Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Friday August 22, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Factory 2.0L Turbo Powertrain

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-01-2012, 07:12 AM   #576
Vlad
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 46135
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: NY
Vehicle:
02 WRX
Sti V9 Spec C

Default

Maybe Kinugawa will do a ballbearing Garrett CHRA.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Vlad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 08:20 AM   #577
LIQUIDSK8S
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 22605
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Vehicle:
2002 JDM STI/WRX
WRB

Default

I'm always skeptical of the bargain bin turbos, as they usually don't perform as well as the top shelf turbos. But if someone wants to try it, I look forward to seeing results.
LIQUIDSK8S is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 07:54 PM   #578
Mortal2None
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 190077
Join Date: Sep 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: L.I. N.Y.
Vehicle:
2006 Subaru LGT BP
OBP

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LIQUIDSK8S View Post
I'm always skeptical of the bargain bin turbos, as they usually don't perform as well as the top shelf turbos. But if someone wants to try it, I look forward to seeing results.

Ditto here. The Garrett BB cartridge that Blouch uses is better reliability wise though and that's what you are paying for. For $890 though, the Kinugawa is definitely interesting. Who's going to be the Guinea Pig?
Mortal2None is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 08:17 PM   #579
kayen
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 57287
Join Date: Mar 2004
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Vehicle:
2002 Bugeye STi
MY03 Fozzy XS

Default

Hey guys looks like there was an update on Scooby Clinic about the new Twin Scroll Exhaust housings. Here is what Kev showed

Hi,

check out these bad boys.

At last the new range of SC billet TWIN SCROLLS have arrived with their new custom cast exhaust housing.

These are true twin scrolls not twin entry, the real deal.
pictured here left to right SC36, SC42 and SC50 Billet TWIN SCROLLS.


Let the testing begin

cheers
Kev
kayen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 08:26 PM   #580
kayen
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 57287
Join Date: Mar 2004
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Vehicle:
2002 Bugeye STi
MY03 Fozzy XS

Default

Based on what I can tell and especially since SC has now released an SC50 Twin Scroll. I would have to say that these turbo's are *approximately* compared to these from Blouch (this is only an educated guess, no hard facts)

SC36 TS = Blouch 16G-XTR; SC42 TS = Blouch 18G-XTR; SC46 TS = Blouch 20G-XTR; SC50 TS = Blouch Dom 1.5XTR
kayen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 08:44 PM   #581
sithspawn
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 163003
Join Date: Oct 2007
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Inland Empire
Vehicle:
2014 FR-S
Hot Lava w/flappy paddles

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LIQUIDSK8S View Post
I'm always skeptical of the bargain bin turbos, as they usually don't perform as well as the top shelf turbos. But if someone wants to try it, I look forward to seeing results.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortal2None View Post
Ditto here. The Garrett BB cartridge that Blouch uses is better reliability wise though and that's what you are paying for. For $890 though, the Kinugawa is definitely interesting. Who's going to be the Guinea Pig?
You know, I actually did some searches on the Kinugawa/Kamak turbos made in Taiwan, and there's guys on here that have been running them since 2009 and have logged over 36k miles on it without any issues. I'd say that's not bad at all for a bargain bin turbo. They've also been proven with the SR20 and Evo guys as well as guys overseas. So, in all honesty, I don't really think it's that big of a gamble at this point.

The only concern I have though, is that there have been some reports of people experiencing a bit more lag than they expected, but overall the power is there and is comparable to the top shelf turbos in that department.

I also saw a couple posts from Vlad about porting the wastegate bore to nozzle interface for better boost control. If you've got more time than money, and have the tools to do it, I think it's worth the effort. If money is no object, then get what works out of the box.

It would be very nice if Blouch had a 10cm TS exhaust housing that enables a 60mm turbine to be used. I think you'd get very comparable results to a full rotated GT3076R (with a .82 hotside) out of a stock location twin scroll provided you use a 3" inlet.
sithspawn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 08:58 PM   #582
LIQUIDSK8S
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 22605
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Vehicle:
2002 JDM STI/WRX
WRB

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sithspawn View Post
You know, I actually did some searches on the Kinugawa/Kamak turbos made in Taiwan, and there's guys on here that have been running them since 2009 and have logged over 36k miles on it without any issues. I'd say that's not bad at all for a bargain bin turbo. They've also been proven with the SR20 and Evo guys as well as guys overseas. So, in all honesty, I don't really think it's that big of a gamble at this point.


The only concern I have though, is that there have been some reports of people experiencing a bit more lag than they expected, but overall the power is there and is comparable to the top shelf turbos in that department.
My concern isn't with reliability, it's with the performance. And as you said, there are people complaining about extra lag, which to me is a deal breaker. I would rather spend the extra $ for a responsive turbo than one that is blah.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sithspawn View Post
It would be very nice if Blouch had a 10cm TS exhaust housing that enables a 60mm turbine to be used. I think you'd get very comparable results to a full rotated GT3076R (with a .82 hotside) out of a stock location twin scroll provided you use a 3" inlet.
I'm interested to see what happens with the SC50 and the specs for it.
LIQUIDSK8S is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 09:53 PM   #583
sithspawn
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 163003
Join Date: Oct 2007
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Inland Empire
Vehicle:
2014 FR-S
Hot Lava w/flappy paddles

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LIQUIDSK8S View Post
My concern isn't with reliability, it's with the performance. And as you said, there are people complaining about extra lag, which to me is a deal breaker. I would rather spend the extra $ for a responsive turbo than one that is blah.

I'm interested to see what happens with the SC50 and the specs for it.
Yeah, I hear you on the lag part and agree 100%. That said, it is a stock location twin scroll turbo and is relevant to this thread, regardless of whether anyone actually does it or not. As such, I think it would be worth adding to the OP.

I too, am very interested to hear more about the SC50.

BTW, did you ever get your setup running and tuned, I think there's quite a few of us that are waiting to hear about it.
sithspawn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 10:15 PM   #584
LIQUIDSK8S
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 22605
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Vehicle:
2002 JDM STI/WRX
WRB

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sithspawn

Yeah, I hear you on the lag part and agree 100%. That said, it is a stock location twin scroll turbo and is relevant to this thread, regardless of whether anyone actually does it or not. As such, I think it would be worth adding to the OP.

I too, am very interested to hear more about the SC50.

BTW, did you ever get your setup running and tuned, I think there's quite a few of us that are waiting to hear about it.
I'll add it to the OP as soon as I get back to my computer

I'm slowly finishing up my build, might even pull the engine to do a clutch/flywheel and powdercoat some things. I have a lot of patience lol.
LIQUIDSK8S is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 10:17 PM   #585
blakjak00
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 225046
Join Date: Sep 2009
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Snohomish, WA
Vehicle:
2000 2.5RS
Blue Ridge Pearl

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sithspawn View Post
Yeah, I hear you on the lag part and agree 100%. That said, it is a stock location twin scroll turbo and is relevant to this thread, regardless of whether anyone actually does it or not. As such, I think it would be worth adding to the OP.

I too, am very interested to hear more about the SC50.

BTW, did you ever get your setup running and tuned, I think there's quite a few of us that are waiting to hear about it.
Going by what the model number trend has been, I'd assume the SC50 is a 50lb turbo, thus about 500 chp. This might be the turbo to consider for those that are hung up on the 400whp number.
blakjak00 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 10:47 PM   #586
Vlad
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 46135
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: NY
Vehicle:
02 WRX
Sti V9 Spec C

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LIQUIDSK8S View Post
I'm always skeptical of the bargain bin turbos, as they usually don't perform as well as the top shelf turbos. But if someone wants to try it, I look forward to seeing results.
You know, 2-3 years ago, there was quite a long thread from a Garrett employee. There was a lot of going back and forth whether he was for real or not, but he definitely posted some insider information.

You may want to read it. How Garret was acquired by a different company, how the outsourcing to China happened, how the personell in US was reduced but profit maximized, etc.

Bargain bin is... quite a flexible concept and many turbo assemblers reach into it, one way or another...
Castings are made in China, Mitsubishi may even assemble their stuff there.

As far as performance, look at the 18gXT thread. These have been arround for a while now in the single scroll version. Compare them with the regular 18g, people have been doing this.
This is similar with the HTA line, that has begun quite a long time ago.
New aero, billet compressors, more flow.
But not a new standard for performance.
Look at the 18gXTR thread, in the single scroll. Cobb tested that against the 18gxt in a 2.0 EJ205.
The full spool point is the same for both, the R version provides more area under the curve, that's all.

By the way, for both, they were fully spooled by 4100RPM. Not something that nobody else can ever reach....
Vlad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2012, 01:06 AM   #587
blakjak00
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 225046
Join Date: Sep 2009
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Snohomish, WA
Vehicle:
2000 2.5RS
Blue Ridge Pearl

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad View Post
You know, 2-3 years ago, there was quite a long thread from a Garrett employee. There was a lot of going back and forth whether he was for real or not, but he definitely posted some insider information.

You may want to read it. How Garret was acquired by a different company, how the outsourcing to China happened, how the personell in US was reduced but profit maximized, etc.
Sounds like typical corporate American tactics, wouldn't surprise me in the least. Good info though. Don't suppose you bookmarked that thread by chance?
blakjak00 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2012, 01:41 PM   #588
Vlad
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 46135
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: NY
Vehicle:
02 WRX
Sti V9 Spec C

Default


Last edited by Vlad; 02-02-2012 at 01:48 PM.
Vlad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2012, 03:26 PM   #589
rextech255
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 247116
Join Date: May 2010
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Mechanicsburg, PA
Vehicle:
2003 Impreza WRX
PSM Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad
That is just sad.
rextech255 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-07-2012, 08:21 PM   #590
Mortal2None
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 190077
Join Date: Sep 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: L.I. N.Y.
Vehicle:
2006 Subaru LGT BP
OBP

Default

Any takers on the Kinugawa yet? My ebay trigger finger is getting pretty itchy..
Mortal2None is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-07-2012, 08:29 PM   #591
Mortal2None
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 190077
Join Date: Sep 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: L.I. N.Y.
Vehicle:
2006 Subaru LGT BP
OBP

Default

I've also been asking Bryan @ BnR Supercars if he would take his magic with the VF single scroll turbos and try to apply it to the twin scroll crowd. He attempted once in the past without success due to the turbine size limitations of the P25 turbine housing. If more people asked about T/S options he might be persuaded to give it another try. Can you post cross-forum threads on NASIOC or is it against the rules somewhere? The thread is on the Legacy GT forums.
Mortal2None is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-08-2012, 08:17 AM   #592
kayen
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 57287
Join Date: Mar 2004
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Vehicle:
2002 Bugeye STi
MY03 Fozzy XS

Default

Looks like the New Blouch Twin Scroll Housing was made a little larger to accommodate a larger Turbine, per Kev @ ScoobyClinic. Looks like the new SC50 Twin Scroll is probably an actual Dom 2.5XTR now.

Link to Information:
http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...postcount=3452
kayen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2012, 02:23 PM   #593
kayen
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 57287
Join Date: Mar 2004
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Vehicle:
2002 Bugeye STi
MY03 Fozzy XS

Default

ScoobyClinic just tested the new SC36 Billet Twin Scroll Turbo using the new Casted Exhausted Housing.

Link: SC36 Billet Twin Scroll Dyno

Pretty impressive as it net 403bhp on 20% Meth and Full Spool around 3500rpm on the Dyno.
kayen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2012, 08:12 PM   #594
turbogtst
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 43384
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Sydney, Australia
Default

I have been using a kinugawa ts from when they first came out, td05 20g p25 housing, same as they are selling now, no problems what so ever and sure performs well, i also have a vf36 with a 20g wheel in it, i have had both turbos on the car the only difference being part throttle spool with the ball bearing turbo, a bit more responsive. I also have an sr50 twin scroll using modified kinugawa turbine housing, this combination was not as responsive as the other 2 mainly because of of bigger sr50 core but would be good for all out power.
turbogtst is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-10-2012, 11:16 PM   #595
sithspawn
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 163003
Join Date: Oct 2007
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Inland Empire
Vehicle:
2014 FR-S
Hot Lava w/flappy paddles

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by turbogtst View Post
I have been using a kinugawa ts from when they first came out, td05 20g p25 housing, same as they are selling now, no problems what so ever and sure performs well, i also have a vf36 with a 20g wheel in it, i have had both turbos on the car the only difference being part throttle spool with the ball bearing turbo, a bit more responsive. I also have an sr50 twin scroll using modified kinugawa turbine housing, this combination was not as responsive as the other 2 mainly because of of bigger sr50 core but would be good for all out power.
Nice! Thanks for the feedback!
sithspawn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2012, 06:23 PM   #596
BigRigger
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 129969
Join Date: Oct 2006
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: Alberta Canada, Oil Counrty
Vehicle:
2005 Sti
Silver/Black

Default

So are we talking the equivalent of a 16g, 18g, 20g for the SC36, SC42, SC50 but in twinscroll and BB CHRA housings?
BigRigger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2012, 09:19 PM   #597
LIQUIDSK8S
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 22605
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Vehicle:
2002 JDM STI/WRX
WRB

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigRigger
So are we talking the equivalent of a 16g, 18g, 20g for the SC36, SC42, SC50 but in twinscroll and BB CHRA housings?
The SC46 is bigger than a 20g and the SC50 should be even bigger. I'm really looking forward to the numbers from the SC50.
LIQUIDSK8S is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2012, 09:29 PM   #598
BigRigger
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 129969
Join Date: Oct 2006
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: Alberta Canada, Oil Counrty
Vehicle:
2005 Sti
Silver/Black

Default

Oh, nice. Can't wait for some dyno plots on a 2.5 as well.
BigRigger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2012, 12:12 AM   #599
MonkeyHermit
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 155242
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: NJ
Vehicle:
2005 LGT

Default

Blouch/SC46 converted from a VF37 hotside on a 2.5L EFI Logics Stage 1 block. I was hoping for more power, but was told by Chris that the hotside is what's holding it back. The car feels nice, smooth, and responsive. It has power, but is slower than unclematt's setup by a couple hundred RPM's down low (when comparing our dyno runs on EFI's site).

MonkeyHermit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-16-2012, 01:16 AM   #600
Mortal2None
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 190077
Join Date: Sep 2008
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: L.I. N.Y.
Vehicle:
2006 Subaru LGT BP
OBP

Default

Not bad #'s though for only 22-20 PSI. Looks like a sweet ride! The new Blouch hotsides are larger so there may be an upgrade path for you there but the SC46 billet wheel is happy in the 25-26PSI range I thought? Or did Chris feel that the housing was choking flow and could not turn the boost up any higher due to surging/creep?
Mortal2None is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
VF37 Twin Scroll Turbo and New Tomei Twin Scroll headers/Up pipe arco SCIC Private Classifieds 11 10-22-2010 01:09 AM
VF37 Twin Scroll Turbo and New Tomei Twin Scroll headers/Up pipe arco Engine/Power/Exhaust 9 10-02-2009 01:04 PM
twin scroll turbo with dual ball bearing options pjhe Factory 2.5L Turbo Powertrain 25 12-14-2006 09:40 PM
DP options for twin scroll turbo? John2.5RS Subaru Conversions 7 08-24-2006 12:14 AM
Anyone running a stock evo twin scroll turbo on a wrx? mcu81 Factory 2.0L Turbo Powertrain 15 02-09-2006 11:29 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:29 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.