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Old 12-30-2011, 10:29 AM   #1
neko
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Default Could it still be anything but a blown HG...?

So, ej20g (orig: wrx wagon) in a RS chassis. RS rad, overflow tank on EJ fed from outlet/cap on RS rad, cap modified not to seal rad.

Symptoms: will push coolant out rad cap all over front corner of engine bay. Isn't a constant thing, and the car will run and drive around smoothly without doing it, until i get on boost, then it happens. If i were to just take a 20min drive and keep my foot out of it, the engine bay would be clean. It will also push coolant out long before the rad or engine outlet pipe will even get too hot to touch.

Anything but a HG failure?
I'm aware of the composite, failure-prone HG on the ej20g's, and i just want to make sure i try everything possible before resorting to pulling the motor and installing the MLS HG's.
(also, where the best/cheapest place to purchase the MLS HG's?)
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Old 12-30-2011, 02:12 PM   #2
TommyAtomic
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Defective Rad Cap?
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Old 12-30-2011, 03:23 PM   #3
scoobydorift
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You could try a compression test with all the plugs out to see if it is leaking into the coolant passages. Also generally with a headgasket failure, you push oil into the coolant, so you should notice a film or blobs of oil in the overflow or at the highest point in the system. I would also try a new radiator cap, even when it opens, it should not push coolant anywhere but the vent line, so if it is leaking past the cap seals, it sounds like a bad cap.

I have had this problem before as well, I just bent the small tabs on the radiator cap inwards to create a better seal from the cap to the radiator.

Hope this helps.
Thanks,
Rick
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Old 12-30-2011, 03:24 PM   #4
scoobydorift
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Also, we have the MLS EJ20G headgaskets in stock and ready to go.

http://www.rallysportdirect.com/Come...-WRX-2002-2005
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Old 12-30-2011, 10:49 PM   #5
neko
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Well, being as its a RS radiator setup, my "rad" cap is not a pressure relief cap. its gutted and just does bypass to the tank.. which never vents any coolant (and has a 1.1bar regular press-relief cap on it). And yeah, its got the tabs bent in extra and seats down pretty well, i hope. And yes, i've used several caps, same result.

scoobydorift, i'd rather use the oem ej20g STi MLS gaskets, not the cometic ones. Enuf people seem to have issues with using the cometic on anything but a freshly machined head/block.

Lastly. Here's what i discovered today. Drove it around. Runs fine if i stay out of boost n drive around, stays clean.. Can't even get the rad to really warm up when i'm sitting there idling after driving to the point where i can't touch it. Hot on the outlet hose and that side of the rad, but not hot like my STi is after normal driving (can't leave my hand on the rad or hose).

Now, if i just park it, and rev the motor to around 3-4k, even hold it there for a few moments.. nothing happens. But if i rev it higher, say 6-7k? it just sprays coolant out of the rad cap... Can do this at will, repeatedly, if need be.

Am i over pressurizing as soon as the turbo begins to build a tad bit of boost? (ej20g, oem stock td04 turbo, if it matters to anyone)

Interesting development, i'd say. Wish i could tell if it has to do with boost, regardless of rpm, but i can't do that while driving, and looking under the hood. (well, unless i took my hood off. But that would make quite the mess of the outside of the car i bet...)
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Old 12-31-2011, 06:45 AM   #6
eg33GC
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I use a 1.4 bar cap, L rad, no water box, and I push coolant after 10lbs.

I have comp in the 160s. I burn 0 fluids.

I think my radiator is cracked
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Old 12-31-2011, 12:26 PM   #7
neko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eg33GC View Post
I think my radiator is cracked
I've thought about slim the overflow tank, but instead, I've got a koyo rs-style rad on the way, and I'll just add an extra nipple to it so I can use it properly like the current WRX setups are. I'll install that and a new thermostat, just to be sure, but I'm not thinkin that's gonna fix it in anyway.

The real question is do I stick with my ej20g heads n wiring/ecu when I change the head gaskets? Or switch over to 205 heads/manifold/ecu/etc. has some advantages...
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Old 12-31-2011, 01:11 PM   #8
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I have read quite a bit about the failures of the cometic gaskets as well but when I looked at his link those look to have a coating over the steel just like the oem which should help with the sealing issues, scoobydorift can you confirm or deny this?
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Old 12-31-2011, 01:31 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neko View Post
The real question is do I stick with my ej20g heads n wiring/ecu when I change the head gaskets? Or switch over to 205 heads/manifold/ecu/etc. has some advantages...
I had this same thought it does definately have some advantages as far as ease of tuning as well as parts and a possible higher redline with a rebuild. or you could pick up a set of ej20k heads and not have to change out the rest of the stuff parts go back to easy and cheap since they share valve train with the ej25d and according to marnix if you really want to get wild you can use ez30 exhaust buckets to switch over to shim less. Remind me what are you tuning with? Are you still on the stock jdm ecu, do you have a power FC, or something else?
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Old 12-31-2011, 03:44 PM   #10
neko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spackyscooby View Post
I had this same thought it does definately have some advantages as far as ease of tuning as well as parts and a possible higher redline with a rebuild. or you could pick up a set of ej20k heads and not have to change out the rest of the stuff parts go back to easy and cheap since they share valve train with the ej25d and according to marnix if you really want to get wild you can use ez30 exhaust buckets to switch over to shim less. Remind me what are you tuning with? Are you still on the stock jdm ecu, do you have a power FC, or something else?
What's the advantage in 20k heads? Do they tolerate any higher revving? (could use 207 heads, they do)
As far as the EM, running stock td04-wagon ecu now, but as soon as I get this straightened out, I'll be switching to the oem td05, and a tuned oem ecu that will handle that and some STi injectors. If I can push around 300 crank, that should be fast enuf to be fun for a bit.
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Old 12-31-2011, 05:29 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spackyscooby View Post
I have read quite a bit about the failures of the cometic gaskets as well but when I looked at his link those look to have a coating over the steel just like the oem which should help with the sealing issues, scoobydorift can you confirm or deny this?
Correct, they will come with a flouroelastomer rubber based material (Viton) coating on both sides of the gasket. I have always run the OEM EJ20G gaskets and never had any problems, but have wanted to give these Cometics a try to see how they work out.

Thanks,
Rick
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Old 12-31-2011, 07:44 PM   #12
eg33GC
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Rick, have you used the cometics yourself? I am interested in grabbing a set.
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Old 12-31-2011, 10:27 PM   #13
spackyscooby
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neko View Post
What's the advantage in 20k heads? Do they tolerate any higher revving? (could use 207 heads, they do)
As far as the EM, running stock td04-wagon ecu now, but as soon as I get this straightened out, I'll be switching to the oem td05, and a tuned oem ecu that will handle that and some STi injectors. If I can push around 300 crank, that should be fast enuf to be fun for a bit.
The advantage of the 20k heads is that they moved away from the hla design that the 20g heads have so the possibility for higher revving is there and since they are still phase 1 you don't have to change out you I.M., sensors, or wiring. also the 20g I.M. is supposed to be one of the best flowing OEM manifolds made but unless you are going for big power this is probably not issue. If you get 20k sti heads they will have a shim under bucket design, the wrx is shim over. I was actually going to do the 205 head swap at one point but since I already have a Link wired in and running things so a way to tune was not an issue the 20k heads will meet all of my goals easily with some porting and a refresh using supertech parts for the ej25d and will be cheaper than swapping out everything for the 205 heads and then buying an A.P. for tuning (a working obd2 port would be kinda nice). If you plan on staying ~300 hp and really want to switch heads I would stick with the 20k heads so you don't have to buy and swap all the other stuff and I believe rob's tune would be great. If you want more the 20k heads will definately handle it but at some point you will need a power FC/standalone would be needed. where if you do the 205 you could obviously use opensource or get an A.P. either way it will boil down to whether you would rather spend more now and do the 205 or possibly spend more later on a high end standalone with the 20k heads.
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Old 01-01-2012, 08:45 AM   #14
neko
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Yeah, already got O.S. equipment on hand, and even full ej205 engine loom(s) actually. (needed plugs for 205 coilpack conversion)
So halfway there. Would be nice to be able to run a big tmic...
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Old 01-01-2012, 01:30 PM   #15
scoobydorift
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eg33GC View Post
Rick, have you used the cometics yourself? I am interested in grabbing a set.
No, never used the Cometics unfortunately, and I would be interested to see any reviews on them as well.

Thanks,
Rick
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Old 01-03-2012, 07:31 PM   #16
johnkaldar
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I have used the cometic gaskets twice with no issues.
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Old 01-03-2012, 08:28 PM   #17
neko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnkaldar View Post
I have used the cometic gaskets twice with no issues.
Pull apart block, install new HG? Or actual machine work done on head/block mating surfaces, then reassembled?
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Old 01-04-2012, 04:10 PM   #18
johnkaldar
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Just pull apart and put back the first time. Only honed bores and crank work the second time
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Old 01-04-2012, 04:18 PM   #19
neko
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hmm. thats good to hear. Cometics are easier to get ahold of, but like i mentioned initially, i've heard of a few folks having issues getting them to seal up good, so i wanted to select the oem gaskets if at all possible. )
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