Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Saturday December 27, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Subaru Models > Impreza Forum

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-01-2013, 11:55 PM   #4326
jsteg
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 329271
Join Date: Aug 2012
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Lady's Island, SC
Vehicle:
2012 Impreza Limited
Ice Silver Metallic

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post

Very articulate.
I wasn't trying to be. I simply thought it was funny!
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
jsteg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2013, 01:19 AM   #4327
G2Spfld
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 354284
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Midwest
Vehicle:
2013 Imp Sport CVT
SWP

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post

Very articulate.
I would refrain from criticizing others "post grammar" if I were you. The typical modus operandi, if you don't like the response then attack the person. It's ok that you have your opinion, but its also ok when most others disagree with it.
G2Spfld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2013, 02:14 AM   #4328
stevehnm
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 329526
Join Date: Aug 2012
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Ground Control
Vehicle:
2013 Impreza Spt cvt
Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by G2Spfld View Post
I would refrain from criticizing others "post grammar" if I were you. The typical modus operandi, if you don't like the response then attack the person. It's ok that you have your opinion, but its also ok when most others disagree with it.
I concur with that... it was my point exactly - a personal attack.
stevehnm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2013, 10:28 AM   #4329
jsteg
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 329271
Join Date: Aug 2012
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Lady's Island, SC
Vehicle:
2012 Impreza Limited
Ice Silver Metallic

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post

I concur with that... it was my point exactly - a personal attack.
Dude all I did was laugh! Get over yourself, it wasn't a personal attack. You need some thicker skin bo!
jsteg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2013, 01:28 PM   #4330
richde
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 79498
Join Date: Jan 2005
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: SCIC's trashy neighbor
Vehicle:
2013 XV Silver Slug
'84 Porsche 911-sorta red

Default

The actual Impreza CVT mileage problem:

Quote:
Originally Posted by alymida View Post
I have just over 2000 miles on my 2013 Impreza Sport Limited that I bought a few months ago, and my regular average is 27mpg on a tank. I have a hard time keeping my foot out of it but I use the paddle shifters about 70% of the time. Not my first CVT, I upgraded from a Prius to my Sub hahaha.
richde is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2013, 01:33 PM   #4331
stevehnm
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 329526
Join Date: Aug 2012
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Ground Control
Vehicle:
2013 Impreza Spt cvt
Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by alymida View Post
I have just over 2000 miles on my 2013 Impreza Sport Limited that I bought a few months ago, and my regular average is 27mpg on a tank. I have a hard time keeping my foot out of it but I use the paddle shifters about 70% of the time. Not my first CVT, I upgraded from a Prius to my Sub hahaha.
Do you drive it the same way you drove your Prius? Use cruise control a lot?
stevehnm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2013, 06:36 PM   #4332
hemophilic
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 301213
Join Date: Nov 2011
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Raleigh, NC
Vehicle:
2012 Imp. Sp. Ltd.
Blue/Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post

I concur with that... it was my point exactly - a personal attack.
Ok so it was a bit ad hominem.

I've never seen the CR data or the test protocol so it's all a bit subjective for me. I get good mpg in both city and highway. You get bad mpg from fast hilly driving. It seems a bit obvious to me what the problems are.

Can you share the CR data and test info? Maybe I'll be able to see your point then.
hemophilic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2013, 10:24 PM   #4333
stevehnm
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 329526
Join Date: Aug 2012
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Ground Control
Vehicle:
2013 Impreza Spt cvt
Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hemophilic View Post
Ok so it was a bit ad hominem.

I've never seen the CR data or the test protocol so it's all a bit subjective for me. I get good mpg in both city and highway. You get bad mpg from fast hilly driving. It seems a bit obvious to me what the problems are.

Can you share the CR data and test info? Maybe I'll be able to see your point then.
Well, the data are in the first post here:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2477627

and the CR test procedure is at a constant 65 mph on a flat closed circuit of theirs. Since there is no acceleration/deceleration in their test, the mpg is pretty much as good as you can get at 65 mph. Again, it's "for comparison purposes only, your mileage may vary" so all this "well I get this or that mpg so you're right/wrong" is irrelevant. Everybody gets something different. The relevant thing is the difference between two controlled tests done by professionals. The surprising thing is that although there is a strong bias error of 6 mpg between the two tests, once that is taken away the random error is extremely small. In fact taking the other Subaru out of the list (justified due to the fact that the other vehicle being tested on the same equipment produced an outlier), the tightness of the other vehicles is incredible, as you can see in the above link.

Careful though - if you start thinking and talking (or typing) logically about this the hyenas will call you a troll!

stevehnm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2013, 02:50 AM   #4334
hemophilic
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 301213
Join Date: Nov 2011
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Raleigh, NC
Vehicle:
2012 Imp. Sp. Ltd.
Blue/Silver

Default

I don't have a subscription to CR to view that link.

Just to be sure I understand what you're saying, your claims are that:
- CR did an unbiased test on an Impreza Sedan with CVT on a closed loop flat course at 65 MPH and got 35 MPG.
- The Impreza is EPA rated at 36 MPG.
- Other vehicles with significantly lower EPA ratings had roughly equal CR test results.
- The EPA rating for Impreza should be significantly lower based on the performance of other cars in CRs test.

So now my questions are these:
What were the CR ratings of competitive class cars like Mazda3, Corolla, Focus, Civic, and Elantra?
What were the CR ratings of other CVT equipped vehicles like Outback and Versa?
Are most vehicles simliarly efficient at 65MPH? And if so, is it the city efficiency that kills the EPA "highway" numbers for the cars with lower EPA ratings?
Why hasn't the government taken money away from owners of cars with UNDERESTIMATED EPA ratings and given it to the automakers since they've obviously been saving an enormous amount of money at the automakers expense (:stick in your eye: jk)?

I've been able to meet or exceed (by no more than 10%) EPA ratings at 65 mph across all cars I've owned without effort. My Impreza experience follows the precedent. My cruise control 50 mile highway run at 65 MPH with over 10K on the odometer showed 39 point something MPG on the computer. It has never been over-optimistic by more than 2 MPG. Maybe I got a good one.

I'll back up my claim that there's nothing wrong with Impreza with an unbiased source:
http://www.mpgomatic.com/2012/07/19/...-sport-review/
hemophilic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2013, 08:53 AM   #4335
stevehnm
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 329526
Join Date: Aug 2012
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Ground Control
Vehicle:
2013 Impreza Spt cvt
Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hemophilic View Post
I'll back up my claim that there's nothing wrong with Impreza with an unbiased source:
http://www.mpgomatic.com/2012/07/19/...-sport-review/
Why don't you look at mpgomatic's results of the other cars you listed and compare them with their own EPA highway estimates? You have to compare them with their estimates though. Then you'll have something to back up.

For example, the Impreza got 36.9 mpg at 68 mph. 36.9 divided by 36 = 1.025, or 2.5% better than Subaru claims the Impreza got on the EPA '08 test procedure.

What are the percentages of the other cars you listed?

Here are the EPA ratings:
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/download.shtml
stevehnm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2013, 09:30 AM   #4336
Zeeper
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 299286
Join Date: Oct 2011
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Upstate NY
Vehicle:
2015 WRX CVT
White

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post
the Impreza got 36.9 mpg at 68 mph.
Professional drivers tested the Impreza CVT and it yielded 36.9 mpg @68mph

The EPA rates it at 36mpg highway.

So the car exceeds the EPA rating, in independent professional testing, and you are still complaining and equivocating...

LOL
Zeeper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2013, 11:46 AM   #4337
robbthundr
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 347277
Join Date: Feb 2013
Default

Not sure if this would add or detract to the endless debate but has anyone heard of automatic? Www.automatic.com

I don't work for them but I've preordered mine (I like geek tech) and essentially among other things it'll assess your driving habits. Does other stuff like read error codes and tells you where the car is parked and advanced trip computer stuff. I can't vouch for it but I am definitely intrigued, iphone only at this time and plugs into your obd port.

FYI I'm not a car minded guy so this sort of stuff appeals to me.
robbthundr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2013, 12:28 PM   #4338
G2Spfld
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 354284
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Midwest
Vehicle:
2013 Imp Sport CVT
SWP

Default

Somebody spiked the Kool-aid!!!

Last edited by G2Spfld; 06-03-2013 at 01:14 PM.
G2Spfld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2013, 12:33 PM   #4339
Angelus911
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 89967
Join Date: Jun 2005
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: MA
Vehicle:
2012 Impreza Sport
DGM

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by robbthundr View Post
Not sure if this would add or detract to the endless debate but has anyone heard of automatic? Www.automatic.com

I don't work for them but I've preordered mine (I like geek tech) and essentially among other things it'll assess your driving habits. Does other stuff like read error codes and tells you where the car is parked and advanced trip computer stuff. I can't vouch for it but I am definitely intrigued, iphone only at this time and plugs into your obd port.

FYI I'm not a car minded guy so this sort of stuff appeals to me.
I pre-ordered that too, I know there are cheaper android versions you can get out there, but this seemed like a good app + obd combo for iOS. Hopefully should be mine sometime this month
Angelus911 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2013, 02:17 PM   #4340
nubsub
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 313575
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SF Bay Area, CA
Vehicle:
2012 Impreza 2.0i HB

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hemophilic View Post
I don't have a subscription to CR to view that link.
So now my questions are these:
What were the CR ratings of competitive class cars like Mazda3, Corolla, Focus, Civic, and Elantra?
What were the CR ratings of other CVT equipped vehicles like Outback and Versa?
Steve -

can you assist with this since you have a subscription? based on my own experience, i have little doubt that the Civic and Corolla will be exceeding the EPA estimates by the CR tests.

but these are the numbers of relevance to most people on this forum. most people choosing or not choosing the Impreza would be comparing it to other small cars with their posted EPA estimates.
nubsub is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2013, 02:29 PM   #4341
Zeeper
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 299286
Join Date: Oct 2011
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Upstate NY
Vehicle:
2015 WRX CVT
White

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by robbthundr View Post
Not sure if this would add or detract to the endless debate but has anyone heard of automatic? Www.automatic.com

FYI I'm not a car minded guy so this sort of stuff appeals to me.
You already lost Stevenhnm, this is on the front page of Automatic.com:

"Speeding: Highway speeding may not save you much time, but driving 10 MPH over the speed limit reduces fuel efficiency by 12-15%."

Now he has to whip out extra spreadsheets to show you how wrong that statement is...

Personally, I looked over the site, it looks like a cool device, but I think it would be worth the money only if I was driving an older car that was kicking out engine codes that needed attention. As a device just to tell me to watch my driving technique, the Subaru already has gauges that I mostly ignore. I know when I am beating the car a bit that mpg's drop, and when I am driving normally I am getting pretty good mpg's. It is nice to know that smartphones will allow you to translate engine codes though, and I will certainly buy a program like this in the future well out of warranty (when stuff starts to happen...)

Last edited by Zeeper; 06-03-2013 at 02:36 PM.
Zeeper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2013, 07:54 PM   #4342
hemophilic
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 301213
Join Date: Nov 2011
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Raleigh, NC
Vehicle:
2012 Imp. Sp. Ltd.
Blue/Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post

Why don't you look at mpgomatic's results of the other cars you listed and compare them with their own EPA highway estimates? You have to compare them with their estimates though. Then you'll have something to back up.
I'll dig those up on mpgomatic. Are you able to find them on CR?
hemophilic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 01:25 AM   #4343
hemophilic
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 301213
Join Date: Nov 2011
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Raleigh, NC
Vehicle:
2012 Imp. Sp. Ltd.
Blue/Silver

Default

http://www.mpgomatic.com/2012/02/18/...-coupe-review/
http://www.mpgomatic.com/2011/12/28/...chback-review/
http://www.mpgomatic.com/2012/01/10/...yactiv-review/
http://www.mpgomatic.com/2011/08/27/...lantra-review/
http://www.mpgomatic.com/2008/08/16/...orolla-review/

Model - EPA city/hwy/comb/fe.gov_useravg - MPGOM hwy/comb/Cruise-on-68mph/Cruise-off-60-72mph - MPGOM vs EPA hwy % diff
2012 Subaru Impreza Sport Limited -- EPA 27/36/30/29.4 - MPGOM 38.1/31.9/36.6/40.8 - 5.8%
2012 Ford Focus Titanium HB -------- EPA 27/37/31/31.3 - MPGOM 39.2/31.3/39.2/40.3 - 5.9%
2009 Toyota Corolla XLE ------------ EPA 27/35/30/33.4 - MPGOM 40.3/35.2/unav/unav - 15.1%
2011 Hyundai Elantra Limited Sedan - EPA 28/38/32/30.5 - MPGOM 40.5/36.4/39.9/41.2 - 6.6%
2012 Honda Civic EX Coupe --------- EPA 28/39/32/33.8 - MPGOM 43.1/35.1/41.9/44.6 - 10.5%
2012 Mazda 3 Grand Touring Sedan -- EPA 28/40/33/35.7 - MPGOM 45.1/35.8/44.3/45.9 - 12.8%

Last edited by hemophilic; 06-04-2013 at 01:44 AM. Reason: Ordered by MPGOM highway results, added hwy% diff
hemophilic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 02:22 AM   #4344
stevehnm
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 329526
Join Date: Aug 2012
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Ground Control
Vehicle:
2013 Impreza Spt cvt
Silver

Default

Model_______CR Hwy_____EPA Hwy_____% Diff
Impreza CVT___35__________36__________-3
Focus SE______43__________38_________+13
Civic Sedan SI__39__________31__________+26
Mazda3 (Avg of 4)_34.25_______30__________+14
Corolla________38___________35___________+9
stevehnm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 05:19 AM   #4345
jsteg
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 329271
Join Date: Aug 2012
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Lady's Island, SC
Vehicle:
2012 Impreza Limited
Ice Silver Metallic

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post
Model_______CR Hwy_____EPA Hwy_____% Diff
Impreza CVT___35__________36__________-3
Focus SE______43__________38_________+13
Civic Sedan SI__39__________31__________+26
Mazda3 (Avg of 4)_34.25_______30__________+14
Corolla________38___________35___________+9
Your math is TERRIBLE!!!!

Using your numbers the difference for the civic is +20.6% corolla is +7.9% and the Mazda is +12.4%!!! You should try a calculator instead of trying to do them in your head!
jsteg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 08:44 AM   #4346
hemophilic
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 301213
Join Date: Nov 2011
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Raleigh, NC
Vehicle:
2012 Imp. Sp. Ltd.
Blue/Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevehnm View Post
Model_______CR Hwy_____EPA Hwy_____% Diff
Impreza CVT___35__________36__________-3
Focus SE______43__________38_________+13
Civic Sedan SI__39__________31__________+26
Mazda3 (Avg of 4)_34.25_______30__________+14
Corolla________38___________35___________+9
A civic si gets 39 mpg at 65mph? Wowzers.
What Mazda 3 gets 30 mpg hwy? I thought even the fast ones did better.
hemophilic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 09:18 AM   #4347
pxpaulx
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 306218
Join Date: Jan 2012
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Twin Cities, MN
Vehicle:
2012 Impreza CVT
DarK Grey Met. Sport Prem

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsteg View Post
Your math is TERRIBLE!!!!

Using your numbers the difference for the civic is +20.6% corolla is +7.9% and the Mazda is +12.4%!!! You should try a calculator instead of trying to do them in your head!
No it isn't, you're doing the calculation wrong (or, rather, backwards).

Example:

If the baseline were 100 (or mpg number), then increasing to 125 is a 25% increase.

You are doing the reverse calculation - if the baseline (or mpg number) is 125, then going down 100 is only a 20% decrease.

So you are doing 31 divided by 39, when you should be doing 39 divided by 31.

Haven't posted here in quite awhile but occasionally stop in to read the ridiculousness of this thread - but I can let someone calling their intelligence terrible go unanswered!

Oh and to be relevant to the thread, my take is still (after 17K miles): short trips absolutely kill this car's mpg. And having owned close to a dozen different vehicles (all of which I've averaged close to the epa highway estimates in all-around driving) it is a problem that is completely unique to this car.

Last edited by pxpaulx; 06-04-2013 at 09:25 AM.
pxpaulx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 09:31 AM   #4348
stevehnm
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 329526
Join Date: Aug 2012
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Ground Control
Vehicle:
2013 Impreza Spt cvt
Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hemophilic View Post
A civic si gets 39 mpg at 65mph? Wowzers.
What Mazda 3 gets 30 mpg hwy? I thought even the fast ones did better.
The Mazda3's were averaged - and I missed one. The actual averages of the 5 were CU 38 EPA 32 - Average 19% better.


40 33 21%
34 25 36%
39 33 18%
43 40 8%
34 29 17%
38 32 19%

Average is the bottom line.

Gotta run right now - Work calls!
stevehnm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 12:08 PM   #4349
hemophilic
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 301213
Join Date: Nov 2011
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Raleigh, NC
Vehicle:
2012 Imp. Sp. Ltd.
Blue/Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pxpaulx View Post
Oh and to be relevant to the thread, my take is still (after 17K miles): short trips absolutely kill this car's mpg. And having owned close to a dozen different vehicles (all of which I've averaged close to the epa highway estimates in all-around driving) it is a problem that is completely unique to this car.
Notice the MPGOM combined numbers. Focus and Imp are down a bit from the others. Wondering why...
hemophilic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2013, 12:56 PM   #4350
flyboy1100
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 314216
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: ND
Vehicle:
2012 2.0i Sport 5MT
DGM

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pxpaulx View Post

No it isn't, you're doing the calculation wrong (or, rather, backwards).

Example:

If the baseline were 100 (or mpg number), then increasing to 125 is a 25% increase.

You are doing the reverse calculation - if the baseline (or mpg number) is 125, then going down 100 is only a 20% decrease.

So you are doing 31 divided by 39, when you should be doing 39 divided by 31.

Haven't posted here in quite awhile but occasionally stop in to read the ridiculousness of this thread - but I can let someone calling their intelligence terrible go unanswered!

Oh and to be relevant to the thread, my take is still (after 17K miles): short trips absolutely kill this car's mpg. And having owned close to a dozen different vehicles (all of which I've averaged close to the epa highway estimates in all-around driving) it is a problem that is completely unique to this car.
It isn't unique to this car, in my Buick any short trips killed the overall mpg, even only 10% of the tank and I would be at the city mpg rather than closer to highway like would be expected
flyboy1100 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New Impreza owner, low mpg? stuffedcabbage Newbies & FAQs 34 09-25-2012 11:10 PM
2012 Impreza Reviewed - Whytecliff to Seymour brendan_mac Vancouver Impreza Club Forum -- VIC 16 12-23-2011 02:12 PM
NJ Impreza owners - sighting Dan G General Forum Archive 76 10-06-2000 01:24 AM
Md or Va Impreza owners - I have an Impreza related question. Snoopy General Forum Archive 1 06-05-2000 09:08 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:16 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.