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Old 02-18-2011, 01:28 PM   #76
kellygnsd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinSTi05 View Post
Jeff, any reason you didn't get an EWG housing so you don't have to deal with the additional axial length of the IWG housing? From what I can tell the existing turbo kit has an EWG anyway.

If you use the shorter exhaust housing now you only have to contend with the huge axial length of the CHRA, lol
Because the twin scroll housings haven't been released yet and the only option for EWG is the 1.05 TS EWG.
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Old 02-18-2011, 01:52 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinSTi05 View Post
Jeff, any reason you didn't get an EWG housing so you don't have to deal with the additional axial length of the IWG housing? From what I can tell the existing turbo kit has an EWG anyway.

If you use the shorter exhaust housing now you only have to contend with the huge axial length of the CHRA, lol
Ya, mainly because i didn't want to do the monster 1.05ar housing. But depending on how the wastegate works, there may be no reason to do that setup. The only reason i can think of is if the WG really gets in the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by icky View Post
Because of how long this turbo is and the waste gate wanting to sit where the frame rail is, I would suggest something like this.

http://www.forcedairtechnologies.com...l-turbo-build/

Have a different up-pipe, down pipe and a MAF extension for the efr kit. It would be (o)(o) Yeah, I gave you the pearky ones.
Definitely that style is on my mind, it just creates lots of other problems, well not problems, but additional costs for the end user. If that happens it becomes lots of custom things or a kit that contains an intercooler and who knows what else. My goal is to make it fit with our existing FMIC owners as that is the natural progression from Stage 1 to 3 then to 4.
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Old 02-18-2011, 05:14 PM   #78
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Something to drool on over the weekend....


EFR Turbo Technical Brief


Here is a very in depth article about the EFR turbos and how they came to be. This article is what really got me going on these turbos. Never before has turbo company done this kind of public documentation.

Click Here to Download EFR Turbo Technical breif.pdf
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Old 02-18-2011, 08:40 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses View Post
Turbo porn has arrived. Waiting for more than the softcore porn being shown here.
I want hardcore (the part where the turbo gets put in the engine bay, then taken out for fitment, then put back in, then taken out again... and... you get the idea).

I am very much looking forward to seeing how this turbo responds as it's on the short list for my new engine setup.
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Old 02-18-2011, 08:55 PM   #80
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You know, if i started with the Hardcore, there would be nothing to look forward to. Everything else would just be be like watching Cinemax after 10pm...Boring....
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Old 02-18-2011, 10:19 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PERRINJeff View Post
Something to drool on over the weekend....


EFR Turbo Technical Brief
125 pages .

Though if I ever find the time I'd love to read it.

Do please show us how you're going to shoehorn one of these bad boys into a GD Impreza.
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Old 02-18-2011, 10:28 PM   #82
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Time to bust out the hammer!
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Old 02-18-2011, 11:15 PM   #83
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I think there's going to be a lot of stunned people when it all plays out.
I'm glad you are doing this... i really hope this makes a few other shops post up there results
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Old 02-19-2011, 12:38 AM   #84
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i just read a ton of the technical brief. mostly the stuff that applied to me or that i was interested in. all i can say is wow. tons of good info to help settle concerns about the product. even made me imagine how fun a small 6758 would be on the street
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Old 02-19-2011, 12:45 AM   #85
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wow after going through all 125 pages i really like what they have to say, and i like why they decided on the parts they did, one thing it has me thinking about it will they be rebuildable, if you look at the picture of the bearing cartridge, its help on with a C clip, which to me makes it look like it would be replaceable, if so i think that would almost make this a deal over other non rebuildable, it would be cheaper to fix, and the resale valve would be more knowing if something wrong when you buy it used you can just replace the parts it needs instead of a whole CHRA
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Old 02-19-2011, 01:29 AM   #86
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as true as that may be the design looks as though it wouldn't need rebuilding....ever
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Old 02-19-2011, 01:51 AM   #87
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A rebuildable CHRA is definitely promising, but remember that you can get a 30r CHRA swapped out for $450. Just to be fair

Also to be fair, Mr. Perrin has not done really released any info that Full Race has not. Both Perrin and Full Race have taken pics, released specs, and discussed these turbos with us. I appreciate all the time that both companies have put into answering our questions on these turbos. So, with all due respect, get over it.

I agree with waynoSTI. Fitment is not going to be as tough as everyone thinks. It will take a little work and creativity sure. But looking at my current rotated 30r kit, there is a ton of room for this turbo. The uppipe will just have to be a little further from the heads...BFD. Considering Jeff's opinion that the EFR can be mounted safely at a greater angle...

Hey Bariga, don't you already have a Full Race EFR kit minus the turbo? Mock that sucker up and take some pics!!
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Old 02-19-2011, 03:10 AM   #88
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^ i will, as soon as i get my engine back from the shop,,, my car started to smell like beer and dro in my stinky garage
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Old 02-21-2011, 08:29 AM   #89
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Ok you have had a weekend to fabricate, out with the results
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Old 02-21-2011, 11:41 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aboothman View Post
Also to be fair, Mr. Perrin has not done really released any info that Full Race has not. Both Perrin and Full Race have taken pics, released specs, and discussed these turbos with us. I appreciate all the time that both companies have put into answering our questions on these turbos. So, with all due respect, get over it.
Well the big difference is Jeff has purchased one with the intent of installing and testing on a Subaru. So with all due respect, your comparison of the two is a little off.

I too think fitement will be possible but will obviously require redesign of the uppipe, downpipe, inlet and chargepipe. So if Jeff can make a kit that only changes those 4 parts from his existing kits, then it won't be so bad. The inlet may even carry over...so possibly 3 parts.
Brake bias block might need a bit of movement, like on a GC.
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Old 02-21-2011, 12:59 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by aboothman View Post
A rebuildable CHRA is definitely promising, but remember that you can get a 30r CHRA swapped out for $450. Just to be fair
According to BWTS (Borg Warner Turbo Systems) they are not rebuildable. They will have a core setup like Garrett where you just buy a new CHRA. I do not know the price, but its supposed to be very fair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aboothman View Post
Also to be fair, Mr. Perrin has not done really released any info that Full Race has not. Both Perrin and Full Race have taken pics, released specs, and discussed these turbos with us. I appreciate all the time that both companies have put into answering our questions on these turbos. So, with all due respect, get over it.
Hopefully it didn't come off that i was pretending to be the first to show everyone pics and things. Full Race,Cosworth and others have had been testing these long before us, but like a lot of things in our performance world, you don't get to everyone. Evidence of that is some of the customers in this thread. So if i came off that we were the first to tell people about the EFR stuff, sorry, it wasn't intended to be that way. I am just as excited about these as you guys are.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aboothman View Post
I agree with waynoSTI. Fitment is not going to be as tough as everyone thinks. It will take a little work and creativity sure. But looking at my current rotated 30r kit, there is a ton of room for this turbo. The uppipe will just have to be a little further from the heads...BFD. Considering Jeff's opinion that the EFR can be mounted safely at a greater angle...
For sure it will fit, the question is what kind of angle can it take. That will be key to making the bigger B3 series turbos fit. The length from T3 flange to the front is really long compared to the Garrett. Its

Quote:
Originally Posted by crashtke View Post
Ok you have had a weekend to fabricate, out with the results
Saturday i had to finish suadeing my dash (last weekends project), Sunday i spent the day taking the GTX35R off my car for a customer, then spent the rest of the day taking apart our 11 STI and doing a lot of planning. In a few days i should have it all setup and ready to run. The GT turbos are much easier to fit than this thing is!
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Old 02-21-2011, 02:12 PM   #92
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I have no issue with you Jeff. I give props to anyone who will step up and be one of the first to try a new technology. There are just some impatient people out there. People are frustrated that FR is not bending over backwards (or possibly violated BW's tech privacy rules?) to prove this new tech that is not even officially released yet in the case of TS. But I will try not to clutter your thread anymore
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Old 02-21-2011, 02:14 PM   #93
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cant wait to see some numbers

Last edited by Bariga; 02-27-2011 at 06:16 PM.
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Old 02-21-2011, 02:37 PM   #94
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^^^that's also the TS turbo which IIRC has a shorter total length, all of which is on the turbine outlet. side. Then also picture having the TGV's and manifold on there...look at the compressor's outlet location. Compressore outlet looks to be right inline with the the runner of #3.

Does anyone know how much angle the Borg EFR's are allowed to tilt?...well recommend angle to not exceed
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Old 02-21-2011, 02:41 PM   #95
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Ok so I'm about a 1/3 of the way through the big EFR technical document. What I will say so far is that the level of detail provided here has mollified my skepticism toward this product. The document gives an honest and balanced assessment of their engineering challenges and choices. They acknowledge when they borrow existing designs and adapt them, instead of trying to convince people that they reinvented the wheel.

I no longer feel like I'm being manipulated with "turbo of the month" marketing hype.
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Old 02-21-2011, 03:02 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
^^^that's also the TS turbo which IIRC has a shorter total length, all of which is on the turbine outlet. side. Then also picture having the TGV's and manifold on there...look at the compressor's outlet location. Compressore outlet looks to be right inline with the the runner of #3.

Does anyone know how much angle the Borg EFR's are allowed to tilt?...well recommend angle to not exceed
The difference in housing length has to do with whether or not it is IWG or EWG, not twinscroll/singlescroll
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Old 02-21-2011, 03:59 PM   #97
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Also 7670 and 8374 have same foot print, so you can swap them easy.
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Old 02-21-2011, 04:14 PM   #98
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All I could find in the EFR tech document was a reference to the allowable angle for the oil inlet/outlet. Nothing on front to back allowable angles.

I agree that the pics Bariga posted show some fitment concerns with the current/old FR uppipe, but with some minor modification and compressor housing clocking it should not be too difficult to get proper fitment. Things that I am sure they have already done.
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Old 02-21-2011, 05:08 PM   #99
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So is the 7670 supposed to be 'comparible' to the 30r and the 8374 to the 35r?
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Old 02-21-2011, 05:11 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
^^^that's also the TS turbo which IIRC has a shorter total length, all of which is on the turbine outlet. side. Then also picture having the TGV's and manifold on there...look at the compressor's outlet location. Compressore outlet looks to be right inline with the the runner of #3.

Does anyone know how much angle the Borg EFR's are allowed to tilt?...well recommend angle to not exceed
Its in the 125 page guide somewhere.
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