Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Saturday July 26, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Custom Fabrication, Welding & Tools

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-28-2012, 02:39 PM   #1
klarowe
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 284753
Join Date: Jun 2011
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Colonie, NY
Vehicle:
2004 WRX STI
World Rally Blue

Default Custom multi-reservoir

In the near future I am going to be relocating the battery in my 04 STi, possibly rotating the main fusebox 90* to mount where the factory windshield washer reservoir is now, and then making a custom 3 "chamber" reservoir to house my coolant overflow, windshield washer fluid, and methanol. My question is, what metal should I use. I was thinking either aluminum (6061???) or stainless steel. I don't know what the reactivity is like between any of the fluids (especially the glycol in the coolant and the methanol).

What are your opinions? Anyone know if either metal will react with any of the fluids? Also, what thickness should I go with?? I was thinking 1/8" should be plenty, but I'm not sure if it might be too thin...

Thanks in advance.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
klarowe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2012, 04:45 PM   #2
spec.B - autox
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 209699
Join Date: Apr 2009
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Madeira Beach
Vehicle:
2009 STI
DGM

Default

One of the drawbacks of methanol as a fuel is its corrosivity to some metals, including aluminum. Methanol, although a weak acid, attacks the oxide coating that normally protects the aluminium from corrosion:

6 CH3OH + Al2O3 → 2 Al(OCH3)3 + 3 H2O

The resulting methoxide salts are soluble in methanol, resulting in clean aluminum surface, which is readily oxidized by some dissolved oxygen. Also the methanol can act as an oxidizer:

6 CH3OH + 2 Al → 2 Al(OCH3)3 + 3 H2

This reciprocal process effectively fuels corrosion until either the metal is eaten away or the concentration of CH3OH is negligible. Concerns with methanol's corrosivity have been addressed by using methanol compatible materials, and fuel additives that serve as corrosion inhibitors.
spec.B - autox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2012, 06:04 PM   #3
klarowe
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 284753
Join Date: Jun 2011
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Colonie, NY
Vehicle:
2004 WRX STI
World Rally Blue

Default

Its for a water/methanol mixture but I still had a feeling the aluminum could be an issue.... I'm just no chemist so I didn't know the specifics.. lol. So by the sounds of it I'm better off going with stainless?
klarowe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2012, 03:34 AM   #4
WReXd
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 114101
Join Date: May 2006
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Buena Park, CA
Vehicle:
93 Impreza L Swap

Default

Stainless would work. Surprisingly, plastic is also an option. I believe polypropylene would work.
WReXd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2012, 04:08 AM   #5
Awd180
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 282763
Join Date: May 2011
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: USA
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza
Gray

Default

Stainless could be an issue if charged (mounting to frame equals negative charge) and contact with opposite charge = spark. You could insult the mounting connections but polypropylene (plastic) is best.
Awd180 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2012, 04:16 AM   #6
Awd180
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 282763
Join Date: May 2011
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: USA
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza
Gray

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by spec.B - autox
One of the drawbacks of methanol as a fuel is its corrosivity to some metals, including aluminum. Methanol, although a weak acid, attacks the oxide coating that normally protects the aluminium from corrosion:

6 CH3OH + Al2O3 → 2 Al(OCH3)3 + 3 H2O

The resulting methoxide salts are soluble in methanol, resulting in clean aluminum surface, which is readily oxidized by some dissolved oxygen. Also the methanol can act as an oxidizer:

6 CH3OH + 2 Al → 2 Al(OCH3)3 + 3 H2

This reciprocal process effectively fuels corrosion until either the metal is eaten away or the concentration of CH3OH is negligible. Concerns with methanol's corrosivity have been addressed by using methanol compatible materials, and fuel additives that serve as corrosion inhibitors.
Thanks for the detail,
Awd180 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2012, 10:47 AM   #7
klarowe
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 284753
Join Date: Jun 2011
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Colonie, NY
Vehicle:
2004 WRX STI
World Rally Blue

Default

The problem with polypropylene is that I don't have any way to mold it. I would prefer to stick to metal so it can be welded and make it 100x easier to actually fabricate... lol. That is a valid point regarding insulating the mounts to prevent any sparking. I'll def. have to take that into account and throw some quick rubber / plastic washers on all mounting points.
klarowe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2012, 02:06 PM   #8
Awd180
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 282763
Join Date: May 2011
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: USA
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza
Gray

Default

Yeah I was lazy and wrote insult over insulate. But it's on you if you wanna drive around with a pressure vessel. Using washers doesn't insulate the bolt, your still have xx# of charged bolt heads.

Most fuel cells are plastic as well as methanol kits come with a plastic reservoir for a reason.
Awd180 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2012, 07:10 PM   #9
klarowe
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 284753
Join Date: Jun 2011
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Colonie, NY
Vehicle:
2004 WRX STI
World Rally Blue

Default

I know taht using the rubber washers won't insulate the bolts, but using rubber washers (not the 1/2 rubber, 1/2 metal) along with a grommet should solve that problem. And as far as the bolt heads being charged, I guess I don't see the issue there. Even with a plastic reservoir, you still have metal bolt heads being charged. But you now also introduce the issue of static spark. All 3 reservoirs would also have vents since one of the systems are pressurized. But the cost and pain of trying to mold a triple chamber plastic reservoir wouldn't be worth the hassle. But I completely understand where you are coming from.
klarowe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2012, 08:15 PM   #10
Awd180
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 282763
Join Date: May 2011
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: USA
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza
Gray

Default

A 1L reservoir cost around 20$ x 3 60$. Cost of materials for ss idk but close in price.

You won't find a 3 chamber vessel.

I like the look your going for but its something that could build a higher charge than the static charge from a plastic.

Have it plastic coated or a ceramic coating might work as well.
Awd180 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2012, 08:44 PM   #11
klarowe
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 284753
Join Date: Jun 2011
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Colonie, NY
Vehicle:
2004 WRX STI
World Rally Blue

Default

Wow... I actually never though of doing universal reservoirs.. duh. That would actually save quite a bit of $$ since I would only need 2 at that point (reuse factory washer fluid reservoir). And if I really wanted to clean it up I could just build a small cover. Once I do the battery relocation I may just have to take some measurements and see what I can make fit... but that might be the route I take. Thanks for the help!
klarowe is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
FS : 04-05 custom grill Subey03 Exterior/Styling 25 01-31-2013 01:18 PM
FS : WA-08+ Sedan STI Struts modded for wrx, Custom TMIC theotherguy NWIC Private Classifieds 52 06-24-2012 07:10 PM
FS : 2006 Chevrolet Trailblazer SS Custom, 420hp, lots of goodies! TKDKracker007 MWSOC Private Classifieds 0 04-28-2012 12:28 PM
one off custom knob for a customer tom@kartboy Off-Topic 18 12-14-2004 09:27 AM
WRX Turbo kit. TO4R Turbo, Custom upipe and custom downpipe STEALTH-WRX Private 'For Sale' Classifieds 13 03-07-2004 01:03 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:00 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.