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Old 05-18-2011, 03:15 PM   #26
BrandonDrums
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I'm thinking about this turbo although that spool curve is way quicker than any other 18g-xt I've seen and with the 8cm2 housing?

Do you think the 3port EBC/MBC hybrid setup helps with that? It's almost like EWG numbers.

If so, please let me know how you have your boost control setup, is it just like the hybrid setup explained in the sticky?

Incredible stuff!
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Old 05-18-2011, 03:33 PM   #27
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with numbers like these,im reconsidering buying a 20g xt and fmic.im stage 2 now with the stock cobb flash.i want more and found a great dea lon the above items.if i could save money and just buy a turbo i'd do just that. nice numbers.
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Old 05-18-2011, 03:42 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by rallyracersti View Post
with numbers like these,im reconsidering buying a 20g xt and fmic.im stage 2 now with the stock cobb flash.i want more and found a great dea lon the above items.if i could save money and just buy a turbo i'd do just that. nice numbers.
^^^Keep in mind that the actual HP numbers are a little high since this Dyno tends to read a bit high. However, you can't fake that curve.

From what I can tell from the thread, this car is making around 310 whp as most awd dyno's would read (at least the ones we have locally). I could care less about the number being inflated or deflated, I'm just crazy about that there torque curve! For me, anything over 300 whp with spool below 3.5k is a winner.

I really would wait to get feedback on his boost control setup first though. I think there's some awesomeness to learn from there.
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Old 05-18-2011, 10:56 PM   #29
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The quick spool is likely a combination of an awesome tune, the GrimmSpeed EBCS being a high quality solenoid / run intercept style, and also just the new billet wheel spooling a bit faster than the older wheels... The manual controller in my hybrid setup shouldn't have any effect on spool as it is simply staying shut until there is a need for it to open if there is a boost spike beyond what the EBCS is controlling.

Cant wait to get some injectors and see what this turbo can put out. Just waiting to save enough to build my 5 speed FTW!
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Old 05-19-2011, 12:21 AM   #30
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we use a manual inbetween the turbo and wastegate and put Ts in the lines and run those to the elec and cap off the 3rd port.
cant wait to get my 20gxt on my girls fxt.
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Old 05-19-2011, 05:11 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abehanna View Post
The quick spool is likely a combination of an awesome tune, the GrimmSpeed EBCS being a high quality solenoid / run intercept style, and also just the new billet wheel spooling a bit faster than the older wheels... The manual controller in my hybrid setup shouldn't have any effect on spool as it is simply staying shut until there is a need for it to open if there is a boost spike beyond what the EBCS is controlling.

Cant wait to get some injectors and see what this turbo can put out. Just waiting to save enough to build my 5 speed FTW!
i should be able to give ya numbers with upgraded injectors (93 pump gas) after next tuesday i picked up some 750ccs and those along with the turbo and grimmspeed ebcs are going on sunday/monday. ill be sure to post results after the tune tuesday night (Tune will be on TurboXS's dynapak dyno.).

downside: temps expected to be in the 80s on that day & my tune isnt till the late afternoon/early evening.
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Old 05-19-2011, 05:21 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abehanna View Post
The quick spool is likely a combination of an awesome tune, the GrimmSpeed EBCS being a high quality solenoid / run intercept style, and also just the new billet wheel spooling a bit faster than the older wheels... The manual controller in my hybrid setup shouldn't have any effect on spool as it is simply staying shut until there is a need for it to open if there is a boost spike beyond what the EBCS is controlling.

Cant wait to get some injectors and see what this turbo can put out. Just waiting to save enough to build my 5 speed FTW!
Well the 3 port still can't run 100% wgdc, it's fast response so you can get more stable boost control with more agressive turbo dynamics tables but it still doesn't allow you to get the waste gate 100% closed when you're spooling.

However, You CAN run 100% wgdc with the hybrid manual boost controller. Basically you max out the wastegate duty during wot in the low rev-ranges basically making the system run 100% on the manual controller set for max boost. For everything else you tune as if it's a 3 port.

That's at least what I can tell from reading that sticky on the hybrid boost setup. Am I misunderstanding something? I tuned my own boost with my 3 port and it's a trade off between fast spool and stable boost, I don't think a Grimspeed alone would allow you to spool an 18G of any type under 3500rpm. If I'm wrong I'd looooove to know what your turbo dynamics tables look like!

And as I said before, ragardless of my above mess, I'm going to be getting the 18g-xt!!
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Old 05-19-2011, 06:14 PM   #33
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You're better off talking to Dom at Maxwell Power. I have no experience tuning my own duty cycles so i have fairly limited knowledge. My understanding is that 100% WGDC with intercept means the wastegate is seeing full boost pressure = no spool? Maybe someone else can chime in here?

I had about 2 hours of sleep the night before my tune so i was kind of brain dead at the time and didn't get to learn as much as i would have liked during the tuning session.
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Old 05-19-2011, 10:19 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abehanna View Post
You're better off talking to Dom at Maxwell Power. I have no experience tuning my own duty cycles so i have fairly limited knowledge. My understanding is that 100% WGDC with intercept means the wastegate is seeing full boost pressure = no spool? Maybe someone else can chime in here?

I had about 2 hours of sleep the night before my tune so i was kind of brain dead at the time and didn't get to learn as much as i would have liked during the tuning session.
Just the opposite I believe, you have to set a Max Wastegate Duty Cycle because it's a safety net for preventing overboost. I had to 0 out my wgdc for break-in on my new engine, my turbo only spooled to WGA pressure since 0% of the compressor nipple pressure was being diverted away from the waste gate actuator (WGA) aka 100% of the boost pressure gets to the WGA.

The flip-side being 100% WGDC means 100% of the pressure is being diverted from the WGA AKA 0% of the boost gets to the actuator.. I guess it's like a train which has pneumatic air-brakes. Energy has to be applied to the system to turn the brakes off, that way if the compressor fails the train stops rather than becomes a runaway. For our Boost-Control systems, energy has to be applied to allow the turbo to see exhaust energy, if the system fails the turbo reaches only Waste-gate pressure thus preserving the turbo and engine and allowing the car to be safely driven to rest.

However, with your hybrid setup, you can set initial off-idle wastegate duty cycle extremely high allowing the Wastegate to stay nearly completely shut since the manual boost controller's valve will only begin diverting pressure to the WGA when it reaches target (a good one will, others will leak a bit along the way).

I've been researching all day so that's the best I understand the situation. I'm no expert though. However, whatever the mojo is you have going on I want to know, it's a hell of a lot easier to buy a couple t-fittings and a MBC than to do a EWG setup IMO. This is the first real proof of application I've seen honestly. I'm enthralled.

Any word DOM?

Last edited by BrandonDrums; 05-19-2011 at 10:34 PM.
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Old 05-22-2011, 02:26 AM   #35
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higher WGDC = WG shut more = more air through turbine = higher boost

When i run these i simply run 95% in the intial and max wgdc maps at all times. Turbo dynamics become irrelevant.

The ebcs doesnt do anything in the hybrid setup until you overboost....well thats the way most people utilize it (95-100% wgdc at all times = mbc is in control). You could lower the wgdc to prevent partial throttle full boost on smaller turbos.....and you can use it to taper boost at high rpm...well theoretically anyway...i have never personally tried that.

Even though the mbc is controlling boost the WGDC will start pulling if your target boost table doesnt match what the MBC is hitting.

Otherwise the EBCS doesnt do much unless you go into limp mode and your wgdc goes to 0....then the ebcs "opens" and the mbc is bypassed.
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Old 05-22-2011, 11:55 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
higher WGDC = WG shut more = more air through turbine = higher boost

When i run these i simply run 95% in the intial and max wgdc maps at all times. Turbo dynamics become irrelevant.

The ebcs doesnt do anything in the hybrid setup until you overboost....well thats the way most people utilize it (95-100% wgdc at all times = mbc is in control). You could lower the wgdc to prevent partial throttle full boost on smaller turbos.....and you can use it to taper boost at high rpm...well theoretically anyway...i have never personally tried that.

Even though the mbc is controlling boost the WGDC will start pulling if your target boost table doesnt match what the MBC is hitting.

Otherwise the EBCS doesnt do much unless you go into limp mode and your wgdc goes to 0....then the ebcs "opens" and the mbc is bypassed.
Makes perfect sense, thanks for the info!!

I'm ordering a MBC today...Hopefully I can get some tuning time in this week.
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Old 05-24-2011, 01:44 PM   #37
abehanna
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Thanks for clearing that up Phatron!
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Old 06-09-2011, 02:40 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
higher WGDC = WG shut more = more air through turbine = higher boost

When i run these i simply run 95% in the intial and max wgdc maps at all times. Turbo dynamics become irrelevant.

The ebcs doesnt do anything in the hybrid setup until you overboost....well thats the way most people utilize it (95-100% wgdc at all times = mbc is in control). You could lower the wgdc to prevent partial throttle full boost on smaller turbos.....and you can use it to taper boost at high rpm...well theoretically anyway...i have never personally tried that.

Even though the mbc is controlling boost the WGDC will start pulling if your target boost table doesnt match what the MBC is hitting.

Otherwise the EBCS doesnt do much unless you go into limp mode and your wgdc goes to 0....then the ebcs "opens" and the mbc is bypassed.
Sorry to re-open this, but with the 8cm^2 housing, does the 18gxt self-scale it's boost so to speak at partial throttle?

I wonder what the partial throttle boost numbers and power delivery looks like. I'm really having a hard time deciding on a 7cm or 8cm housing for my turbo. Either way I'm running a hybrid boost control setup.
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Old 06-09-2011, 02:54 PM   #39
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If running hybrid boost control, you can tune partial throttle boost lower than it's threshold if you like (no lower than wastegate spring, of course). Like at 20% throttle you can set WGDC to 5% (essentially wastegate spring), then ramp up to 95% WGDC at 50% throttle (now you're on the Manual ball + spring boost controller). You pretty much don't cruise above 50% throttle, so this works out well for controlling part throttle boost.

I drive up a hill on the way to work every day, and if I used cruise control in 5th, my TD04 would push up to 8-9psi (wastegate boost). Once I swapped to an FP 18g / 7cm, it dropped to around 5psi. More flow at lower boost. You will not have the same issue with part throttle boost with a larger turbo.

Regardless, there's no reason to cruise up that hill in 5th. I get better fuel economy by downshifting to 4th to go up that hill, and then the boost required to maintain speed drops even more.
Downshift like you should and you never have to worry about part throttle high boost.

Last edited by Concillian; 06-09-2011 at 04:59 PM.
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Old 06-09-2011, 02:58 PM   #40
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I like!
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Old 07-12-2011, 12:46 PM   #41
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Very nice. I made 359.6whp and 350whtq on a low reading mustang 1100 w this Turbo w a 7cm exhaust. Excellent spool characteristics and 4th gear is rediculous.
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Old 07-12-2011, 05:57 PM   #42
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I guess I no longer need a Dom 1.0XT-R (or 20G-XT-R), Topspeed dynoed the Dom 1.0 at 250wtq / 3,250rpm (20psi), your beast (understood is a different dyno) 325wtq / 3250rpm (16psi), wow. Even after subtracting differences in dyno the 75wtq difference is significant, especially considering you are running stock injectors and TMIC and only tuned at 16psi.
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Old 07-12-2011, 08:54 PM   #43
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... only tuned at 16psi.
16psi @ redline, maybe. Look at the graph, peak boost is closer to 18.5psi or so by my eye.
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Old 07-13-2011, 10:51 AM   #44
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oh yeah it says 17.8psi at the bottom left corner of the plot

Last edited by V8 GTFO Lesbic WGN; 07-13-2011 at 12:35 PM.
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Old 07-13-2011, 11:24 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by boostmasterflex View Post
Very nice. I made 359.6whp and 350whtq on a low reading mustang 1100 w this Turbo w a 7cm exhaust. Excellent spool characteristics and 4th gear is rediculous.
Are you using a hybrid boost control setup as well?
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Old 07-14-2011, 03:11 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
higher WGDC = WG shut more = more air through turbine = higher boost

When i run these i simply run 95% in the intial and max wgdc maps at all times. Turbo dynamics become irrelevant.

The ebcs doesnt do anything in the hybrid setup until you overboost....well thats the way most people utilize it (95-100% wgdc at all times = mbc is in control). You could lower the wgdc to prevent partial throttle full boost on smaller turbos.....and you can use it to taper boost at high rpm...well theoretically anyway...i have never personally tried that.

Even though the mbc is controlling boost the WGDC will start pulling if your target boost table doesnt match what the MBC is hitting.

Otherwise the EBCS doesnt do much unless you go into limp mode and your wgdc goes to 0....then the ebcs "opens" and the mbc is bypassed.
Hey not meaning to thread jack but is there any way you could throw a picture up of the location where you put the mbc on th line so we get a solid idea where we'll need to put ours?

Thanks!

-Jesse
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Old 07-14-2011, 03:38 PM   #47
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Old 07-14-2011, 04:25 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrandonDrums

Are you using a hybrid boost control setup as well?
I am using grimspeed 3port bcs, opensource tuned w Tial 38mm wastegate
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Old 08-31-2011, 09:59 AM   #49
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I still can't get over how awesome that torque band is. I'm still saving for an 18g!
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Old 08-31-2011, 09:11 PM   #50
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Can't wait for the upcoming 18G-XT-RRRRRRR
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