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Old 09-20-2011, 10:05 AM   #1
Turn in Concepts
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Default TiC and Global Time Attack – OR – how GST beat the crap out of us

TiC and Global Time Attack – OR – how GST beat the crap out of us

It’s been a frustrating, and busy end of the season for us. We had NASA nationals at mid-ohio where we were plagued for four days with problems of heat, cam timing, blown gaskets, stuck wastegates, and dead turbos. The end result of that venture was a respectable, yet third place, 1:31 and change. Not anywhere near as fast as the 1:28.xx we set there just a few short weeks earlier.

With the end of nationals we rolled into the next weekend which saw us at Autobahn country club for the last seasonal event of Global Time Attack.
The week leading up to this event was action packed to say the least. New turbo center cartridge, new wastegates, some very quick mods to get more cooling air to the back side of the motor, and a plethora of other items that needed to be changed left us exhausted, but we were hopeful that we had finally sorted all the problems with the car.

So after work on Friday we hauled our butts up to Chicago for what was to be an East coast vs West coast Subaru grudge match which turned into “Oh, look, GST made it out. Where’s everyone else?”

For this one we stepped up to the unlimited class. Lots of folks asked us why, and the answer is very simple. We had tires to burn. Our Hoosiers would be dead by spring, and we figured there was no point in buying yet another set of tires just for one event.

That put us head to head against GST. Now, we know the stories, we saw the articles, and we know it’s a quick car, but we thought we at least had a shot…..

Anyway, we started first session, and again no boost control. Brought it in, and we had popped a line to the wastegate.

Fixed it, and for the next session the wastegate stuck open after three laps.

Fixed it, and for the next session we had an exhaust leak. Tony W. beat on it pretty hard, but the leak was huge when he got back in and we only had 15 lbs of boost. Turns out we destroyed a flex section on the headers.

A quick, and very ugly fix put us back out on track, where we turned a 1:28.xx….. and blew out the other flex section leaving us with only 21lbs of boost.

In the mean time GST pulled off a rather quick 1:23-something. On their slow tune. Without pushing too hard. While petting a cat, and playing fetch with the dog while saving children from burning buildings. Yeah… that’s pretty much how it felt to us.

Anyway we fixed the other flex section and called it a day hoping for better luck on Sunday. That was not to be as we awoke to rain, and with that ruination of any chances of going faster.

In the end, our time was rather respectable, and from what we’ve seen we were only one of two cars to go below 1:30 for the whole weekend. I think we might have won something, but I’m not sure. I’m hoping GTA lets us know.

At this point we’re going to take a small break from the race car. Like for a week. Then the whole team is going to sit down, and we’re going to discuss what to do next season. With that being said, we’re at a decision point, and we could use some input.

Option 1 is to continue with the time attack car. If we do our new target will be unlimited classing, and actually build something that can keep up with GST…. Or at least get closer.

Option 2 is to take the old RS we picked up and build it for wheel to wheel racing in something like ST2 class.

Right now about the only thing we’ve decided is that we’ll be racing, and it’ll be in a Subaru.
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Last edited by Turn in Concepts; 09-20-2011 at 10:27 AM.
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Old 09-20-2011, 10:16 AM   #2
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TiC Unlimited Car! I'd love to see that. Ohh, and hanging out with you guys this weekend makes me realize that you are smarter than most everyone else on the planet. That is all.

Dan
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Old 09-20-2011, 10:31 AM   #3
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Stay modified if at all possible. The unlimited cars are fast. Gst had a lot more time in the car. Stay modified, get your car dialed for a full season. Win. Then consider moving up. Modified has some insane cars to deal with as well. Ams. Jc. Lic. Etc.
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:07 AM   #4
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I am like your mom. I say, "Whatever you choose to do, I know you'll be good at it." HAHAHAH

Stay on the time attack trail! You guys have come so far!

Was TH Motorsports there last weekend?
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:10 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Glycerin View Post
I am like your mom. I say, "Whatever you choose to do, I know you'll be good at it." HAHAHAH

Stay on the time attack trail! You guys have come so far!

Was TH Motorsports there last weekend?
TH rolled in Sunday morning in the rain.
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:14 AM   #6
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TH showed up, but shortly thereafter had their engine seize up. They decided to flog a Cayman in the rain instead.

TiC, you guys looked good when you were out there! I say stick with Time Attack. Shoot for the moon in unlimited, sure GST is fast, but their car isn't overly complicated. It won't take a corporate budget to compete against them.

Last edited by xCONWRATHx; 09-20-2011 at 11:31 AM.
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Old 09-20-2011, 01:15 PM   #7
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I am like your mom. I say, "Whatever you choose to do, I know you'll be good at it." HAHAHAH

Stay on the time attack trail! You guys have come so far!

Was TH Motorsports there last weekend?
Yeah I hope to see you guys at more events...I love seeing the evolution of the car.

After 2 sleepless nights in a row of working on the car we got there on sunday to get the car on the track. Unfortunately our motor took a poop and we are back to tare it apart all over again...lol. Its too bad...but we will see what failed this time shortly.

Quote:
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TH showed up, but shortly thereafter had their engine seize up. They decided to flog a Cayman in the rain instead.
It was a 996 Turbo...and it sucked in the rain, even with it being AWD.
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Old 09-20-2011, 01:19 PM   #8
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Option 2

w2w is a whole other world of adrenaline.

You've done well in TA and that car has been pushed to its limits. I think it is time to shift focus and build up a w2w car. New stuff to learn, etc.
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Old 09-20-2011, 01:19 PM   #9
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But yeah I am not too sure what happened with all the other Subaru teams that were supposed to be there. We busted our asses off putting the car together after having a head failure few weeks before hand. We couldn't get there on Saturday but we had the car working Sunday morning.

So what happened to all the other guys???
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Old 09-20-2011, 01:40 PM   #10
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I wish i could have made it out there. I gave my airfare up so we could get Jeff out there to drive. That's how tight things are for all of us out here. So don't feel like you are at a disadvantage because these cars are are so dialed in. We have better weather here, and so west coast teams have been able to advance the learning curve over the last few years. But most of us can't rub two nickels together right now. I do encourage you to to seriously consider staying with the car if you think that your financially able to. Like you said, the "Grudge Match" phenomenon is a catalyst for success for not only your shop, but the series as well! There will be a larger base of contingency sponsors next season i think. GTA is still very new, only a couple of events have been completed. If you liked the format, the people and the overall feel for how things were run last weekend, then it is a good chance that this series will grow some legs next year and be a great venue for your business.
Mike
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Old 09-20-2011, 02:03 PM   #11
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I'd say rebuild the TA car to keep up with GST. If you beat them it would be very rewarding and you could leave TA at the very top of your game. Then take the unlimited car and make it a w2w car
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Old 09-20-2011, 03:16 PM   #12
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I would build another car to run in wheel to wheel or convert the current TA car over. You are in the business of selling parts the last time I checked the web site parts that are more in line with wheel to wheel racing then Unlimited Class TA. Once you step into UL the car will be so detached from what it seems TIC was built on is.
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Old 09-20-2011, 03:42 PM   #13
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I vote GC for unlimited

You know you want to shave the weight and ST2 is so boring from and engineering point of view. Besides, ST2 is completely power/weight driven and you may as well do an ultralight GC with a stock EZ30R.

I see TA as more product development and ST2 as more racing oriented. I guess that would really dictate which way the business should aim it's sites.
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Old 09-20-2011, 04:06 PM   #14
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Build a car for ST2! Honestly, it seems like time attack in the US on the decline. Too much $ to keep up with the front runners and you need so much power to be competitive it's pretty much impossible to make certain cars reliable (subarus).

Build an ST2 car to dethrone the corvettes!
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Old 09-20-2011, 04:07 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gizmotron2030 View Post
I'd say rebuild the TA car to keep up with GST. If you beat them it would be very rewarding and you could leave TA at the very top of your game. Then take the unlimited car and make it a w2w car
Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
I vote GC for unlimited

You know you want to shave the weight and ST2 is so boring from and engineering point of view. Besides, ST2 is completely power/weight driven and you may as well do an ultralight GC with a stock EZ30R.

I see TA as more product development and ST2 as more racing oriented. I guess that would really dictate which way the business should aim it's sites.
So.... you're saying we should do both?
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Old 09-20-2011, 04:09 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
You know you want to shave the weight and ST2 is so boring from and engineering point of view.
How do you figure? IMO, it's more interesting than time attack from an engineering point of view. Instead of being able to throw a million whp at the car, your power level is limited so you need to come up with creative ways to make the car go fast. You can do a lot of cool stuff with no restrictions on aero, suspension, drivetrain, electronics, etc.
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Old 09-20-2011, 05:22 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boost junkie View Post
How do you figure? IMO, it's more interesting than time attack from an engineering point of view. Instead of being able to throw a million whp at the car, your power level is limited so you need to come up with creative ways to make the car go fast. You can do a lot of cool stuff with no restrictions on aero, suspension, drivetrain, electronics, etc.
^+123456789

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turn in Concepts View Post
So.... you're saying we should do both?
If possible, yes! If not:
Step 1: De-throne GST then leave UL TA before they can return the favor.
Step 2: Go w2w and start a hostal take over!

Im sure y'all with do well witch ever you decide but if you can do both, that will boost TiC to whole other level IMO.

P.S. I love the GST car. I always look for them to be at the top of the unlimited class when I check TA results just so I can talk trash to ppl who say subarus aren't good TA cars. TiC, I think what y'all do to to improve your car motivates my friend Mitch (Glycerin) more and more. Y'all are at the top of his conversations all the time. Thats awsome, keep up the good work.
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Old 09-20-2011, 07:04 PM   #18
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Quote:
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So.... you're saying we should do both?
exactly

Quote:
Originally Posted by boost junkie View Post
How do you figure? IMO, it's more interesting than time attack from an engineering point of view. Instead of being able to throw a million whp at the car, your power level is limited so you need to come up with creative ways to make the car go fast. You can do a lot of cool stuff with no restrictions on aero, suspension, drivetrain, electronics, etc.
ok, so ST2 is time attack but with a cap on power to weight...so then it actually takes away many points of ingenuity and pays to the person with the most torque. EG38 here we go again
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Old 09-20-2011, 07:28 PM   #19
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Good times fella's it's always fun to hang out with other Subaru nut's.

I say build your car out for Unlimited AWD TA and turn the heat up on us, I say the more competition the merrier.

Mike
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Old 09-20-2011, 09:36 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gizmotron2030

I think what y'all do to to improve your car motivates my friend Mitch (GLYCERIN) more and more. .
Yeah but hes a horrible driver so he might want to start learning in something other than TA, like... playstation or something. Then maybe give something like auto x a shot.
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Old 09-20-2011, 09:48 PM   #21
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Too much $ to keep up with the front runners and you need so much power to be competitive it's pretty much impossible to make certain cars reliable (subarus).
Hey now, we've run the same engine all year

Mike
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:02 PM   #22
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Yeah but hes a horrible driver so he might want to start learning in something other than TA, like... playstation or something. Then maybe give something like auto x a shot.
HA HA .... HA. Auto X, that fun-knee.
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:29 PM   #23
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Clint gave us an extra 15 whp when he stuck 3 TiC decals on the L. Now if we had the rally pig decal, who knows how much quicker we could have gone. hahaha.

It's cool seeing you guys again. Your car has come a long way since i last saw it at 25 hrs of T-hill.

Congrats on the podium finish!

-Earl
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:44 PM   #24
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frankly guys, i love seeing your updates regarding the car's build for TA.
i love seeing the creative engineering that an unlimited race series like that inspires, just like the days of can-am, there's always going to be teething issues but i'm confident you can push through them.

Don't feel bad, i saw GST's setup at an AZ TA event a year or so ago.. it was insane then, and i can't imagine they got slower..

as much as i love the GD chassis, i do kind of think your putting yourself at a disadvantage using it... i think swapping things to the GC you have sitting around and going from there in the off season may pay off bigger dividends.

i think just the weight loss in switching chassis alone should Merritt you the capability to at least pet a cat.
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Old 09-21-2011, 12:44 AM   #25
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I personally prefer watching wheel-to-wheel battles, but I'd say it depends on the type of driver you have, assuming there is some good competition for both options in your region.
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