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Old 01-01-2012, 07:47 PM   #1
indianlarry
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Default fine knock on stage 2

hello, i did a few data logs with the AP, and i have found i high fine knock readings some up to 4.92. im unsure of what i should do to counteract the fine knock. car info- 02 wrx stage 2, with k&n intake, and HKS BOV running on cobb's stage 2 93 octane map

here is the link to the log file
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...hl=en_US#gid=0
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Last edited by indianlarry; 01-01-2012 at 09:47 PM.
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Old 01-01-2012, 10:47 PM   #2
bobssecrtsn
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you should put the stock BOV on. did you have an up-pipe installed? if so you should have the tune to stage 1.

and your data log is way to long, you should run it from 2000rpms- 6-7k rpms. 3rd GEAR
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Old 01-01-2012, 10:56 PM   #3
indianlarry
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i dont have the stock BOV valve or stock intake. It has the stock up pipe on it, with a turbo back exhaust, so im running the stage 2 map. the knocks are are row 844 and 1049

Last edited by indianlarry; 01-01-2012 at 11:02 PM.
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Old 01-01-2012, 11:39 PM   #4
bobssecrtsn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indianlarry View Post
i dont have the stock BOV valve or stock intake. It has the stock up pipe on it, with a turbo back exhaust, so im running the stage 2 map. the knocks are are row 844 and 1049
I've read that the stock up-pipe has a cat in it, and it detaches and if it goes into the turbo = bad.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1019991

i know its nothing to do with your fine knock. but just letting you know if your upping the boost!
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Old 01-01-2012, 11:48 PM   #5
bobssecrtsn
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btw can you really redo a data log, it looks like your going WOT and letting go of the gas acouple times, please redo a log. in 3rd gear.

2000-red line please!
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Old 01-02-2012, 12:09 AM   #6
indianlarry
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Originally Posted by bobssecrtsn View Post
btw can you really redo a data log, it looks like your going WOT and letting go of the gas acouple times, please redo a log. in 3rd gear.

2000-red line please!
ill redo one tomorrow

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobssecrtsn View Post
I've read that the stock up-pipe has a cat in it, and it detaches and if it goes into the turbo = bad.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1019991

i know its nothing to do with your fine knock. but just letting you know if your upping the boost!
yes!! thank you i was actually wondering if there was a cat in there or not
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Old 01-02-2012, 10:39 AM   #7
Cobb Tuning
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indianlarry View Post
hello, i did a few data logs with the AP, and i have found i high fine knock readings some up to 4.92. im unsure of what i should do to counteract the fine knock. car info- 02 wrx stage 2, with k&n intake, and HKS BOV running on cobb's stage 2 93 octane map

here is the link to the log file
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...hl=en_US#gid=0
Hello. Your log shows some erratic and extreme long-term fuel trims (as high as 14% in parts of the log). The K&N intake could be the problem as it is not compatible with our off-the-shelf maps for this car (only the stock and Cobb SF intake are). The map has to be tuned correctly for the intake otherwise airflow/load will be off, which means timing/fuel will be off as well. This can be dangerous. You will need to switch to the stock or Cobb SF intake or get a custom tune done for the K&N intake.

Also, check out our logging video. It gives you the basics about logging and an explanation about some of the more important parameters:

Bill
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Old 01-02-2012, 05:37 PM   #8
indianlarry
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobb Tuning View Post
Hello. Your log shows some erratic and extreme long-term fuel trims (as high as 14% in parts of the log). The K&N intake could be the problem as it is not compatible with our off-the-shelf maps for this car (only the stock and Cobb SF intake are). The map has to be tuned correctly for the intake otherwise airflow/load will be off, which means timing/fuel will be off as well. This can be dangerous. You will need to switch to the stock or Cobb SF intake or get a custom tune done for the K&N intake.

Also, check out our logging video. It gives you the basics about logging and an explanation about some of the more important parameters:
AskCOBB - Subaru Data Logging - YouTube

Bill
thanks bill, ive ran another log today 3rd gear pull 2k to 6k and ive found similar results. I have been looking over the acesstuner calibration and tuning guide, and in the sensor calibration sheet, the table on the top right shows me that i should put in my AFR ratio at the specified MAF voltage and the AFR shown in the fuel table, which gives me a multiplier, and i then apply the multiplier to my stage 2 map. would this be the correct way to retune the AFR for the use of the k&n intake?
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Old 01-02-2012, 09:35 PM   #9
Cobb Tuning
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indianlarry View Post
thanks bill, ive ran another log today 3rd gear pull 2k to 6k and ive found similar results. I have been looking over the acesstuner calibration and tuning guide, and in the sensor calibration sheet, the table on the top right shows me that i should put in my AFR ratio at the specified MAF voltage and the AFR shown in the fuel table, which gives me a multiplier, and i then apply the multiplier to my stage 2 map. would this be the correct way to retune the AFR for the use of the k&n intake?
That is how you would do it in open loop, but you must have a wideband o2 sensor in order to do so. The factory o2 sensor is not accurate enough under any appreciable boost (i.e. pretty much any time in open loop) and is also limited to a reading of 11:1 on the rich side by the ECU. You can use the front o2 sensor to tune closed loop (i.e. idle/cruise) which is typically done by looking at both A/F Learning 1 + A/F Correction 1 and trying to get this sum as close to zero as possible.

Bill
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Old 01-02-2012, 11:14 PM   #10
Cobb Tuning
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Hey bud, can you also verify which version of the map you're using? The latest for your car is v310 and was released somewhat recently. If you don't have v310, you can get them from www.cobbtuning.com/support. Let us know!

Cheers

Lance
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Old 01-02-2012, 11:29 PM   #11
indianlarry
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobb Tuning View Post
That is how you would do it in open loop, but you must have a wideband o2 sensor in order to do so. The factory o2 sensor is not accurate enough under any appreciable boost (i.e. pretty much any time in open loop) and is also limited to a reading of 11:1 on the rich side by the ECU. You can use the front o2 sensor to tune closed loop (i.e. idle/cruise) which is typically done by looking at both A/F Learning 1 + A/F Correction 1 and trying to get this sum as close to zero as possible.

Bill
i have a wideband 02 installed and it is hooked up to my zeitronix module, couldnt i hook up my MAF sensor to my zeitronix module, thus having an accurate reading of my realtime AFR along with my MAF voltage? and a quick question, the cobb tuning worksheet shows that i take my measured AFR and the AFR shown in the primary fuel table, but i cant find where to get the values from the primary fuel table?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobb Tuning View Post
Hey bud, can you also verify which version of the map you're using? The latest for your car is v310 and was released somewhat recently. If you don't have v310, you can get them from www.cobbtuning.com/support. Let us know!

Cheers

Lance
hello, yes i am using the v310

thanks for the help fellas
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:03 AM   #12
Cobb Tuning
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indianlarry View Post
i have a wideband 02 installed and it is hooked up to my zeitronix module, couldnt i hook up my MAF sensor to my zeitronix module, thus having an accurate reading of my realtime AFR along with my MAF voltage? and a quick question, the cobb tuning worksheet shows that i take my measured AFR and the AFR shown in the primary fuel table, but i cant find where to get the values from the primary fuel table?
The ECU uses MAF voltage to determine airflow. MAF voltage can only be determined by a MAF sensor properly installed in the intake tract. You can determine the current targeted AFR by logging "Commanded Fuel Final" (which is what you'll have to do in open loop). In closed loop, I would just look at A/F Learning 1 + A/F Correction 1 and getting that as close to zero as possible. You can determine if you are in closed or open loop by logging the "Closed/Open Loop Switch".

Bill
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