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Old 11-03-2011, 10:03 AM   #1
BLPhoto
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Default Car seems slower after Stage 2

Installed turboback last night and flashed to stage 2. Those are my only mods, still running stock airbox and everything. The car doesn't seem to be pulling as hard as stage 1 did. I checked the map version vs. those online and it had the same number but I am going to try to reflash again tonight after downloaded another map. The car is hitting target boost under 4th gear pulls and I don't hear any exhaust leaks under the car. I checked all of my intercooler connections and everything is tight and the hoses are seated as far as they can be.

Any thoughts?
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Old 11-03-2011, 10:14 AM   #2
Cobb Tuning
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Originally Posted by BLPhoto View Post
Installed turboback last night and flashed to stage 2. Those are my only mods, still running stock airbox and everything. The car doesn't seem to be pulling as hard as stage 1 did. I checked the map version vs. those online and it had the same number but I am going to try to reflash again tonight after downloaded another map. The car is hitting target boost under 4th gear pulls and I don't hear any exhaust leaks under the car. I checked all of my intercooler connections and everything is tight and the hoses are seated as far as they can be.

Any thoughts?
Go to "Tune" -> "Show Current Map" on the AccessPORT and report back what map is in the "reflash" slot and what map is in the "realtime" slot. Often, right after reflashing a map, the car can feel a little soft until the ECU learns various funcitons for drive-by-wire throttle and ign. timing (DAM). So, I would give it some time before reflashing another map.

Bill
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Old 11-03-2011, 11:10 AM   #3
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Both maps are Stage 2 93 v300 Boost Select. I am running 93 octane as well. Are there any perameters that I should be logging that can help out if this continues? I looked at DAM and it said 1.0. Not sure what it should read and that was with the car not started and just in the on position so I doubt that is helpful.
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Old 11-03-2011, 01:16 PM   #4
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Is it possible that the map loaded is notfor 2011 sti and for a 2009 or something. Would that make a difference?
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Old 11-03-2011, 02:04 PM   #5
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Run the default selection for logging, and DAM at 1.0 is what you want. Less than one would mean knock.
Unless you accidentally downloaded the 2009 map, I'm pretty certain Cobb doesn't have their maps switched around on the site. Give it some time to learn. Maybe your butt dyno was expecting a bigger whack?
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Old 11-03-2011, 02:06 PM   #6
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Its just that stage 1 felt much faster. Maybe I'm just crazy. I'm going to check all of my work again tonight to make sure nothing looks silly. I'm just wondering if maybe I flashed a wrx map instead of an sti map or something. I didn't download a new map, I just used the one that was already on the AP when I got it. I'll do some logging later this week and make sure everything looks right.
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Old 11-03-2011, 02:52 PM   #7
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Do yourself a favor and go to the Cobb site and download and install the latest 2011 Sti map. Did you buy the AP used? The software is free to download and easy to use.
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Old 11-03-2011, 03:12 PM   #8
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Yeah I have it at home already. Gonna take a look after work. And it was purchased new.
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Old 11-03-2011, 03:42 PM   #9
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Its just that stage 1 felt much faster. Maybe I'm just crazy. I'm going to check all of my work again tonight to make sure nothing looks silly. I'm just wondering if maybe I flashed a wrx map instead of an sti map or something. I didn't download a new map, I just used the one that was already on the AP when I got it. I'll do some logging later this week and make sure everything looks right.
Best thing would be to get a data log. Check out our data logging video below. It will show you how to data log as well as a general overview of the key parameters. Post up your log on google docs and post a link here (make sure you set the permissions to public).

Stage 2 will have a larger powerband than stage 1, so it may just be that it feels slower (even though you are faster) because you don't have as much of an off-on switch in power like the stage 1 tune.

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Old 11-03-2011, 04:01 PM   #10
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Thanks. I watched this earlier today. Very helpful.
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Old 11-03-2011, 04:23 PM   #11
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Run the default selection for logging, and DAM at 1.0 is what you want. Less than one would mean knock.
This is not true.

Cobb does NOT set the IAM/DAM to an initial value of 1. So if its a freshly flashed map, then the IAM may not be 1 yet.
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Old 11-03-2011, 06:57 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLPhoto View Post
Both maps are Stage 2 93 v300 Boost Select. I am running 93 octane as well. Are there any perameters that I should be logging that can help out if this continues? I looked at DAM and it said 1.0. Not sure what it should read and that was with the car not started and just in the on position so I doubt that is helpful.
I was just reassuring him that this was good. I didn't say Cobb sets it to 1.0.
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Old 11-04-2011, 03:48 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLPhoto View Post
Installed turboback last night and flashed to stage 2. Those are my only mods, still running stock airbox and everything. The car doesn't seem to be pulling as hard as stage 1 did. I checked the map version vs. those online and it had the same number but I am going to try to reflash again tonight after downloaded another map. The car is hitting target boost under 4th gear pulls and I don't hear any exhaust leaks under the car. I checked all of my intercooler connections and everything is tight and the hoses are seated as far as they can be.

Any thoughts?
As I recall (folks, correct me if I'm wrong) the power comes on earlier in the rev range with the Stage 1 tune than with Stage 2. So you may just be feeling that you have a bit less power down low.

Personally, I was disappointed with the stage 2 OTS tune. While Stage 1 felt tight and snappy, stage 2 felt a bit vague and sluggish even though I could tell the car was pulling harder. I think it has to do with the fact that at stage 1 the hardware is stock and therefore known. Stage 2 has to deal with any number of different downpipes/TBE's and their different flow characteristics. Basically, I think Stage 1 is more dialed-in. I got a protune and now the car feels good again.

I'm not knocking Cobb's tuning at all. They make great products and really know their stuff. Just my $.02 on the difference between stages 1 and 2.
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Old 11-04-2011, 09:44 PM   #14
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https://docs.google.com/open?id=0Bys...c0MWY0MzZlYjg2

There is the link to a datalog. According to the video I should be concerned with the Feedback Knock readings. Unless I am looking at it wrong. : /

Last edited by BLPhoto; 11-04-2011 at 09:52 PM.
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Old 11-04-2011, 10:43 PM   #15
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Forgot to mention it was a fourth gear pull and it is an STi
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Old 11-04-2011, 11:21 PM   #16
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Your turbo seems to be pushing alot of air.....your load is higher than most stage2 cars....and the g/s is about 20 higher than the last 2011 i did.

The problem is that you're riding the high load column of 3.3 load, but your load is going up to 3.5

Your map needs to be adjusted to be able to decrease the timing at these higher loads, and also to richen up the fueling at higher loads too. In the meantime stop doing WOT pulls. You either need to get ATR and decrease your timing at WOT by 6* or get a protune.

Do you have any other logs with injector duty cycle? You may have a leak and be leaning out.
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Old 11-05-2011, 12:48 AM   #17
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Nope that is the only log I have. Guess I need to find a local tuner then. Or head to Dallas to Cobb. Any possibilities that it could be gas. I'm running 93 octane but not sure of the quality from the gas station
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Old 11-05-2011, 12:56 AM   #18
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It's not the gas....17* is alot to try and run at that load. I usually have it down around 8-10*
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Old 11-05-2011, 12:57 AM   #19
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Anything mechanical I should look at or do you think it is strictly the tune
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Old 11-05-2011, 01:03 AM   #20
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It's definately a possibility that u have a leak but that's still alot of timing. And the colder it gets the more your load is going to increase, but you're stuck riding the 3.3 load column. So the knocking is only gonna get worse.
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Old 11-05-2011, 09:05 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLPhoto View Post
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0Bys...c0MWY0MzZlYjg2

There is the link to a datalog. According to the video I should be concerned with the Feedback Knock readings. Unless I am looking at it wrong. : /
Link doesn't work for me. Can you double check it?

Bill
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Old 11-05-2011, 10:10 AM   #22
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Old 11-05-2011, 10:29 AM   #23
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You have some severe knock events during your WOT run. I would not do anymore aggressive driving at this point.

Your load is also beyond what you should generally be seeing for your car and mods. I am thinking you may have a pretty good boost leak. What happens is that you lose boost before the throttle body and the ECU sees less boost at the MAP sensor and ramps up wastegate duty (up to the high limit) because it thinks you are underboosting and the turbo puts out even more boost and ends outside of its efficiency range (i.e. "blowing hot air"). The MAF sensor reads more airflow and therefore you see the excessive load. The knock is due to the increased charge temps.

You need to get a pressure test of the intake tract done ASAP. A visual inspection of clamps is not enough. Until you get that done, I would try conservatively.

Bill
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Old 11-05-2011, 10:35 AM   #24
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Thanks for the quick response. I will take a look asap. I've been staying out of boost after I looked at the log. I did remove the intercooler during the install. I'll pull it off again when I get home and see if I see anything obvious. If not I'll take it somewhere to get a pressure test.
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Old 11-06-2011, 03:15 PM   #25
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Any thoughts on this? To me it looks like it is better than it was but I'm a complete noobie when it comes to tuning. This was in third gear. I was watching the Fine Knock Learning during a third gear pull in low boost and it didn't register anything beyond 0 so this was with full boost. Which now I'm not hitting target boost anymore, but if it makes it driveable I can live with it.

I pulled the intercooler and inspected everything and retightened the downpipe to turbo bolts. They weren't as tight as they should have been but other than that I didn't really see anything that stood out to me.

Thoughts?



https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...hl=en_US#gid=0
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