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Old 10-16-2012, 03:43 PM   #26
zpeedd3mon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SP2Flip View Post
I haven't heard that you could only use tach signal in manual mode. What model Viper do you have?
As far as the neutral safety goes if you hook it up correctly the car would not remote start even in the automatic transmission mode. Only a few manufactures actually have a neutral safety wire on their manual transmission vehicles so it is nice that Subaru does actually have one. You are correct about the neutral safety wire. The neutral safety wire will either be grounded when the car is in neutral or it will go to ground once you take it out of neutral. However you should check the wire using DC voltage on your meter. I believe the wire will show 12v (IGN key on) when the car is in neutral and will go to 0v when you put it in gear. If it does this you should hook the wire to the hood pin switch. The remote start will think the hood is open and will not remote start when you are in gear.
As far as the clutch bypass goes. Take a multimeter and set it to check resistance(ohms)...also make sure the car is off. Probe both wires coming off the clutch switch. You should get an open circuit. Once you push the clutch in the circuit should short. So by hooking up 30 to one wire and 87 to the other you will be exactly reproducing what the clutch switch actually does and not have to worry about what wire needs to be hooked up and what polarity it needs to be.
As far as the tach learn you should verify that the remote start is set to tach learn in the menu and you should also check to see if your tach source is viable. The idatalink is a great module to have, but sometimes I have found that it does not work 100%. To check the tach wire you should set the multimeter to AC volts and probe the tach output wire while the car is running. You should get at least 1.5 volts ac it will usually fluctuate when you push the gas pedal and raise the RPMs.
LMK the model Viper you have and I will look at the installation instructions so I can help you get this sorted. Good luck man.
Thank you for taking time to help me out! I really appreciate it.

So in a sense then I should be able to hook up the neutral safety wire, put the remote start in automatic mode, and it should work without having to worry someone left it in gear? I like that thought better than doing a sequence every time I get out.

I have the viper 5901 remote start/security module 2-way.

➢ Virtual tach
Note: Virtual Tach cannot be used in MTS Manual Transmission Mode.

So with the clutch bypass the pins should look like so?

Pin 85 on relay 12v constant
Pin 86 on relay to orange on 12 pin harness from remote start box
Pin 87 on relay to clutch wire A
Pin 30 on relay to clutch wire B
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Old 10-16-2012, 08:05 PM   #27
SP2Flip
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No problem brotha! You are correct on using the neutral safety wire. If you leave the car in gear it will not remote start.
As far as the "virtual tach", I would not use this setting. Instead use the"tachometer" setting opt 4. It is in the 3rd menu (pg. 43) in your install manual. By choosing this option you will be able to learn your tach signal. Virtual tach senses voltage from your charging system to know when to stop cranking. The regular tach (opt 4) is a much better option IMHO.
On the clutch bypass relay, I would change pin 86 to the violet wire from the remote start on the 5 pin harness [pg 12 (remote start input harness)]. That way the clutch is only bypassed when the engine is cranking via the remote start. All the other wires on the clutch bypass relay is correct.
Also, don't forget this car has a 2nd IGN that needs to be energized during remote start. Looking at your original post it looks as if you may not have hooked it up. Since you are using your FLEX wire pink/white from the remote start for the 2nd starter, you will have to wire up an external relay to power up the 2nd IGN wire. The 2nd IGN wire should be a blue wire in the ignition harness. On your relay wire 85 and 30 to +, 86 to the pink wire on the 5 pin remote start input harness(remote start), and 87 to the blue ignition wire in the ignition harness.
Hope this helps!

Last edited by SP2Flip; 10-16-2012 at 08:42 PM.
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Old 10-16-2012, 10:49 PM   #28
zpeedd3mon
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Ok, so I flip flopped the clutch bypass harness and looked over everything. Looking at the flcan the light is always off. After programming it with a long green it doesn't ever do anything after that.

Diagnostics on flash logics site say
"No flash while remote start = invalid ground when running status from remote starter." That wire is in the d2d harness though to the viper brain so is this testable?

Thoughts?
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Old 10-16-2012, 11:27 PM   #29
SP2Flip
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zpeedd3mon View Post
Ok, so I flip flopped the clutch bypass harness and looked over everything. Looking at the flcan the light is always off. After programming it with a long green it doesn't ever do anything after that.

Diagnostics on flash logics site say
"No flash while remote start = invalid ground when running status from remote starter." That wire is in the d2d harness though to the viper brain so is this testable?

Thoughts?
I always take that d2d harness and throw it in the trash as I heard there were a lot of issues with it. I opt to use the 3 wire hardwire plug instead, it should have a red, black, and blue/white wire. You will hook up the ground and 12v constant from the idata module and the blue/white wire from the idata module will go to the blue wire (status output) on the remote start auxiliary output harness (5pin plug). Try that and see if that will program for you.
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Old 10-17-2012, 12:43 AM   #30
zpeedd3mon
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The same blue wire that goes to the immobilizer bypass 556uw? Gah,
What a pain. I thought the whole point of the flcan was not to hook up all the wires. Hmm, worth the 100 I paid... Probably not.
Ok, I'll try the hardwire route to the flcan and report back.
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Old 10-17-2012, 01:05 AM   #31
SP2Flip
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Yup...the same one brotha, or you can also use the blue/white 2nd status output wire on the 5 pin remote start input harness.
I feel ya on the FLCAN, they are awesome if you have to bypass an immobilizer though, but probably not worth even using in your situation. It does keep you from having to do a lot of in car wiring though.
Hope you get it sorted.
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Old 10-17-2012, 08:21 AM   #32
kevosti
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Are you guys using the starter kill relay / anti grind when wiring 12v to starter 1? This is in a CM6000 compustar
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Old 10-17-2012, 08:42 AM   #33
SP2Flip
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Originally Posted by kevosti View Post
Are you guys using the starter kill relay / anti grind when wiring 12v to starter 1? This is in a CM6000 compustar
I use them if they are built into the remote start, but only wire them in at the customers request if the remote starter doesn't have a built in anti-grind relay. The Compustars have an external starter disable relay on them so I would use it, just one extra connection....btw love the Compustars!
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Old 10-17-2012, 12:16 PM   #34
kevosti
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I am going to use an idatalink blade-al for my convenience features such as door lock, ebrake, etc. Should I still hook an analog connection up to the neutral safety switch in series with something such as the hood pin latch?
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Old 10-17-2012, 12:47 PM   #35
SP2Flip
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevosti View Post
I am going to use an idatalink blade-al for my convenience features such as door lock, ebrake, etc. Should I still hook an analog connection up to the neutral safety switch in series with something such as the hood pin latch?
I would definitely do that just for extra safety, can't have too many.
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Old 10-17-2012, 10:16 PM   #36
zpeedd3mon
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So here's the update:

Went thru everything again and realized I had missed a vital large gauge red wire. I tied it into the red/white and red/black wires that are all getting 12v positive. Felt like an idiot. Bummed out though because that didn't seem to make any difference.

The remote start doesn't make any noises when I hit the remote until it gives me the diagnostics. I try it with the brake pressed and it will give 5 clicks "brake wire shutdown"

I haven't yet gone through the hardwire process. When I do though for the door lock and unlock/arm disarm, do I need to hook up just the lock unlock or do I need to tie all the arm/disarm from the remote start unit in as well with diodes?

I've been scouring the web trying to figure out where the flcan gets its "ground when running" from the r.s. unit. Since it is an input where does the r.s. get this signal from? I am wondering if there is a wire I am missing on that end. The D2D harness seems to be working since it delivers everything else like door locks.

This is driving me nuts but if all else goes to crap I'm going to pull everything out and start fresh.

All the input is much appreciated!
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Old 10-17-2012, 10:28 PM   #37
SP2Flip
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Did you change to the tach mode and did you get the tach to learn?
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Old 10-18-2012, 12:56 AM   #38
zpeedd3mon
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Originally Posted by SP2Flip View Post
Did you change to the tach mode and did you get the tach to learn?
Yep and it still didn't work. I've tried it programmed to automatic and virtual tach as well as tach and nothing. Even if the tach wasn't even hooked up though the car should start then die right?

I also tried unhooking the flcan because as of right now I have the brake shutdown, neutral safety, clutch, all main ignition wires all hard wired along with the bypass so in theory it should Atleast try to crank right now? Well it didn't. Doesn't even try. Just sends signal, receives signal, then 8 clicks.
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Old 10-18-2012, 01:24 AM   #39
jegomes
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Just a quick question.. is the toggle switch plugged in and switched on? IIRC 8 flashes is neutral safety shutdown.. so the switch or ebrake is at fault
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Old 10-18-2012, 12:20 PM   #40
zpeedd3mon
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Originally Posted by jegomes View Post
Just a quick question.. is the toggle switch plugged in and switched on? IIRC 8 flashes is neutral safety shutdown.. so the switch or ebrake is at fault
Hahahahaha..... ummm. nope. For some reason I thought this toggle was an optional thing. I had a security system put in an older vehicle years ago and they just left that toggle switch in the box. Derrrrr!! Newb mistake here.

Well, the good news is that moved things forward! Plugged that in, flipped it on, and remote started.. vwalla!!! Dash turned on, all lights came on, everything functioned except it didn't start. Tried 3 times and then shuts off. I put my key next to the starter and bam! It all started up! Whoop, whoop!!

Now I just have to figure out why the bypass 556uw isn't working. I double checked all wires last night but didn't have a chance to check it all. Is this correct?:

556uw - viper 5901
blue - blue status
pink - pink ignition wire (heavy gauge)
red - 12+ constant
black - ground

I have the ring looped around the cylinder just inside of the trim bezel.

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU for all the help. I feel so dumb for missing such an easy thing. Now just to finish the bypass module and it'll be done!
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Old 10-18-2012, 12:54 PM   #41
jegomes
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On the 556 you only need blue, black, and red. Subarus only check for IMO at start so loose the pink and you should be good
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Old 10-18-2012, 01:23 PM   #42
zpeedd3mon
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Originally Posted by jegomes View Post
On the 556 you only need blue, black, and red. Subarus only check for IMO at start so loose the pink and you should be good
So will the pink wire really mess much up then even if it is hooked up?
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Old 10-18-2012, 01:36 PM   #43
jegomes
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With bypasses I never hook up anything I don't need.. makes troubleshooting way easier.. IIRC pink is ignition sensing and will shut the bypass down.. just lose it, you don't need it
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Old 10-18-2012, 03:57 PM   #44
zpeedd3mon
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With bypasses I never hook up anything I don't need.. makes troubleshooting way easier.. IIRC pink is ignition sensing and will shut the bypass down.. just lose it, you don't need it
Hmm, well I snipped the pink wire and doesn't seem to change the problem. When I get home I'll meter everything to make sure we are getting a pulse from the blue wire from remote start.

I also need to double check my clutch relay since it doesn't seem to be doing the job.
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Old 10-18-2012, 04:29 PM   #45
jegomes
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To test if its just the bypass try holding the key up to the cylinder sideways.. do no insert it in to the cylinder.. I usually hold the plastic part flat against the cylinder... as far as the clutch bypass its pretty simple.. there are two switches on the clutch one that switches as soon as you touch the clutch (for cruise control) and the second one one where the clutch has to be all the way down and that's the golden one... it has two wire tap into each in one will go to 30 and the other to 87 on the relay... doesn't matter which one they can flip flop... then 12v ignition to 85 and the purple 2nd starter output ( negative) to 86..
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Old 10-18-2012, 04:32 PM   #46
jegomes
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Lol just a quick question... is all this trouble worth the 230 in labor you saved by doing it your self? Lol.. just playing but the real bummer is that you have no warranty... on the upside you will have intimate knowledge of your car.. lol
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Old 10-18-2012, 05:24 PM   #47
zpeedd3mon
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Lol just a quick question... is all this trouble worth the 230 in labor you saved by doing it your self? Lol.. just playing but the real bummer is that you have no warranty... on the upside you will have intimate knowledge of your car.. lol
well since its a manual I got quotes from 2 shops for labor - $650 and $550.... seemed a little ridiculous and since I'd done a few about 4 years ago I'd figured I'd give it a shot. I understand I don't have a warranty to go with the install but I do like the fact that I am getting a lot more familiar and intimate with my car.

I already tested the 556uw with the key just next to the cylinder and the car will start but with just the 556uw ring it does recognize it.

Since I'm at work right now I cant test with my meters so when I get home this evening I'll double check wires and hopefully get it sorted. So close!!
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Old 10-18-2012, 05:29 PM   #48
jegomes
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Holy cow.. crazy high quotes... I would charge about 265.. 200 for base alarm remote start 30 for flcan install and 30 for clutch bypass.. lol I should move to where ever you live..

OK so this will be my last silly question... do you have a spare key in the 556.. and the wire ring around the IMO antenna at the cylinder?
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Old 10-18-2012, 05:47 PM   #49
zpeedd3mon
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Holy cow.. crazy high quotes... I would charge about 265.. 200 for base alarm remote start 30 for flcan install and 30 for clutch bypass.. lol I should move to where ever you live..

OK so this will be my last silly question... do you have a spare key in the 556.. and the wire ring around the IMO antenna at the cylinder?
Seattle, WA. Head on out!

Affirmative - Spare key (had to get one lasered and programmed. Tested as a normal key and worked perfect.) I do have the wire wring around the cylinder itself. Is the IMO antenna in the white casing around the cylinder?
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Old 10-18-2012, 05:56 PM   #50
jegomes
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I want to say its encased in black plastic... the piece that actually sticks out from the key cylinder.. once you get your meter I would just check that it has good constant 12v, and ground at the 556.. and that the blue wire goes to ground and stays there during remote start
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