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Old 06-29-2011, 09:31 AM   #1
Sheltonmega
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Default 2009 WRX CBE 93 Stage1 Knocks.

Just installed AP Monday, the car drives good, started to monitor knocks this morning, Cylinder 1 knocks 3 times, 2, 15 times, 3, 7 times and 4, 20 times within 5 miles of conservitive driving.

I assume the ECU is still learning, but is it normal or do I have a more serious problem.

Thanks!
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Last edited by Sheltonmega; 06-29-2011 at 10:12 AM.
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Old 06-29-2011, 11:58 AM   #2
Cobb Tuning
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Hello. Thank you for your purchase!

The knock sum value itself is meaningless because it will increment even at idle/low RPM where the Subaru knock detection set-up cannot accurately distinguish between combustion knock and other engine noise. You need to look at when it is incrementing, putting more emphasis on consistent reported knock at higher load (such as during wide open throttle). Keep in mind that every tune (even the factory tune on a bone stock car) will report knock events on occasion. Some of these will be false knock (especially if it is at lower RPM/load) and some may be actual knock where the ECU takes the appropriate steps to decrease timing (and learn those corrections depending on the conditions).

Bill
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Old 06-29-2011, 02:40 PM   #3
Sheltonmega
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Thanks Bill.

It happens everywhere from 1st gear startup to 5th gear cruise and it's complete random.

The car drives good and more responsive, I am not feeling or hearing anything wrong.

I don't want to push it yet. I want to take it easy for a full tank of gas first.

What is the amount of knocks you think that can be considered noise or can be ignored.

Thanks.
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Old 06-29-2011, 03:19 PM   #4
fenix-silver
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The point is that you can't look at knock count at all really since it can be including false knock at low loads. Do a log of a WOT 3rd gear pull (logging both fine learning and feedback knock) and see what it looks like. Also look at your LearningView.
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Old 06-30-2011, 08:34 AM   #5
Cobb Tuning
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Ignore the actual values. One car could show 100 and another car could show 2 and it is absolutely meaningless. This is because the knock detection set-up sucks at idle and low RPM/load where the knock sum(s) still increment. The engine control unit (ECU) even ignores the report knock events in these areas. Instead, you need to look at WHEN the knock sum(s) increment.

It might be less confusing to look at the knock response by the ECU. You can do this by logging feedback knock correction, fine knock learning, and the dynamic advance multiplier.

Bill
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Old 06-30-2011, 03:12 PM   #6
Phatron
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fenix-silver View Post
Also look at your LearningView.
AP folk dont have Tactrix cables nor Learning View.
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Old 06-30-2011, 08:39 PM   #7
Sheltonmega
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
AP folk dont have Tactrix cables nor Learning View.
I bought this car new, it runs perfect without any problem, I was expecting this mods to be a simple plug and play, guess I have a lot to learn now

Do you suggest a protune for just stage 1? Because those fuzzy terms make no sense to me and I have no idea how to diagnose and tune the car by myself.

Do you know any good tunner in Northen Virginia, D.C. area?

Thanks a lot guys!
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Old 07-02-2011, 02:38 PM   #8
Sheltonmega
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CattedAEMCAIPerrinTMIC93

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Here is a typical knock increment
time A/F BOOST DYNA LRN DYNA ADV FEEDBACK KNOCK KNOCK SUM CYL 2
485.11 15.5 -3.37 2.5 2.32 0 24
485.37 14.36 -0.8 4 2.78 -1.4 25
485.61 14.13 -0.22 4.5 3.31 -1.4 25
485.87 14.24 -0.26 4.5 3.32 -1.4 25
486.11 14.59 -1.03 4 2.76 -1.4 25
486.37 14.7 -2.39 2.5 1.81 -1.05 25


Thanks.
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Old 07-02-2011, 05:01 PM   #9
Cobb Tuning
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheltonmega View Post
Here is a typical knock increment
time A/F BOOST DYNA LRN DYNA ADV FEEDBACK KNOCK KNOCK SUM CYL 2
485.11 15.5 -3.37 2.5 2.32 0 24
485.37 14.36 -0.8 4 2.78 -1.4 25
485.61 14.13 -0.22 4.5 3.31 -1.4 25
485.87 14.24 -0.26 4.5 3.32 -1.4 25
486.11 14.59 -1.03 4 2.76 -1.4 25
486.37 14.7 -2.39 2.5 1.81 -1.05 25


Thanks.
This does not give us enough info to go on. I would upload the entire log (say on google docs). We need RPM, throttle, and calculated load in there as well. However, given the boost shown, this looks like low load.

Bill
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