months ago, apart from the high side bars on the track car the design is very similar. Remember their intention is for this car to use the stock WRX seats which are very tall compared to a fiberglass bucket sitting on the floorboard.
Yes, we've all seen the original 818 street chassis. It's posted in this thread.

The hoop in the 818R is entirely different from what the street car will get, as you can see.

The side pods of the 818R are completely different from the street version. The 818R will not even have functional doors, per-say.
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Old 10-20-2012, 11:01 PM   #1080
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Quote:
Originally Posted by REX8 View Post
Yes, we've all seen the original 818 street chassis. It's posted in this thread.

The hoop in the 818R is entirely different from what the street car will get, as you can see.

The side pods of the 818R are completely different from the street version. The 818R will not even have functional doors, per-say.
You find a way to argue about almost anything. The picture is relevant, it shows how the bar is part of the structure. I don't know who you're disagreeing with about the side pods and doors, I also don't see how you can say the hoop is "entirely different", they are very similar.
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Old 10-21-2012, 12:45 AM   #1081
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowphun View Post
You find a way to argue about almost anything. The picture is relevant, it shows how the bar is part of the structure. I don't know who you're disagreeing with about the side pods and doors, I also don't see how you can say the hoop is "entirely different", they are very similar.


Argue? You posted a months-old picture. It shows how the bar is part of the structure?

A roll hoop, no matter what configuration, is always going to be part of a tube-frame car. "The roll hoop is part of the structure"? Wow, shocking news, thanks a pant-load!

The hoop and the chassis in the 818R and the street 818 are not similar from the standpoint of legal and illegal for wheel to wheel and trackdays.

Stop posting, read, then come back . The 818r's chassis, as has been shown for weeks now, has been fitted will a significant cage. Insuring its legality for w2s racing, etc.

It is not at all the same as the chassis we've seen for the street 818. Look at the latest hoops on the street 818 chassis, and not the original one you posted. They are not similar. One is legal for trackdays, one wouldn't be. There have been at-length conversations on the forums about it.

Thanks for including that "you" took the picture of the chassis that's been posted in this thread for months. We're all real impressed.

"bar is part of the structure"...no ****...what would the bar be part of exactly?

You don't know the difference between a generic roll hoop, and a legal roll bar for track days, and a legal cage for w2w. Which is what we're talking about. Until you learn said difference, let the adults talk.
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Old 10-21-2012, 08:35 AM   #1082
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Quote:
Originally Posted by REX8 View Post
"bar is part of the structure"...no ****...what would the bar be part of exactly?

You don't know the difference between a generic roll hoop, and a legal roll bar for track days, and a legal cage for w2w. Which is what we're talking about.
It's dissapointing that you turn a conversation here into a chance to be an ethug, throwing around your "racing knowledge". My comments were in response to this:

Quote:
I bet the hoop shown is just for show.
Are you really too dense to see that? We're not talking about any of the nonsense that you're spouting, we're talking about the height of the roll hoop, that's it.
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Old 10-21-2012, 12:37 PM   #1083
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus View Post

And no.. It isn't "rear-engined".
You know what I mean, the engine is in the ass end of the car. "Mid-engined" opens up way too many cans of worms when you consider the Corvette and Miata are "Mid-engine" even though the engine is at the opposite end of this "Mid-engined" car. Call it like it is, that car has an engine in the rear.
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Old 10-21-2012, 01:38 PM   #1084
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Quote:
Originally Posted by REX8



That's the 818R's roll hoop, as integrated into its cage. It is certainly not for show. That's the actual chassis for the 818R .pictured

The street version doesn't have its NASA/SCCA legal cage. Less side impact, less roll hoop, from what we've seen so far. However, you're looking at what will be the production 818R cage/hoop.
I thought that maybe this was just a car for SEMA and they were showing a chopped down hoop. Okay, so not looking at the pic on my phone I can now see that he's in a WRX seat and that he's got sufficient room over his head. Anyway.. My bad!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaslayer

You know what I mean, the engine is in the ass end of the car. "Mid-engined" opens up way too many cans of worms when you consider the Corvette and Miata are "Mid-engine" even though the engine is at the opposite end of this "Mid-engined" car. Call it like it is, that car has an engine in the rear.
The Corvette and Miata are front-mid engined. It isn't many cans of worms or even one. These are simple classifications. The center of the engine is mounted inside the wheelbase, therefore it is a mid-engined car.

Rear-engined cars are entirely different and calling every rear-mid engined car a rear-engined car would be a can of worms. The whole point of recognizing the engine position is the effect that is made on the vehicle's weight transfer under different forces, as well as polar moment... A rear-engined car is completely different than a mid-engined car in the regard where these things matter.

I mean, the engine in a Previa is behind the driver, but I doubt even you would call it a rear-engined car because of that.
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Old 10-21-2012, 02:06 PM   #1085
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I don't see anything on the street version that would prevent it from doing track days in my area. I know that NASA and SCCA have their own requirements that are more specific, but in what way would the street version's rollover protection be inadequate for track days that are not competitive events.

I'm on the FFR forum and have been following the 818 forum since its inception, but I don't recall seeing a difference in height between the street and race versions. My memory sucks and I could have missed it, but I thought the race version just added additional bracing but had the rollbar and the same height. FFR knows that the majority of sales will be the street version and that a lot of those street buyers will want the option to take the car to the track.

The 818 is still in the prototype stage and while it may not change at all, these things are not set in stone.
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Old 10-21-2012, 02:31 PM   #1086
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Rear engine is like a VW bug or 911. Mid engine is center line forward but still behind driver seat. Toyota mr2.

Everything else is front engine. The vette is an odd ball as the sit the motor back because the tranny is in the rear. So they have the room.
As for anything else... I guess a shifter kart is illegal too. This car is a build in progress. So anyone who steps in here being a know it all can go suck it. Keep the drama in your pants.

Just be glad someone is building something like this.
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Old 10-21-2012, 09:19 PM   #1087
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evan View Post

I'm on the FFR forum and have been following the 818 forum since its inception, but I don't recall seeing a difference in height between the street and race versions. My memory sucks and I could have missed it, but I thought the race version just added additional bracing but had the rollbar and the same height. FFR knows that the majority of sales will be the street version and that a lot of those street buyers will want the option to take the car to the track.
Time will tell, but the later shots of the street chassis (not the original one, or the go-kart), show a bar of much lower height. Certainly not enough to pass a broomstick for a 6' guy. Whether or not they go with that design, or the simple, high straight bar of the first chassis we saw remains to be seen.

But, there has been a good bit of discussion regarding the pics of the updated chassis and its dual, lower hoops. Namely, if it's silly to offer a street version of the "giant slayer" that won't even be legal at most track days.

Who knows, we'll see!
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Old 10-22-2012, 03:27 AM   #1088
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Are you referring to the recent shots of the red car?

I missed the conversation about two different hoop heights, do u have a link handy?
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Old 10-22-2012, 10:31 AM   #1089
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Front overhang is due in part to the position and angle of the radiator.
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Old 10-22-2012, 10:53 AM   #1090
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechie3 View Post
Front overhang is due in part to the position and angle of the radiator.
Also choice of headlamps. The angle does throw it a bit out of proportion, and then again, having a shorter overhang would lend to a driver being too far forward, i.e.: stub nose (of which I'm not a fan of, like the Koniegseggesegegeggg).

--kC
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Old 10-22-2012, 12:21 PM   #1091
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Im very interested in this, any specs available from testing? Braking? 0-60? Gs? Etc? I want to do a project car with my father and hopefully pass on to my son.... looking at the website right now, are kits available for sale yet?


Sorry for not going through 1000s of posts, im on my tablet.
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Old 10-22-2012, 12:22 PM   #1092
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Spring time they will be for sale
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Old 10-22-2012, 12:26 PM   #1093
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No published test data.
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Old 10-22-2012, 12:35 PM   #1094
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Thanks guys, i subscribed.
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Old 10-22-2012, 01:58 PM   #1095
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evan View Post
Are you referring to the recent shots of the red car?

I missed the conversation about two different hoop heights, do u have a link handy?
http://www.factoryfive.com/galleries/project-818/

^^^ Click on the 818 gallary, first pic/drawing is a red 818.

That first pic, while a rendering, shows a bar style that has shown up in many of FFRs models of the 818. Most think that will be the street bar...and as you can see, it won't be legal for many sanctioning bodies' DEs.

It's simply not high enough, unlike the actualy 818Rs hoop.

http://www.factoryfive.com/kits/project-818/

^^^ see the second pic down, which shows the 818R with the same bar shown in the latest build pics.
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Old 10-22-2012, 03:00 PM   #1096
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I gotcha, you're referring to this one:



Compared to this:



I agree, bar is too low. I wouldn't put too much stock in it. Granted, I'm not going to be one of the 1st buyers, so I am not as concerned as some with if it'll be perfect for me right out of the gate, but I doubt it'll look like the rendering for the following reasons:
  • Customer demand for a car that seats 2 and has sufficient safety for non-competition track use.
  • It's a prototype rendering.
  • The announcement that a softop will be available at launch. Many speculate that this means a bar that is high enough to keep the top off your head. You could do it other ways, but this seems like a good way to get it done.
  • The eventual existence of the 818R. The fact that they plan a competition capable version with body panels that accommodate a proper cage means that the appropriate body panels are planned for production and I'm doubtful that they'll make customers choose between a car that less suitable for street use and a street car that can't be taken to the track.
But who knows, maybe they will miss the mark, but even if the SEMA car has a bar that is too low, the customer response will probably drive a change before production or early in the production cycle.
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Old 10-22-2012, 06:48 PM   #1097
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I agree, and would be surprised if they went for a non-legal bar in the street version. Doesn't make sense to me. But that is what many think will be the case, given the amount of times that configuration has shown up on various models, etc. Maybe an optional roll bar for the street version?

Who knows, time will tell.
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Old 10-22-2012, 07:44 PM   #1098
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I can't wait for this. Should be impressive numbers.
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Old 10-23-2012, 10:06 PM   #1099
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This is the roadster chassis:



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Old 10-24-2012, 09:17 AM   #1100
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Okay.. so.. does anyone know what the headlights are out of?

The last time I asked this (for the earlier prototypes which had projectors, not reflectors) people claimed it was a Camry (although I can't find any Camry with the headlights shown earlier or now).


Edit: Okay.. so the 2001-2006 Camry.



Someone compiled a nice slideshow of all the different aftermarket lamps available on eBay.
http://www.flickr.com//photos/232914...40405536/show/

.. and Mechie.. you can't link to a forum attachment. Those are reference files, not image files. We see nothing.

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