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Old 03-03-2001, 09:00 PM   #1
Tangmere
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Post GRM says SCCA putting WRX into A Stock

Not that I'm complaining. It certainly doesn't belong in GS with the normally aspirated RS. The Audi TT goes in AS too.
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Old 03-03-2001, 09:12 PM   #2
autorex
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But it was put in GS. Before the classing, I believe that most people thought it would go into AS. However, during the February SEB meeting, it was classed into GS.

Given the time it takes to go to press, I'm sure that GRM put that in way before the meeting.
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Old 03-03-2001, 09:13 PM   #3
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Let hope the PAX is big...otherwise its going to get killed in AS
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Old 03-03-2001, 10:57 PM   #4
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Agreed with autorex, it is a lead time issue. They had to put that text together probably 3 months before it shows up on the newsstand. Perhaps even a bit longer considering that GRM is a bi-monthly mag.

The latest info I have seen from Howard Duncan, the car classification expert is GS for the WRX.
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Old 03-05-2001, 02:22 PM   #5
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I beleive the Type R is/was more dangerous in GS than the WRX could ever be. the ITR has much better handeling out of the box, and the little bit of turbo lag in the WRX wont help it in the low speed tight turns of an Autocross...This is an old worn out debate of the ITR in GS.....the WRX is gonna be in GS, like it or not. If you dont like it move up to STS or STR to get away from it.I did, and now I have an STR prepped Integra GSR to fight with....grrrrrrr
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Old 03-05-2001, 03:52 PM   #6
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I'll be well and truly shocked if a WRX is not faster than a Type R.

<table>
<tr><td><td>WRX<td>ITR
<tr><td>HP <td>227@6000 <td>195@8000
<tr><td>Torque <td>217@4000 <td>130@7500
</table>

The Integra is a lot lighter, but it will need to be and then some.
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Old 03-05-2001, 04:10 PM   #7
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I don't think it would get killed in AS. I think it would kick@ss. I compared my times in STS to a boxer and a S4 in AS here is the KC Region SoloII and I ran about the same times. At the time, I only had springs, catback and an intake.
I would love to run in AS with a WRX on a set of BFG or Kumho race tires and some adjustable struts.

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[This message has been edited by KC_TopDog (edited March 05, 2001).]
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Old 03-05-2001, 04:10 PM   #8
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Faster is not the issue. Comparing stock cars the ITR is amazing. It handles much better than a lot of "mod'ed" cars do. IMHO: The secret to autocross is balance. The ITR does a lot of things really well, where as some other cars are good in one field, but lacking in others. A good AutoX course will challenge all of the fields of a car. Acceleration, corner turn in, handling on throttle, and many more. I will be eager to see what happens.

Jeff
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Old 03-05-2001, 05:31 PM   #9
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Pat-- STS has a very soft PAX, so don't put too much stock in that. Besides, the S4 is one of the many doormats of A Stock. If you want to compare, you should compare to a competitive AS car, like a Porsche 968, Boxster, or Honda S2000. Trust me, the WRX would get annihilated against those cars.

Quote:
The Integra is a lot lighter, but it will need to be and then some.
I think 550lb is sufficiently lighter to make the difference in autocross. Like I said, this year will tell... and we'll also see how the cars stack up in NASA's Touring Car events.
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Old 03-05-2001, 06:03 PM   #10
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ColinL...I totally agree with you...you forgot about a more agile/lighter TT Quattro
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Old 03-05-2001, 06:16 PM   #11
David S. Wallens
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Just another thought: A lot of Stock class ringers aren't dominant during their first year, as it usually takes a little while to get up to speed. For example, the Neon didn't win D Stock until 1996, the Type R didn't win G Stock until 1999, and the MR2 Spyder didn't win B Stock last year. I'm looking at national-level results, so your mileage may vary.

David S. Wallens, managing ed
Grassroots Motorsports www.grassrootsmotorsports.com

[This message has been edited by David S. Wallens (edited March 06, 2001).]
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Old 03-05-2001, 09:55 PM   #12
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Another thing to consider is that you really can't compare the cars at a local level. I really believe the true test is at the National levels where the drivers can really push the car to the limit.

David is right about taking time at the national level. Everybody thought that the new Celica GT would win ES. The old Celica won this past year.

At my local level, I'm looking forward to the car being in GS. One of our best drivers in GS drives a ITR. A friend (who is just as good or better as the ITR) is also getting a ITR. I stink in autocrosses and I'm hoping that I can better judge my skill and improvements against these drivers. I figure I should be able to tell a whole lot better than trying to run in my fully prepped CRX that hides too many of my mistakes.
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Old 03-05-2001, 11:59 PM   #13
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. . .And one more thing, stay on stock tire this year too. 'Nothin' better to show up your mistakes than stock tires, especially RE92's. I plan to use mine up this year and put winter studs on the stock wheels next year.
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Old 03-06-2001, 01:01 AM   #14
David S. Wallens
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When the current issue went to press, the WRX was slated to go into A Stock. Then it was moved to G Stock, but by then the issue was already at the printer. That's why we usually remind people to get the official word from the SCCA, as sometimes things do change at the last minute. Sorry for the confusion.

We can usually make correction up until about two and a half or three weeks before you guys see the mag.

David S. Wallens, managing ed
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Old 03-06-2001, 01:23 AM   #15
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This has been covered, and I don't see the WRX as being any more dangerous than the Integra Type R in GS. This year will tell, and if it turns out to be a year of dominance for the WRX in GS then the stock class reorg will take care of that... assuming it happens in 2002.
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Old 03-06-2001, 11:37 AM   #16
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Colin, where do you get a 550 pound difference from? The published stock weights give a 400 pound difference. Still massive; but is that enough to cancel the 75% peak torque advantage?

'Horsepower sells cars; torque wins races.'
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Old 03-06-2001, 12:05 PM   #17
ColinL
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There is this nifty thing called gearing-- it might be worthwhile to calculate torque at the wheels if you're going to compare. I definitely agree that torque wins races, but a peak torque figure doesn't tell you much. Considering the boost bleedoff, I have trouble believing the dyno chart SOA has published in the WRX brochure.

While you're doing that you might also notice that the ITR has a much closer ratio gearbox, a nice thing for autocross (especially fast ones, like a National Tour event) and particularly useful for roadracing.

At any rate, acceleration is but one thing. Weight works against you in cornering and braking as well, and even a 400lb weight difference could be enough.

And again, let's wait and see.
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Old 03-07-2001, 09:58 PM   #18
ChrisW
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With the WRX going into GS I can tell you that it will be a very potent autoX'er if it handles anything like my AWD talon.
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