Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Sunday April 20, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > Motorsports

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-18-2011, 05:18 PM   #1
jonnies
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 84430
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Brazil
Vehicle:
2006 wrx

Default 4 points harness safe?

Hey guys i have searched a bit here after i bought a pair of takata 4 point harness...... and i just might have discoverd i actually downgrade from oem belt right?(sub marine in case of accident)
i have a wrx 06 heavly mod great pair of bride stradias but no cage. its my weekend car and track car.
so is it safe to use the takata 4 point or am i better with the oem belt?is there any solution or better just sell it?

thanks
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
jonnies is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2011, 05:37 PM   #2
chongl
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 187694
Join Date: Aug 2008
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Socal (SD and 626)
Vehicle:
2009 WRX Sedan
WRB Mica

Default

4 point I would trust would be Scroth ASM....it's legal for street use if you use the release that has "Press" on it in case of emergency.
chongl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2011, 06:29 PM   #3
Carter
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 156708
Join Date: Aug 2007
Chapter/Region: AKIC
Location: Palmer, AK
Vehicle:
2004 Mini Cooper S
Mooney M20F

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by chongl View Post
4 point I would trust would be Scroth ASM....it's legal for street use if you use the release that has "Press" on it in case of emergency.
This. I run Schroth Rallye 3 ASM in my rallycross beater, and they are wonderful for street and racing.
Carter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2011, 08:03 PM   #4
lude4life13
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 255027
Join Date: Aug 2010
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: California
Vehicle:
2003 WRX
WRB

Default

I wouldn't trust it. Takata 4 points are more for show. you can add the sub strap if thats availabe, or get another harness. You should definitely go get a roll bar too if you plan to have a harness. Also, make sure you disconnect your airbag when you are using your harness, as they are not made to work together and can actually harm you.
lude4life13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2011, 10:43 PM   #5
jonnies
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 84430
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Brazil
Vehicle:
2006 wrx

Default

yeah i bought the takata on impulse (and they look goood!!!)
but i guess i will use the oem belts wont risk submarine in case of accident
thanks guys
jonnies is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2011, 12:58 PM   #6
c9ollie
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 251861
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Michigan
Vehicle:
2002 STI Wagon

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jonnies View Post
yeah i bought the takata on impulse (and they look goood!!!)
but i guess i will use the oem belts wont risk submarine in case of accident
thanks guys

I actually work at Takata and I test seatbelts and airbags. The submarining issue can be resolved with the addition of a 5th or 6th anti submarine strap. The issue that arrise with a full harness is the massive neck deflection that occurs in an impact. Most retractors today are an energy management type that pays out the belt in a controll manner to guide you into the airbag. When you are fully strapped in your body isn't allowed to move much. In an impact your torso stays still but your neck snaps forward. If you are going to run a harness I recommend a HANS device and a helmet. Those are impractical for street use. You could always keep both belts in the car. 3point for street and 4/5/6 point, HANS, and helmet for track.
c9ollie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2011, 08:55 PM   #7
growling_boxer
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 165744
Join Date: Dec 2007
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Eastern PA
Vehicle:
2000 LGT
2007 STi

Default

not sure who you track with, but NASA recently changed their rules. originally, they had decided to ban all 4-point harnesses over this winter (it used to be any DOT-approved 4-point was allowed). as of the beginning of May, they loosened the regulations back up a little allow certain 4-point harnesses, but it is very limited. so, you might want to check with whoever you are doing your track days with before installing any 4-point.
growling_boxer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2011, 10:46 PM   #8
rjrutzky
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 30367
Join Date: Nov 2002
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: nashville, tn
Vehicle:
2005 Legacy GT
NASA SE PTB Champ

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by c9ollie View Post
I actually work at Takata and I test seatbelts and airbags. The submarining issue can be resolved with the addition of a 5th or 6th anti submarine strap. The issue that arrise with a full harness is the massive neck deflection that occurs in an impact. Most retractors today are an energy management type that pays out the belt in a controll manner to guide you into the airbag. When you are fully strapped in your body isn't allowed to move much. In an impact your torso stays still but your neck snaps forward. If you are going to run a harness I recommend a HANS device and a helmet. Those are impractical for street use. You could always keep both belts in the car. 3point for street and 4/5/6 point, HANS, and helmet for track.
so 4 points work best when they are 5 or 6 points
rjrutzky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 09:51 AM   #9
c9ollie
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 251861
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Michigan
Vehicle:
2002 STI Wagon

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rjrutzky View Post
so 4 points work best when they are 5 or 6 points
Yeah pretty much. The 4 point harness uses the same cam lock buckle as the 5 and 6 point harnesses. The 5th and 6th antisubmarine conversion straps can be bought from Takata for $57 and 107$ respectably. The cam lock buckle can accommodate the extra straps.

c9ollie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-20-2011, 01:08 PM   #10
Web Foot STi
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 39086
Join Date: Jun 2003
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Portland, OR
Vehicle:
2004 STi
White

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by c9ollie View Post
Yeah pretty much. The 4 point harness uses the same cam lock buckle as the 5 and 6 point harnesses. The 5th and 6th antisubmarine conversion straps can be bought from Takata for $57 and 107$ respectably. The cam lock buckle can accommodate the extra straps.

Boy, Those are expensive crotch straps: http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/gro...upID=HARNLLSUB

I am NOT saying that you should mix and match harness parts between manufactures though. Even if they sorta fit. They are a system.

I have a 6 point and a harness bar for the track/Auto-X/Hillclimb. (With a 6 point the anti-submarine strap can bolt to the front seat belt mounting points with longer 10.9 fasteners. For a 5 point you have to punch a bolt hole in the floor pan.)

The OEM belts are still serviceable per SCCA Solo II Stock rules.
Web Foot STi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2011, 07:54 AM   #11
c9ollie
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 251861
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Michigan
Vehicle:
2002 STI Wagon

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Web Foot STi View Post
Boy, Those are expensive crotch straps: http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/gro...upID=HARNLLSUB

I am NOT saying that you should mix and match harness parts between manufactures though. Even if they sorta fit. They are a system.

I have a 6 point and a harness bar for the track/Auto-X/Hillclimb. (With a 6 point the anti-submarine strap can bolt to the front seat belt mounting points with longer 10.9 fasteners. For a 5 point you have to punch a bolt hole in the floor pan.)

The OEM belts are still serviceable per SCCA Solo II Stock rules.
Yeah they are! I dont even get an employee discount.
c9ollie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2011, 08:23 AM   #12
delongedoug
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 124113
Join Date: Aug 2006
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: To infinity
Vehicle:
and beyond!

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Web Foot STi View Post
Boy, Those are expensive crotch straps: http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/gro...upID=HARNLLSUB

I am NOT saying that you should mix and match harness parts between manufactures though. Even if they sorta fit. They are a system.

I have a 6 point and a harness bar for the track/Auto-X/Hillclimb. (With a 6 point the anti-submarine strap can bolt to the front seat belt mounting points with longer 10.9 fasteners. For a 5 point you have to punch a bolt hole in the floor pan.)

The OEM belts are still serviceable per SCCA Solo II Stock rules.
Aren't the substraps supposed to come ~20* back from vertical? Not forwards.

EDIT: perfect picture



Long story short, I wouldn't run a 4 point for anything but autoX.
delongedoug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2011, 12:33 AM   #13
Web Foot STi
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 39086
Join Date: Jun 2003
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Portland, OR
Vehicle:
2004 STi
White

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by delongedoug View Post
Aren't the substraps supposed to come ~20* back from vertical? Not forwards.

EDIT: perfect picture



Long story short, I wouldn't run a 4 point for anything but autoX.
It's not the vertical. "6-Point Anti-Submarine Belt should be anchored at an angle of 20 degrees behind the Chest Line as measured from the intersection of the Chest Line and the lap belt buckle. Mounts should be approximately 8 to 12 inches apart (approximately located under each hip and as close to the body as possible). Two routing holes in the seat or a special seat mount may be required." http://simpsonraceproducts.com/safet...ing-positions/ .

With my short legs the forward drivers seat mounting points are in about the right place, but running Stock one cannot modify, or change drivers the seat. The straps have to run around the seat squab. The crotch strap keeps the lap belt down on the pelvis when the shoulder harnesses are cinched so things start out in the right spot. One does the best that they can and hopes that Subaru did right by the design of the seat pan. If only Subaru had put a belt pass thru like they did in the seat back.
Web Foot STi is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
wtt: sabelt trw 5 point camlock harness for sabelt, sparco, or momo 4 point harness chompleh TXIC Private Classifieds 21 09-20-2008 03:50 PM
Harness Bar 225$ , Sparco 4 point harness 50$ treicoaie Interior/Dressup/Audio & Security 8 11-28-2007 04:46 PM
Harness bar 225, Sparco 4 point harness 50$ treicoaie SCIC Private Classifieds 1 11-02-2007 10:04 PM
FS: M1 harness bar and SPARCO 4 point harness SPIDEYWrX Interior/Dressup/Audio & Security 7 02-03-2007 12:14 PM
Schroth 4 point harness for harness bar MastroWRX Interior/Dressup/Audio & Security 2 06-15-2004 08:52 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:38 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.