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Old 01-19-2012, 02:00 AM   #301
olcyck
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Like it better with a hood scoop. Maybe more like the newer wrx/sti scoops though.
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Old 01-20-2012, 03:34 AM   #302
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Quick photoshop


Look its a Subion!
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Old 01-20-2012, 02:15 PM   #303
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i think it is the closest that subaru got to make car with sexy sporty lines, but it still have some of that awkward gtr look in the back
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Old 01-21-2012, 01:12 PM   #304
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Look its a Subion!
Scibaru - Cyberoo.
I would still buy the subaru version over the Scion.
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Old 01-22-2012, 08:18 PM   #305
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I may be in the minority here, but I am pretty disappointed this car is going to be selling in the sub 30k price range. I feel like with it's low curb weight, a 320-350 HP engine, upscale interior (sorry interior of this car looks absolutely awful even compared to my 11' wrx) and a 40k price tag, it would definitely fill a niche sports car enthusiasts are looking for. It would be able to compete with cars costing 60k+. I don't see this as being a "2nd" fun car for anyone who can afford a weekend warrior. It is going to be a cheap DD for people who can afford one low car payment and are willing to sacrifice useability for looks and some handling benefit.


I realize this was never the intention for the vehicle from the start, but the foundation is there. At the end of the day, as a car enthusiast, I just can't get excited over an underpowered 22k car with no racing heritage.
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Old 01-22-2012, 10:29 PM   #306
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Originally Posted by catinthehat View Post
I may be in the minority here, but I am pretty disappointed this car is going to be selling in the sub 30k price range. I feel like with it's low curb weight, a 320-350 HP engine, upscale interior (sorry interior of this car looks absolutely awful even compared to my 11' wrx) and a 40k price tag, it would definitely fill a niche sports car enthusiasts are looking for. It would be able to compete with cars costing 60k+. I don't see this as being a "2nd" fun car for anyone who can afford a weekend warrior. It is going to be a cheap DD for people who can afford one low car payment and are willing to sacrifice useability for looks and some handling benefit.


I realize this was never the intention for the vehicle from the start, but the foundation is there. At the end of the day, as a car enthusiast, I just can't get excited over an underpowered 22k car with no racing heritage.
as much as i disagree with your conclusions, i do think youre very right here. and i cant really argue with your call to increase the value of the car: despite its much lower price point, for me the brz sti really needs to compete with the cayman for thrills and chills. its kind of down to those 2 and i really just want the one that i am simply going to enjoy driving more, regardless of price or stigma. and i do think losing a large amount of customers in similar positions will be the main thing to hurt brz sales. but to say subaru should have made a 350 hp lexus coupe instead of this is not a part of the same foundation.

in reflecting on this continued 'underpowered'/'drivers car'/'you dont get it' back and forth nonesense, i guess it really comes down to one thing for the person considering this cars market - are you more concerned with weight or power? will you have your new subaru coupe ala elise or ala C6 vette?

im here for the former.
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Old 01-23-2012, 04:55 PM   #307
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catinthehat View Post
I may be in the minority here, but I am pretty disappointed this car is going to be selling in the sub 30k price range. I feel like with it's low curb weight, a 320-350 HP engine, upscale interior (sorry interior of this car looks absolutely awful even compared to my 11' wrx) and a 40k price tag, it would definitely fill a niche sports car enthusiasts are looking for. It would be able to compete with cars costing 60k+. I don't see this as being a "2nd" fun car for anyone who can afford a weekend warrior. It is going to be a cheap DD for people who can afford one low car payment and are willing to sacrifice useability for looks and some handling benefit.


I realize this was never the intention for the vehicle from the start, but the foundation is there. At the end of the day, as a car enthusiast, I just can't get excited over an underpowered 22k car with no racing heritage.
Give it time.
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Old 01-24-2012, 11:59 AM   #308
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Originally Posted by aesthetect View Post
despite its much lower price point, for me the brz sti really needs to compete with the cayman for thrills and chills. its kind of down to those 2 and i really just want the one that i am simply going to enjoy driving more, regardless of price or stigma. and i do think losing a large amount of customers in similar positions will be the main thing to hurt brz sales. but to say subaru should have made a 350 hp lexus coupe instead of this is not a part of the same foundation.

in reflecting on this continued 'underpowered'/'drivers car'/'you dont get it' back and forth nonesense, i guess it really comes down to one thing for the person considering this cars market - are you more concerned with weight or power? will you have your new subaru coupe ala elise or ala C6 vette?

im here for the former.
I probably should clarify that I do own a 2006 Lotus Exige, and I was looking for similar styling cues for the interior. Basically no nonsense and quality materials reflective of a sporty car mindful of its diet. We don't need all the extra weight and dazzle an IS350 or IS-F's interior has to have a quality, clean interior.

I spot on agree that the BRZ STI should be competing with cars such as the Cayman (Cayman R in my opinion). It certainly boils down to which one will be more fun to drive.

In regards to your comment about elise vs C6 vette:

My model year Exige came from the factory with 190 crank HP and approximately 2k lb curb weight. Having said that, the experience driving one is unlike any other street vehicle on the road. The car is light enough not to need power steering, and steering feedback doesn't get much better than that (although 3 point turns can be a pain!). I am and have always been a fan of "drivers" cars, a la my old e36 M3. Having said that, even 190 HP in a 2k lb car gets old quickly. I was not "satisfied" with the car's overall performance until I upgraded to around 290 WHP. At that power level, I was able to keep up with Z06's on the straightaways of my local tracks I frequent 3-4 times a year (also I would not consider myself great on the track by any stretch, I just like to have fun!). I cannot say if my feeling here is shared by the majority of Lotus owners, but I can say that my sentiment is shared by many in the online community.

While you suggest an Elise vs vette car markets, I guess I am saying I am looking for something in-between. I would be exiled for saying this in a Lotus forum, but the Exige has become a little too flashy for my taste. You have to be very careful where you park at all times, and god forbid there is any rain because it is going take some rally skills navigating the freeways (ask me how I know ). I only track the car 3-4 times a year, which I'm guessing is much more than the standard Lotus owner anyway, but it still just isn't enough for me to justify the drawbacks from living in a world with high driveway ramps, theft, and inclement weather. I like the BRZ concept because it is not as flashy but still looks great, their curb weight is still within the realm of what would seem to give excellent driver feedback, not to mention other aspects (RWD) Subaru is focusing on to really drive home the experience of the vehicle.

I know at 200 HP I personally will not be satisfied with the performance of the BRZ, and at that level you are really competing with the likes of the Miata. Hey the Miata is a great car as well for what it is, I just feel like competing in that car market is beneath what the BRZ is capable of.
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Old 01-24-2012, 03:44 PM   #309
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Interesting discussion for sure.
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Old 01-24-2012, 04:49 PM   #310
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Interesting discussion for sure.
Anyone know if this car will be shown at the Canadian International Car Show in Toronto next month?
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Old 01-26-2012, 01:49 AM   #311
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yuck...its like a Scion coupe and a 350z had a threesome with a subaru with a porsche boxster engine LOLZ... ill stick to my bugeyes and RS coupes!! plus im sure the mod markets gona suck for the $$ too.
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Old 01-28-2012, 07:56 PM   #312
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finally, subaru is showing what their naturally aspirated engines can show in performance. a turbo on that bitch would be pretty sweet though. i bet soon enough people will be fabricating their own turbo setups on these when they hit stateside.
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Old 01-28-2012, 10:47 PM   #313
daavve31
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Sti version is already in the make
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:59 PM   #314
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The comparisons to the Elise or Exige is funny as far as supporting the argument that it does not need more HP but the Lotus pair is both available to be modified with a supercharger at an authorised lotus dealer and with full factory warranty.
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Old 01-29-2012, 05:20 PM   #315
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I've noticed something over the years. When Subaru comes out with a new model or even a facelift, people will love it or hate it, but in the long run, almost ALL people will love it because it's a quirky, fun bunch of engineering that can out-perform it's design specs with some gentle coaxing.
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Old 01-29-2012, 06:13 PM   #316
catinthehat
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The comparisons to the Elise or Exige is funny as far as supporting the argument that it [the BRZ] does not need more HP
Who said that...?
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Old 01-29-2012, 06:49 PM   #317
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Who said that...?

Im sorry for not reading your whole post but rather I skimmed the first paragraph. I'm guilty of doing the one thing that really irritates me on this forum. However I am willing to admit my mistake and agree that you and I are on the same page (even if I'm just skimming it)
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Old 01-30-2012, 02:40 AM   #318
my name is joe
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Originally Posted by 02baruRS View Post
finally, subaru is showing what their naturally aspirated engines can show in performance. a turbo on that bitch would be pretty sweet though. i bet soon enough people will be fabricating their own turbo setups on these when they hit stateside.
I'm sure hks will make it before the car even gets here.
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Old 01-30-2012, 02:53 AM   #319
catinthehat
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Im sorry for not reading your whole post but rather I skimmed the first paragraph. I'm guilty of doing the one thing that really irritates me on this forum. However I am willing to admit my mistake and agree that you and I are on the same page (even if I'm just skimming it)
No problem, we all have those days I am impressed you know about the factory supercharger option though. Most car enthusiasts don't even know those motors come supercharged
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Old 01-30-2012, 01:08 PM   #320
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I can't wait for STI version to come out
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Old 01-31-2012, 12:47 PM   #321
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My next scob scobby doop doop!


Just after my Abarth....this will be next to it in the garage! for Sunday rides and church time! (no track or midnight freeway runs or canyon escapades or ....or ....or...Mountain attacks or...or)
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Old 01-31-2012, 01:16 PM   #322
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Originally Posted by Jake1050 View Post
The comparisons to the Elise or Exige is funny as far as supporting the argument that it does not need more HP but the Lotus pair is both available to be modified with a supercharger at an authorised lotus dealer and with full factory warranty.
i wasn't trying to reinforce the idea that the BRZ doesnt need more power, so much as describing a fundamental difference in enthusiast enjoyment/motivations. realistically, its hard to say any car wouldnt be more fun with more power. although subaru stated that more power would ruin the balance of the brz, i'm not sure I buy that. but personally i do value fuel economy, and low speed cornering fun around town and thus prefer gains in motorsports credential to come through weight reductions and mechanical design than sheer power.

honeslty i would be surprised if a forced induction version never comes out of either camp (esp a supercharged toyota), but personally id still prefer a NA with even more weight reduction ..if thats possible
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Old 02-01-2012, 11:25 AM   #323
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I thought they talked about the possibility of dropping more weight and raising the rev limit to like 9k?
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Old 02-02-2012, 12:37 AM   #324
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catinthehat View Post
I may be in the minority here, but I am pretty disappointed this car is going to be selling in the sub 30k price range. I feel like with it's low curb weight, a 320-350 HP engine, upscale interior (sorry interior of this car looks absolutely awful even compared to my 11' wrx) and a 40k price tag, it would definitely fill a niche sports car enthusiasts are looking for.
I think, from reading the words of the chief engineer on this project, which I linked pages ago, Toyota/Subaru felt this has already been done. You can have the 370Z, or the G37 coupe if you want a 4 seater. I am further guessing that if they gave it the 330HP or whatever, up goes the price, then up goes the trim level required for the buyer that will pay that price...and the weight would be up around 370Z so there you have just built a 370Z.

Seems they have specifically built something more modest. Also they have built something for the owners to build on. That has warranty implications but there you go.
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Old 02-03-2012, 12:03 AM   #325
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Not sure if this article is posted here anywhere, but it's been posted on ClubSub in New Zealand and makes for very interesting reading. Especially once you realize this was a car that is created to be changed and was not created to make Toyota, or probably Subaru, a great deal of money. I think it's a great idea to let the user decide what their car needs.

Quote from article:

“The 86 was such a popular maniac car not because of what the maker did, but what the users did with it. It created its own aftermarket and a tuner industry. The idea of the FT-86 is basically the same. We want to create a car that is easy for people to tune and to play with.”

Check it out: http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/201...hief-engineer/
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